Guild Hierarchy

Hion · 05-19-2008, 09:53 PM

This was touched on in another thread but maybe this will help FKD since he is the man with the master plan...well hopefully I am not stepping on his toes. I guess this is to share how WoW is setup and some other guilds/LS base their hierchy or setup on. Which most of them seem to work. This thread could also serve as a place where people could post their interest to help AoC TG run smoothly.

Guild Master/Leader>

Council Members>

Recruiting Officer>

Class Officers/Sqd Leaders>

Tactics/Strategy Officer>

Team Leaders/Profession Leaders>

Any ideas or comments regarding this thread...please blow it up...hehe

SharinganTH1422 · 05-20-2008, 07:43 AM

I think it's great we have someone that was so involved with WoW to help get this stuff on track. However, I don't know if we're quite big enough yet to put that all together right now, obviously, but I think that's an excellent basis, for example, we can get a leader, perhaps a couple council members to advise the Leader, and maybe have one of these 2 council guys being head of recruitment, and the other in charge of, let's say, organising the building of the city, with the leader just checking those 2 jobs are being done correctly, and also sorting out other issues like organising the guild...

As more people join on to this game, these positions can get filled gradually as when the leader deems it's necessary.

TheFatKidDeath · 05-20-2008, 12:39 PM

Good stuff Hion. I've started to think about this subject and any input is always helpful. Please keep suggetsions coming. I'd like for us to play a bit then start to iron out more of the details.

Hion · 05-20-2008, 02:11 PM

Yeah I know that play time is needed as well as level requirements and player count. My game should arrive soon so I can hop on and get you all on my friends list and get this party started. I am always happy to help out in any way.

Hion · 05-20-2008, 03:02 PM

So in an effort to be a nerd and to show you an image of how this hierchy is laid out I have come up with this:

SharinganTH1422 · 05-20-2008, 03:49 PM

Excellent post, that does very much make things clear for those of us who aren't familiar with this system fully. Nice job Hion.

Hion · 05-20-2008, 05:09 PM

Btw the guild liaison can work in two ways...

1. Act as a medium for content news like creating a newsletter or spotlighting areas/toons within the game - this is more advanced in the creation of a guild and can help others get familiar with the guild and keep people interested.

2. In game liaison that keeps contacts with other guilds like a networking professional. Can build alliances, discuss possible battles and coordinate projects with other guilds.

Like I said in number 1 this role is pretty advanced but nonetheless I like talking about this kind of stuff.

Just remember you can tell me to shut up at anytime...lol!!

**Real_CaGeD** · 05-21-2008, 06:00 AM

Hey guys, Caged is a SOLDIER of the GUILD!

Crimmeria-Guardian-Pole Arms specialist.

SharinganTH1422 · 05-21-2008, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hion

Btw the guild liaison can work in two ways...

1. Act as a medium for content news like creating a newsletter or spotlighting areas/toons within the game - this is more advanced in the creation of a guild and can help others get familiar with the guild and keep people interested.

2. In game liaison that keeps contacts with other guilds like a networking professional. Can build alliances, discuss possible battles and coordinate projects with other guilds.

Yh, I was actually going to ask about the Guild liaison, but I thought it was going to be like the point of communication for certain parts of the guild to contact other parts...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hion

Like I said in number 1 this role is pretty advanced but nonetheless I like talking about this kind of stuff.

Just remember you can tell me to shut up at anytime...lol!!

Actually this is really useful and interesting stuff, I'm pretty sure this is giving FKD a lot of good ideas.

**Gambit7** · 05-21-2008, 12:22 PM

Ok... Hierarchy is spelled like I just spelt it btw.

I'm a fan of hierarchies if people approach it from a fun/RP type stance... if they look at it as a "metagame" of sorts. We had a similar structure in SWG and had a lot of fun with it, because people took it and ran with it w/o using it as a power play. It was also democratic and people had to "campaign" for your support so to speak. Generally, the best person for the job had the post they were best at... regardless of guild standing. It was a real Sandbox approach. We had a mayor, treasurer, military general, intelligence, class leaders, etc... along with the professions.

Now, in games like WoW though I tend to shy away from political structures. Having a guild leader and class officers to me is more than enough. Things get kinda "muddy" when you start getting fancy, making it more likely to create friction. Recruitment should be able to be done by ALL guildies, but obviously the officers should be the only ones with ginvite capability. I think in WoW we ended up with TWO class officers for every class, right Hion? This way, if one couldnt make meetings and/or important raids the other could. As well, they could each report how each class is developing as it's REALLY tough for one person to keep an eye on everyone. I know the Mages in WoW formed their own "Council of Mages" (everyone was automatically in the council) and had the two "Ambassadors" report to guild meetings (we didnt want to have Class Leaders, and we voted for the Ambassadors) - this made it seem more democratic and didnt give any one person ultimate power... which eliminated the perception of favoritism or powermongering. It worked out EXTREMELY well and made sure everyone in the class was deeply involved and knew their fellow mages' needs intimately, especially as it related to loot (need/greed) and raid-time. It got to the point where we could literally TIME the appropriate drops within each raid and have a mage in place to receive the loot they needed, without an extravagant DKP system. It also made us more deadly in combat, since we knew eachother's strengths/weaknesses deeply.

Anyways, in a nutshell... I'm a supporter of Class Councils with Ambassadors/Senators that report to guild meetings. Beyond that:

-Guild Leader (in a very democratic sense)
-Raid Leaders (you need MANY of these... anyone can step up and be a raid leader at any time btw)
-PvP Leaders (ditto with above)... but in AoC is extremely important, as Siege Warfare is included with this
-Crafting Gurus (this really isnt a leadership position... more like just a position of stature)

Now, where all this gets sticky is AoC has guild cities. Having a guild city always breeds extravagant political structures. It might be something we'd want to try. But, it's by no means a necessity IMO and should only be done from a game "immersion" standpoint. From a practical ass-kicking standpoint, the raid, pvp, and class leaders run the show.

Hion, I like your flowchart there... but I guess I'd make the council be the class leaders and each class (or sub-class) have their own councils within (those who wish to have a voice) and perhaps have a military wing there for raid/pvp leaders, along with the crafting wing you've got there.

Hion · 05-21-2008, 01:34 PM

I need spell check and awesome reply gambit. Good to see that people are approaching this subject with some thought....woot!!

ruddysamurai · 05-22-2008, 12:01 AM

How will guild leaders be identified; by appointment or election? Once they are in place I think they should handle the creation of offices as our needs for them are identified. I agree that we don't need it to get too complicated. Head council members can double as war leaders, recruiters, craft leaders, etc while advising the guild leader and acting on his behalf on any task he sets them on. Two class leaders per class should be sufficient. A concern that I would like to see addressed is follow up or contact with members. I've been guilds where after joining no one ever attempted to help, advise, or contact me in any way. Sometimes the problem is time zone related. I've spent most of my time alone because my guildmates have logged off before I logged on. We may need class leaders divided into shifts so that any new member would be able to contact someone for help no matter when they play. The class leaders should follow up with members and ensure that they have the tools and knowledge they need to succeed. They are the best ones to handle the follow up with new recruits because they will have the best idea of what help each class will need. I think the class leaders should report regularly to the guild leader on the progress of new recruits.

**daithi1** · 05-22-2008, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruddysamurai

A concern that I would like to see addressed is follow up or contact with members. I've been guilds where after joining no one ever attempted to help, advise, or contact me in any way. Sometimes the problem is time zone related. I've spent most of my time alone because my guildmates have logged off before I logged on. We may need class leaders divided into shifts so that any new member would be able to contact someone for help no matter when they play. The class leaders should follow up with members and ensure that they have the tools and knowledge they need to succeed. They are the best ones to handle the follow up with new recruits because they will have the best idea of what help each class will need. I think the class leaders should report regularly to the guild leader on the progress of new recruits.

To help with issues of new members getting lost it should be requirement to have TeamSpeak on every time they play, every time.

http://www.tacticalgamer.com/teamspeak.php

**Augustus Gloop** · 05-22-2008, 09:48 AM

One bit of advice I'd like to pass along is the ginvite option should probably be widespread at first. People are trying out new classes and creating a bunch of new characters, and getting them into the guild is a real hassle when guild rank is attached to the character, not the player. The person or persons responsible need to switch back to their main to do it, or worse, might not be logged in.

**Gambit7** · 05-27-2008, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Augustus Gloop

One bit of advice I'd like to pass along is the ginvite option should probably be widespread at first. People are trying out new classes and creating a bunch of new characters, and getting them into the guild is a real hassle when guild rank is attached to the character, not the player. The person or persons responsible need to switch back to their main to do it, or worse, might not be logged in.

Already is pretty widespread. A lotta folk dont actually even know they have invite ability... LoL

05-19-2008, 09:53 PM	#1 (permalink)
Hion Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 128	Guild Hierarchy This was touched on in another thread but maybe this will help FKD since he is the man with the master plan...well hopefully I am not stepping on his toes. I guess this is to share how WoW is setup and some other guilds/LS base their hierchy or setup on. Which most of them seem to work. This thread could also serve as a place where people could post their interest to help AoC TG run smoothly. Guild Master/Leader> Council Members> Recruiting Officer> Class Officers/Sqd Leaders> Tactics/Strategy Officer> Team Leaders/Profession Leaders> Any ideas or comments regarding this thread...please blow it up...hehe __________________ AoC - Ars Tactika Guild Co-Leader Nast - 75 Priest of Mitra Hion - 6 Assassin WoW Anastacea - 70 Priest Hion - 70 Rogue (PVP) Caeden - 70 Mage (PVP) "10 Mana Pots - 100g, Flask of Mighty Restoration - 25g, repair bill - 23g...coming to a raid with the Dickens in mind...PRICELESS!!!" "Feel my radiance, you start to glow...you see my smites, let my holy damage go!!!" Last edited by Gambit7; 05-27-2008 at 12:18 PM.

05-20-2008, 07:43 AM	#2 (permalink)
SharinganTH1422 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: East London, England, UK Age: 19 Posts: 1,493	Re: Guild Hierchy I think it's great we have someone that was so involved with WoW to help get this stuff on track. However, I don't know if we're quite big enough yet to put that all together right now, obviously, but I think that's an excellent basis, for example, we can get a leader, perhaps a couple council members to advise the Leader, and maybe have one of these 2 council guys being head of recruitment, and the other in charge of, let's say, organising the building of the city, with the leader just checking those 2 jobs are being done correctly, and also sorting out other issues like organising the guild... As more people join on to this game, these positions can get filled gradually as when the leader deems it's necessary. __________________ Anger is a gift - Malcolm X ...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master, If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim; If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster And treat those two impostors just the same...

05-20-2008, 12:39 PM	#3 (permalink)
TheFatKidDeath Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Santa Monica, CA Age: 39 Posts: 2,705	Re: Guild Hierchy Good stuff Hion. I've started to think about this subject and any input is always helpful. Please keep suggetsions coming. I'd like for us to play a bit then start to iron out more of the details. __________________ \|TG-9th\| TheFatKidDeath "Born to Party, Forced to Work." http://www.theonion.com/content/node/55640 - Check me out on The Onion http://www.theonion.com/content/vide...ssfully_avoids - I'm on the local news!

05-20-2008, 02:11 PM	#4 (permalink)
Hion Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 128	Re: Guild Hierchy Yeah I know that play time is needed as well as level requirements and player count. My game should arrive soon so I can hop on and get you all on my friends list and get this party started. I am always happy to help out in any way. __________________ AoC - Ars Tactika Guild Co-Leader Nast - 75 Priest of Mitra Hion - 6 Assassin WoW Anastacea - 70 Priest Hion - 70 Rogue (PVP) Caeden - 70 Mage (PVP) "10 Mana Pots - 100g, Flask of Mighty Restoration - 25g, repair bill - 23g...coming to a raid with the Dickens in mind...PRICELESS!!!" "Feel my radiance, you start to glow...you see my smites, let my holy damage go!!!"

05-20-2008, 03:02 PM	#5 (permalink)
Hion Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 128	Re: Guild Hierchy So in an effort to be a nerd and to show you an image of how this hierchy is laid out I have come up with this: __________________ AoC - Ars Tactika Guild Co-Leader Nast - 75 Priest of Mitra Hion - 6 Assassin WoW Anastacea - 70 Priest Hion - 70 Rogue (PVP) Caeden - 70 Mage (PVP) "10 Mana Pots - 100g, Flask of Mighty Restoration - 25g, repair bill - 23g...coming to a raid with the Dickens in mind...PRICELESS!!!" "Feel my radiance, you start to glow...you see my smites, let my holy damage go!!!"

05-20-2008, 03:49 PM	#6 (permalink)
SharinganTH1422 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: East London, England, UK Age: 19 Posts: 1,493	Re: Guild Hierchy Excellent post, that does very much make things clear for those of us who aren't familiar with this system fully. Nice job Hion. __________________ Anger is a gift - Malcolm X ...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master, If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim; If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster And treat those two impostors just the same...

05-20-2008, 05:09 PM	#7 (permalink)
Hion Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 128	Re: Guild Hierchy Btw the guild liaison can work in two ways... 1. Act as a medium for content news like creating a newsletter or spotlighting areas/toons within the game - this is more advanced in the creation of a guild and can help others get familiar with the guild and keep people interested. 2. In game liaison that keeps contacts with other guilds like a networking professional. Can build alliances, discuss possible battles and coordinate projects with other guilds. Like I said in number 1 this role is pretty advanced but nonetheless I like talking about this kind of stuff. Just remember you can tell me to shut up at anytime...lol!! __________________ AoC - Ars Tactika Guild Co-Leader Nast - 75 Priest of Mitra Hion - 6 Assassin WoW Anastacea - 70 Priest Hion - 70 Rogue (PVP) Caeden - 70 Mage (PVP) "10 Mana Pots - 100g, Flask of Mighty Restoration - 25g, repair bill - 23g...coming to a raid with the Dickens in mind...PRICELESS!!!" "Feel my radiance, you start to glow...you see my smites, let my holy damage go!!!"

05-21-2008, 06:00 AM	#8 (permalink)
Real_CaGeD Join Date: Sep 2006 Age: 35 Posts: 48	Re: Guild Hierchy Hey guys, Caged is a SOLDIER of the GUILD! Crimmeria-Guardian-Pole Arms specialist.

05-21-2008, 12:22 PM	#10 (permalink)
Gambit7 Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Hollywood, FL Age: 32 Posts: 2,168	Re: Guild HIERARCHY Ok... Hierarchy is spelled like I just spelt it btw. I'm a fan of hierarchies if people approach it from a fun/RP type stance... if they look at it as a "metagame" of sorts. We had a similar structure in SWG and had a lot of fun with it, because people took it and ran with it w/o using it as a power play. It was also democratic and people had to "campaign" for your support so to speak. Generally, the best person for the job had the post they were best at... regardless of guild standing. It was a real Sandbox approach. We had a mayor, treasurer, military general, intelligence, class leaders, etc... along with the professions. Now, in games like WoW though I tend to shy away from political structures. Having a guild leader and class officers to me is more than enough. Things get kinda "muddy" when you start getting fancy, making it more likely to create friction. Recruitment should be able to be done by ALL guildies, but obviously the officers should be the only ones with ginvite capability. I think in WoW we ended up with TWO class officers for every class, right Hion? This way, if one couldnt make meetings and/or important raids the other could. As well, they could each report how each class is developing as it's REALLY tough for one person to keep an eye on everyone. I know the Mages in WoW formed their own "Council of Mages" (everyone was automatically in the council) and had the two "Ambassadors" report to guild meetings (we didnt want to have Class Leaders, and we voted for the Ambassadors) - this made it seem more democratic and didnt give any one person ultimate power... which eliminated the perception of favoritism or powermongering. It worked out EXTREMELY well and made sure everyone in the class was deeply involved and knew their fellow mages' needs intimately, especially as it related to loot (need/greed) and raid-time. It got to the point where we could literally TIME the appropriate drops within each raid and have a mage in place to receive the loot they needed, without an extravagant DKP system. It also made us more deadly in combat, since we knew eachother's strengths/weaknesses deeply. Anyways, in a nutshell... I'm a supporter of Class Councils with Ambassadors/Senators that report to guild meetings. Beyond that: -Guild Leader (in a very democratic sense) -Raid Leaders (you need MANY of these... anyone can step up and be a raid leader at any time btw) -PvP Leaders (ditto with above)... but in AoC is extremely important, as Siege Warfare is included with this -Crafting Gurus (this really isnt a leadership position... more like just a position of stature) Now, where all this gets sticky is AoC has guild cities. Having a guild city always breeds extravagant political structures. It might be something we'd want to try. But, it's by no means a necessity IMO and should only be done from a game "immersion" standpoint. From a practical ass-kicking standpoint, the raid, pvp, and class leaders run the show. Hion, I like your flowchart there... but I guess I'd make the council be the class leaders and each class (or sub-class) have their own councils within (those who wish to have a voice) and perhaps have a military wing there for raid/pvp leaders, along with the crafting wing you've got there. __________________

05-21-2008, 01:34 PM	#11 (permalink)
Hion Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 128	Re: Guild Hierchy I need spell check and awesome reply gambit. Good to see that people are approaching this subject with some thought....woot!! __________________ AoC - Ars Tactika Guild Co-Leader Nast - 75 Priest of Mitra Hion - 6 Assassin WoW Anastacea - 70 Priest Hion - 70 Rogue (PVP) Caeden - 70 Mage (PVP) "10 Mana Pots - 100g, Flask of Mighty Restoration - 25g, repair bill - 23g...coming to a raid with the Dickens in mind...PRICELESS!!!" "Feel my radiance, you start to glow...you see my smites, let my holy damage go!!!"

05-22-2008, 12:01 AM	#12 (permalink)
ruddysamurai Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 57	Re: Guild Hierchy How will guild leaders be identified; by appointment or election? Once they are in place I think they should handle the creation of offices as our needs for them are identified. I agree that we don't need it to get too complicated. Head council members can double as war leaders, recruiters, craft leaders, etc while advising the guild leader and acting on his behalf on any task he sets them on. Two class leaders per class should be sufficient. A concern that I would like to see addressed is follow up or contact with members. I've been guilds where after joining no one ever attempted to help, advise, or contact me in any way. Sometimes the problem is time zone related. I've spent most of my time alone because my guildmates have logged off before I logged on. We may need class leaders divided into shifts so that any new member would be able to contact someone for help no matter when they play. The class leaders should follow up with members and ensure that they have the tools and knowledge they need to succeed. They are the best ones to handle the follow up with new recruits because they will have the best idea of what help each class will need. I think the class leaders should report regularly to the guild leader on the progress of new recruits.

05-22-2008, 09:48 AM	#14 (permalink)
Augustus Gloop Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Gone for the weekend folks! Age: 32 Posts: 2,589	Re: Guild Hierchy One bit of advice I'd like to pass along is the ginvite option should probably be widespread at first. People are trying out new classes and creating a bunch of new characters, and getting them into the guild is a real hassle when guild rank is attached to the character, not the player. The person or persons responsible need to switch back to their main to do it, or worse, might not be logged in. __________________

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