Suicide Choppers on Kerch

Lucky Shot · 12-15-2007, 01:57 AM

Last night my squad was on the receiving end of two different events that could be considered suicide choppers. Both involved a pilot crashing their helicopter into an enemy vehicle (one was an anti-air gun the other was a stolen helicopter). This isn't the first time that I have experienced this on this particular map.

Please take a moment to re-read the thread on Suicide Tactics in the BF2 Rules/Announcements and SOP's and understand that this is not to be tolerated on this server. As players we need to make sure we are not engaging in such behavior but also ensuring that suicide tactics are reported to the admins.

So how should we be using Transport Choppers on Kerch and 32 Dnister? I think we should borrow from what PR has done and look to create Air Cav squads who are dedicated transport only. This way we can eliminate the issue with the disposable choppers that we are seeing currently. It would take more of us stepping up as CO and to also volunteer to fly the choppers for the round but it can only enhance the gaming and teamwork.

Lucky Shot

**khaerus** · 12-15-2007, 10:33 AM

Ramming as a whole is something I've seen a little more of across a variety of the maps, and I attribute that to a new influx of players who are learning the ropes. Usually, it's a one-off, and I don't see it again from a given player. On Kerch in particular, though, it seems the Ram is rearing its ugly head a bit more often, almost as a tactic: it's a quick-n-easy way to force a lost bird to respawn at the USMC base. Whatever. "It's against the rules" is right.

As for getting guys to focus on the type of behavior that would circumvent the need for a ram (ie USMC team NOT losing the chopper in the first place): well, that's the USMC team's job. As the US, there should never be an abandoned chopper on the top of a building, or left behind because some pilot decided to fight it out with his team. Look, if the Ukrainian team is paying enough attention to steal the birds when they get the chance, the US side should put at least that much effort into keeping hold of the choppers in the first place.

PhoenixxFire · 12-15-2007, 09:49 PM

The easiest way to get rid of chopper, if you need to get out yourself, and not leave the chopper, is to bail over the water. That way, you survive the fall, and the chopper blows on impact.

kilevvri1 · 12-15-2007, 10:26 PM

I touched on this a bit the last time I played Kerch with Gahlas, a_civilian, pjaronex, Robocop & Namebot. We were holding Disco from the USMC's helo advance and ground advance from Slums. I noticed something bothering, helos buzzing about with no obvious reason, some even by our own team.

Now my question is, how is this advancing anything? One UKR soldier in a helo is 1 less stopping an attack on the ground. Each US soldier remaining in the air flying about is on less hitting a flag for the US advance. Now I know the whole dedicated helo squad deal has been beaten to death, but the problem is SL's don't seem to have the patience to wait on transport to pick them up.

Helo's are not the only way to advance. Make the helos not respawn and not degrade. That should help with the disposability.

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 12-15-2007, 11:19 PM

What I have done for the next patch is attach the helos to flags. So as USMC takes flags, less helos will spawn. Its the best solution I can come up with here.

kilevvri1 · 12-16-2007, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [tR]Greasy_mullet

What I have done for the next patch is attach the helos to flags. So as USMC takes flags, less helos will spawn. Its the best solution I can come up with here.

That is brilliant Greasy, you the man!

**Namebot** · 12-16-2007, 11:35 AM

That is a pretty good fix Greasy.

I guess it isn't very TG of me to have become skilled at squishing people with the Littlebird? I've gotten pretty good too, got 2 medics go for the revive the other day eliminating the whole squad.

Dozer tag on the other hand hasn't been so successful.

Every set of eyes watching the chopper is one set less scanning for approaching infantry, keep that in mind.

ikonic · 12-16-2007, 02:30 PM

I personally don't see a problem squishing people with a chopper, it is in essence the same as running someone over with a dingo or tank. Suicide ramming on the other hand would be a different story.

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 12-16-2007, 03:29 PM

Having a chopper up in the sky is ok but having 6 is not as ok. I have seen good teams use the little bird to help spot troops and help direct the battle while still being a taxi service for those already on the ground.

Other things I have done is added a heavy AT kit to the City Hall flag so that when the USMC grabs the tank, Ukraine can do something about it. Speaking of the tank I increased its respawn time so taking it out should give the USMC a nice window to push on to other flags (Like a power play in Ice Hockey!"). The keep has gotten some more work on it as far as textures and details... and I have one other addition which is just for fun but will keep it to myself right now... Whiskey knows all about it...

Also I am going to tweak up the 16 player version. IF you think you have a good idea for the flag layout, please start a thread discussing it and I will certainly take a look.

Lucky Shot · 12-16-2007, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ikonic

I personally don't see a problem squishing people with a chopper, it is in essence the same as running someone over with a dingo or tank. Suicide ramming on the other hand would be a different story.

When a dingo starts driving around in circles around a flag on maps like Orel just trying to drive people over the admins tell them it's not Nascar. The choppers are the same way.

Lucky Shot

**WhiskeySix** · 12-16-2007, 05:37 PM

Indeed - helo's should absolutely NOT be used for squishing people. Click here for details. It is as inappropriate as suicide tactics.

btw - i love the current 16p setup and wouldn't change a thing!

kilevvri1 · 12-16-2007, 07:18 PM

Me too getting out of the Attic requires teamwork and is not impossible. Not even near impossible.

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 12-16-2007, 08:02 PM

The attic is more of an issue attacking than getting out of. The issue I keep seeing is the US taking it first and then leaving Ukraine hurt bad to get it back.

Some of the suggestions so far have been to have just 2 flags inside the keep and have a 3rd outside somewhere close.

rich73 · 12-17-2007, 03:41 AM

What about moving the flag at the distribution center to the roof of the building.......

kilevvri1 · 12-17-2007, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rich73

What about moving the flag at the distribution center to the roof of the building.......

We were talking about the 16 player version there rich73. Not a flag option as it is in No Man's Land.

12-15-2007, 01:57 AM	#1 (permalink)
Lucky Shot Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,639	Suicide Choppers on Kerch Last night my squad was on the receiving end of two different events that could be considered suicide choppers. Both involved a pilot crashing their helicopter into an enemy vehicle (one was an anti-air gun the other was a stolen helicopter). This isn't the first time that I have experienced this on this particular map. Please take a moment to re-read the thread on Suicide Tactics in the BF2 Rules/Announcements and SOP's and understand that this is not to be tolerated on this server. As players we need to make sure we are not engaging in such behavior but also ensuring that suicide tactics are reported to the admins. So how should we be using Transport Choppers on Kerch and 32 Dnister? I think we should borrow from what PR has done and look to create Air Cav squads who are dedicated transport only. This way we can eliminate the issue with the disposable choppers that we are seeing currently. It would take more of us stepping up as CO and to also volunteer to fly the choppers for the round but it can only enhance the gaming and teamwork. Lucky Shot

12-15-2007, 10:33 AM	#2 (permalink)
khaerus Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 1,296	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch Ramming as a whole is something I've seen a little more of across a variety of the maps, and I attribute that to a new influx of players who are learning the ropes. Usually, it's a one-off, and I don't see it again from a given player. On Kerch in particular, though, it seems the Ram is rearing its ugly head a bit more often, almost as a tactic: it's a quick-n-easy way to force a lost bird to respawn at the USMC base. Whatever. "It's against the rules" is right. As for getting guys to focus on the type of behavior that would circumvent the need for a ram (ie USMC team NOT losing the chopper in the first place): well, that's the USMC team's job. As the US, there should never be an abandoned chopper on the top of a building, or left behind because some pilot decided to fight it out with his team. Look, if the Ukrainian team is paying enough attention to steal the birds when they get the chance, the US side should put at least that much effort into keeping hold of the choppers in the first place. __________________ TG Primer--TG FAQs--BF2 Rules/SOPs--TeamSpeak--Admin!

12-15-2007, 09:49 PM	#3 (permalink)
PhoenixxFire Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Moron Valley, Southern California Age: 22 Posts: 496	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch The easiest way to get rid of chopper, if you need to get out yourself, and not leave the chopper, is to bail over the water. That way, you survive the fall, and the chopper blows on impact.

12-15-2007, 10:26 PM	#4 (permalink)
kilevvri1 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Montego Bay, Jamaica Age: 30 Posts: 473	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch I touched on this a bit the last time I played Kerch with Gahlas, a_civilian, pjaronex, Robocop & Namebot. We were holding Disco from the USMC's helo advance and ground advance from Slums. I noticed something bothering, helos buzzing about with no obvious reason, some even by our own team. Now my question is, how is this advancing anything? One UKR soldier in a helo is 1 less stopping an attack on the ground. Each US soldier remaining in the air flying about is on less hitting a flag for the US advance. Now I know the whole dedicated helo squad deal has been beaten to death, but the problem is SL's don't seem to have the patience to wait on transport to pick them up. Helo's are not the only way to advance. Make the helos not respawn and not degrade. That should help with the disposability. __________________ Long May the FFTHFF(5th) live in our memories and our teamplay.

12-15-2007, 11:19 PM	#5 (permalink)
[tR]Greasy_mullet Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Tennessee Age: 29 Posts: 668	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch What I have done for the next patch is attach the helos to flags. So as USMC takes flags, less helos will spawn. Its the best solution I can come up with here.

12-16-2007, 11:35 AM	#7 (permalink)
Namebot Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 362	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch That is a pretty good fix Greasy. I guess it isn't very TG of me to have become skilled at squishing people with the Littlebird? I've gotten pretty good too, got 2 medics go for the revive the other day eliminating the whole squad. Dozer tag on the other hand hasn't been so successful. Every set of eyes watching the chopper is one set less scanning for approaching infantry, keep that in mind.

12-16-2007, 02:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
ikonic Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Michigan Age: 22 Posts: 1,343	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch I personally don't see a problem squishing people with a chopper, it is in essence the same as running someone over with a dingo or tank. Suicide ramming on the other hand would be a different story. __________________

12-16-2007, 03:29 PM	#9 (permalink)
[tR]Greasy_mullet Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Tennessee Age: 29 Posts: 668	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch Having a chopper up in the sky is ok but having 6 is not as ok. I have seen good teams use the little bird to help spot troops and help direct the battle while still being a taxi service for those already on the ground. Other things I have done is added a heavy AT kit to the City Hall flag so that when the USMC grabs the tank, Ukraine can do something about it. Speaking of the tank I increased its respawn time so taking it out should give the USMC a nice window to push on to other flags (Like a power play in Ice Hockey!"). The keep has gotten some more work on it as far as textures and details... and I have one other addition which is just for fun but will keep it to myself right now... Whiskey knows all about it... Also I am going to tweak up the 16 player version. IF you think you have a good idea for the flag layout, please start a thread discussing it and I will certainly take a look.

12-16-2007, 05:37 PM	#11 (permalink)
WhiskeySix Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Gillette Stadium, Section 309, Row 12, Seat 24 Age: 33 Posts: 8,271	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch Indeed - helo's should absolutely NOT be used for squishing people. Click here for details. It is as inappropriate as suicide tactics. btw - i love the current 16p setup and wouldn't change a thing! __________________ *PoE2 Version 2.5 Overview \| Get started with PoE2 (for free!)*

12-16-2007, 07:18 PM	#12 (permalink)
kilevvri1 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Montego Bay, Jamaica Age: 30 Posts: 473	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch Me too getting out of the Attic requires teamwork and is not impossible. Not even near impossible. __________________ Long May the FFTHFF(5th) live in our memories and our teamplay.

12-16-2007, 08:02 PM	#13 (permalink)
[tR]Greasy_mullet Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Tennessee Age: 29 Posts: 668	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch The attic is more of an issue attacking than getting out of. The issue I keep seeing is the US taking it first and then leaving Ukraine hurt bad to get it back. Some of the suggestions so far have been to have just 2 flags inside the keep and have a 3rd outside somewhere close.

12-17-2007, 03:41 AM	#14 (permalink)
rich73 Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 142	Re: Suicide Choppers on Kerch What about moving the flag at the distribution center to the roof of the building.......

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