Turbo

So after tonight I want to gauge the general concensus on the realism settings. Is this something you would like to use once a week or would you like to keep the kill messages on all the time?

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xTYBALTx

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Current good song: Justice - Stress

munchkin

The realism settings were great - they added to the tension, and prevented me from subcoming to the urge to use 'gamey' tactics. They also seemed to draw out a lot of players, and I'd like to see them on more often.

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Trooper

i think we should keep it that way all the time.....would get rid of some pubbies and it really makes you have to communicate to each other....i just wish you could see who you killed....i had about 15 kills on hospitol and NO TK's...


was fun...really enjoyed it

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that sounds like a good idea trooper.
-Vulcan

munchkin

Having the scoreboard locked and unavailable was interesting. Is there any way to make it unavailable to the players who are alive, but available to those who are dead?

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perry

Keep the scoreboard on, please. That was super annoying. Like, I didn't know Tybalt was playing until I quit at the end and saw who all was in TS. I know it pops up between rounds, but during that time we're usually talking about a plan or whatever and I don't think to look at it. You can still tell who's dead by looking at the kit selection screen... But who are you playing against? Since most of the guys on the defense team stayed in their channel between rounds, I had no clue who all I was playing against.

The lack of ammo count was no big deal. When we had it on, I noticed I'd reload after every enemy encounter whether I had 27 shots or 11 shots left. So it didn't really change my behavior. You get 6 magazines, so you can afford to reload often.

As for the kill messages.. not having them is more annoying than anything else.. "Turbo, you alive?" Don't get a response.. "Guess Turbo is dead." "Who all's alive still?" No response... "Oh crap, last man left." It would be absolutely miserable if we weren't all on TS, but then it'd be kinda sucky if we weren't on TS and messages were on.

The lack of messages takes some fun away from it too.. Did someone just own our entire team? Did that nade really take out 3 guys, or did some gunfire get em too? There didn't seem to be too many times where we couldn't tell if an enemy went down.. and when you do throw a nade in a room and get a kill, you're still cautious because you don't know if someone else was in there that didn't go down.

What made tonight's games good was the teamwork and communication. I think I mentioned it on text chat during Courtyard -- I'd be calling out enemies regardless of kill messages. It didn't really affect the way I played.

Trooper

and you lost that round for us.........dint you TK some people....cuase i know i dint....lol

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that sounds like a good idea trooper.
-Vulcan

perry

How's that CQB sniping working out for ya, Trooper?

Trooper

damn you.....i forgot which button was my pistol.....Tab instead of P.....alls i hear is laughing in my head set

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that sounds like a good idea trooper.
-Vulcan

munchkin

That was freaking hilarious. For those of you who weren't able to be there, let me tell the epic of A Tale of Two Snipers:

Trooper, being the regular killmonkey he is, was sitting happily on a ridge in Radio Tower, downing the enemy like flies. After a few uneventful minutes, he realised that our entire team ('cept for him) was dead, and so he went down into the tunnels to finish the objective.

He's almost at Bravo, ready to win the round for us, when he hears gunfire.
"Quick! Get to cover!" he thinks, and backs off into a sidetunnel.
...straight into the last remaining enemy sniper. Roars of laughter on TS, and Trooper is bewildered as to what has happened. But he still lives, and the epic duel begins! For some reason, the combatants are a foot away from each other, taking potshots with their goddarn sniper rifles. Sniper. Rifles. Long distance killy things, and they still miss. Finally, Trooper has to reload, but that's basically the same as suiciding. The pistol is the only option, except he's forgotten which key it is . Strangely enough, we lost the round.

Hehe, we love ya Troopie!

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Mirfee

I'm all for the realism settings.

Some of the high points for me are...
- No kill messages are a *good* thing. In the vein of a realistic tactical *sim* experience, you can't get that same info in real life. I like not knowing the outcome via a stat, and therefore relying on visual confirmation, body count, and communicating that intel among the team to gauge enemy condition. I realize that some people enjoy the kill confirmations, or reports of friendly deaths, but I feel it's very gamey compared to what the goals of the realism settings are for.
- No TS death report. I missed the restriction on this earlier and was corrected later on by Sloppy. I agree with it for further realism. It was deeply disconcerting to report on TS and be met with silence... as would be in life. This leads to realizing that a certain area was no longer covered and likely breached... really adrenaline pumping.
- No player stats / scoreboard. I can't say I noticed this... I look here for points tracking, but not for enemy intel anyway. But if people *do* use the scoreboard to determine how many enemies remain, then it should be set to prevent this practice. This is goes with my arguments in support of no kill/death messages.
- No ammo count. To be honest, I didn't notice this at all. I almost never look at the ammo in my gun. I learned a long time ago to do tactical reloads after every firefight. That said, I think this restriction is a given. The box mags in this game aren't see-through in real life. Can't count your rounds in the meat world, shouldn't be able to do that here either. But this is perhaps the one restriction with the least impact on gameplay when compared to the kill/death messages, etc that I already mentioned.

All in all, I think this is a terrific *option* for us to run. Note I stress option. I don't want to force players to play this way... it's just pushing the TG gameplay to the extreme limits within this game on occasion for those of us who crave something tougher. Personally, I favor the grittiest, most realistic, *simlike* experience from any game, and would happily play all games this way. So my vote would be to restrict as much as possible. But that's just my personal taste.

I'd be content with once a week for a while. Fridays seem like a good place to continue it.

Edited to elaborate on thoughts.

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Vulcan

The only problem i have with it is the fun factor. Alot less fun because noone really knows who did what until your dead and talk about it.

I think i like everything minus the scoreboard and death messages for all the time.

What i loved most was the participation. The communication could use a little work in some areas still.

All in all it was fun and i enjoyed it. I don't see it as a full time thing though untill people play more often to learn the maps.

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Mirfee

Please forgive me, Vulcan, for stating some things which I'm sure are plainly obvious (as evidenced by your sig ). It's for all who might share your feelings about the fun factor.

I think this option has potential for enormous fun, but it will end up being measured on a different gauge. I personally have no greater fun in game than when I'm working tightly with my team; planning, communicating, responding to each other's contacts or trouble. And all for the purpose of completing objectives.

This to me is the fulcrum upon which the fun of AA is acheived, and is perhaps the most extreme and accurate example of TG principles of gameplay. The game itself is designed to reward players the *least* for getting kills, and more for succeeding at completing objectives as a team. Killing targets is simply the means of overcoming resistance to the completion of your objective(s).

I don't wish to suggest that you or anyone else have to feel this way. Rather, I hope to encourage those players who are so far unaccustomed to the feel of this sort of realism gameplay, to keep giving it a try. The fun comes out of becoming a whole unit, and relying on each teammate in a whole new way. In my view, and I believe that of others who enjoy this style, the satisfaction of succeeding in the face of greater difficulty... it just doesn't get more fun than that.

Oh... afterthought... communication *does* need to get better. As does the need for sharper tactical maneuvering. But this was a new experience for many... for some the first time playing AA at all! So there's definitely an adjustment and learning period. But I'm confident that TG can accomplish all of that.

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Apophis

I loved it.. I love not having the death messages on there as someone can duck around a corner and you're not sure if you got him and he FELL around the corner or if he made it around alive. The mystery of real life combat is there. Sames goes with the scoreboard.

I think it would be alittle lame if we did this and only ended up using the ammo count restriction.

I like the US Army's idea of "realism" settings.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying "good doggie" while looking for a bigger stick.

Mirfee

Good point! Fog of war!

The fog of war is the lack of knowledge that occurs during a war. Most importantly, it refers to each side's uncertainty about the enemy's capabilities and plans, but it also includes the chaos that can occur in one's own forces, for instance when a unit misinterprets its orders, or takes a wrong turn and becomes lost.

Yep. Rather toothless actually.

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