camping = "tactical"?

[Hidus]

I was playing a fair bit on TG server 2 this weekend and was astounded at how much camping was going on. I'm not talking about moving from cover to cover, I'm talking about just sitting in a dark corner waiting all round waiting for someone to wander by. At the end of the round you get a couple guys just hiding in their respective corners waiting for the other guy to get bored first and pop his head out.

Now maybe it's realistic to hide in a dark corner all round and wait for someone to wander by - I wouldn't know, I've never been to war. What I do know is that it makes for some pretty poor gameplay. I do find the notion that this style of play is somehow more "tactical" amusing though. Anyone can sit in a corner, but it takes real teamwork and coordination to move together towards an objective.

What I want to know is this - is this extreme camping a product of the particular gamemode? Is it the ruleset in place? Is it the players?

[TG_Bubba]

It all depends. If you are defending the objective yu would want to stay hidden for that reason. I have noticed that some wait and hold back while the run and gunners flush out the bad guys. There is nothing set in stone about hiding. I see it as a disadvantage to the rest of the team if they are doing that if their side is suppose to be planting the bomb and they are not helping defend the bomb runner.

[Hidus]

Originally Posted by TG_Bubba

It all depends. If you are defending the objective yu would want to stay hidden for that reason. I have noticed that some wait and hold back while the run and gunners flush out the bad guys. There is nothing set in stone about hiding. I see it as a disadvantage to the rest of the team if they are doing that if their side is suppose to be planting the bomb and they are not helping defend the bomb runner.

The problem is there is really no motivation to pick up the bomb in the first place. In fact I don't know why people do it. It's just a giant "hey throw a nade over here" beacon. Better off just hiding in corners waiting until you have a significant man advantage then using the bomb to force the defenders to come out of their corners. I suppose you could try to use it as bait right off the bat but I have yet to see that level of coordination or communication on the server.

I guess I've just been spoiled by some of the other team oriented games here on TG and I was expecting a little more advanced tactics than just hiding in corners. Maybe it's just a matter of people getting more used to the game.

[L10N]

I think the two extremes of play style, camping and running and gunning are made much more viable in hardcore due to the power of weapons. I mean I remember a time when playing on vacant the other team planted the bomb so I ran over there killed a guy guarding the door and was able to easily spray down the two defenders in almost a second. could this have happened in normal mode? maybe but the two defenders probably would have taken me with them. everything gets so screwy in hardcore, I mean I want 30 and 2 in a round because I got set up with a m60(which is a one shot kill in hardcore) outside the spawn on that stupid missile silo map. Hidus is spot on with the bomb thing, with the marker on your head you are a nade spammers wet dream.

[thedogwarrior]

As much sense as camping makes, in certain maps like S&D, where you just wait for the unlucky bomb-carrier to hit your target, I hate to just sit and wait. You see a lot of camping out in the "wild" on other COD4 servers. Everyone coming through a doorway or alley.. BAM!

[Grunt 70]

I love playing defense, especially with one or two more guys to help defend. I try to get attack approaches covered and effective fire lanes set up. I'm not sure this is what you mean by camping but I'm not sitting in dark rooms away from the objective waiting to ambush...

I'm not so much a fan of the Sabotage mode. I'd like it better frankly if the big red "KILL" sign was disabled. I think you'd see more dynamic tactics in this mode.

Lets also remember we are dealing with lots of people coming and going, some with no TG experience at all and I'd have to say 95% of the COD community seems to be about r & g and racking up kills at any cost. The game play we want will take some time to evolve naturally. Give it some time is my request.

[Hidus]

Originally Posted by thedogwarrior

As much sense as camping makes, in certain maps like S&D, where you just wait for the unlucky bomb-carrier to hit your target, I hate to just sit and wait. You see a lot of camping out in the "wild" on other COD4 servers. Everyone coming through a doorway or alley.. BAM!

To me the hardcore camping style of play is like employing "the trap" in hockey. You can't argue with it's effectiveness but it kills all flow and makes for some pretty weak gameplay.

I hope that it's not a case of having to pick between wide open run and gun and extreme camping. There has got to be other options here. We've seen it in other games on TG.

[thedogwarrior]

I'd like to see HQ in the map rotation. Goals similar to flags in BF/POE/2142, done right could be very good.

[UnDeaD77]

Originally Posted by thedogwarrior

I'd like to see HQ in the map rotation. Goals similar to flags in BF/POE/2142, done right could be very good.

Server one has Dom/HQ/Sab in the rotation, and hardcore is off on this server. This server fits a few more peoples play style.

[jex]

I always go for the bomb if I can get it and enjoy moving on an objective to set it, or guard the the bomb runner. The TL Hardcore server I've been playing on has no respawns and kills must be done down the sights - makes for some great tactical play.

[UnDeaD77]

Originally Posted by jex

I always go for the bomb if I can get it and enjoy moving on an objective to set it, or guard the the bomb runner. The TL Hardcore server I've been playing on has no respawns and kills must be done down the sights - makes for some great tactical play.

I use my iron sights 90% of the time, but its really hard to enforce using it, especially in really close quarter situations. I'll fire from the hip within 10 meters of someone.

[Doctor.]

hardcore S&D is a campfest by nature it feels like swat 4 but minus allot of fun there are not enough tactical tools to really play this game mode the way I would want to thats just my opinion. That being said I'm sure someone could make a great tactical swat/military mod for cod4 that would kick butt big time the basic game play mechanics are there its just a matter of different maps and objectives being added and more tactical oriented tools (ie. Mirror Sights, snake camera's etc.)

[Vodkatonic]

Originally Posted by Hidus

I was playing a fair bit on TG server 2 this weekend and was astounded at how much camping was going on. I'm not talking about moving from cover to cover, I'm talking about just sitting in a dark corner waiting all round waiting for someone to wander by. At the end of the round you get a couple guys just hiding in their respective corners waiting for the other guy to get bored first and pop his head out.

Now maybe it's realistic to hide in a dark corner all round and wait for someone to wander by - I wouldn't know, I've never been to war. What I do know is that it makes for some pretty poor gameplay. I do find the notion that this style of play is somehow more "tactical" amusing though. Anyone can sit in a corner, but it takes real teamwork and coordination to move together towards an objective.

What I want to know is this - is this extreme camping a product of the particular gamemode? Is it the ruleset in place? Is it the players?

Like others said it depends on what your mission goal is. Defense or Offense........I'm gonna protect the bomb carrier or plant the bomb. If my job is to defend the bomb location. I will take up a location near the planting location and wait.

There's is plenty of "free for all" servers out there if that's what you are looking for.

[L10N]

there is a difference between defending an objective and sitting on some random corner waiting to one shot everyone with the ridiculous weapon balance of hardcore mode.

[TG_Bubba]

Changes are coming this week that will make the sides a little more even in weapons penetration etc. Look for the changes Thursday afternoon/night. I will post a thread on the changes in the next couple of days.