You know, for God

[leejo]

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040507/D82DOI1O0.html

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY:

May 7, 9:03 AM (ET)

BASRA, Iraq (AP) - A senior aide of radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr told worshippers during a Friday sermon in southern Iraq that anyone capturing a female British soldier can keep her as a slave.

Charming...

[TheFeniX]

I've always been kind of passive on most of the war in Iraq. I supported it, but wouldn't argue the point with anyone.

I'm honestly starting to wonder if we can even help these people at all. Their society is so fundamentally different from ours, I don't think they even want to advance as a society. After the latest escalation in violence, I have to wonder what plans Bush has as more Coalition forces die.

[leejo]

I think Bush's plan is to kill or capture such people. Their society must change now.

[fr1j0l3]

Their society must change now

Yikes.

That's a pretty strong statement. On who's orders?

[leejo]

I don't understand your question.

[TheFeniX]

I'm just worried that we will be unable to fight generations of indoctrination. These people are dead-set in their beliefs and changing that through violence (which they are very accustomed to) may not work. Something needs to be done, but I wonder if the Coalition is going about it the wrong way.

Note: This is just my opinion, and I have to honest idea on how I would fix the situation. I just feel trying to change the people's mindset in the Middle East is like trying to iceskate uphill.

[leejo]

Well I worry about that too, but I really don't see a better plan. They are trying to kill us!

We can sit back and build a Maginot line and hope it works, or we can take the fight to them. The more time they spend worrying about where to sleep instead of how to kill us the better.

We all just want to be left alone, but it isn't as if there's an option in which these Islamic extremists say "OK our bad. Carry on." Even if there were such a course, I wouldn't want to take it: Look at their vision of the world.

[CingularDuality]

Originally Posted by TheFeniX

I'm honestly starting to wonder if we can even help these people at all. Their society is so fundamentally different from ours, I don't think they even want to advance as a society. After the latest escalation in violence, I have to wonder what plans Bush has as more Coalition forces die.

Your problem is that your only view if Iraq is through the cameras of the popular media. Iraq is actually a very secular nation (perhaps moreso than the US) when it comes to their politics and governent. As a people, they are right on the edge between becoming an islamic nation or a western nation. CNN, of course, only shows the fighting in Fallujah and the rants of one extremist and ignores all the new schools that have been built, ignores the Iraqis working side by side with Americans, ignores the average Iraqi on the street's opinion.

It's kinda like Wag the Dog, except the media's doing it just to sell papers/TV ads.... And it's working. The people of America are accepting the media's biased stories as the complete truth. Sad.

[DudeMan]

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

Your problem is that your only view if Iraq is through the cameras of the popular media. Iraq is actually a very secular nation (perhaps moreso than the US) when it comes to their politics and governent. As a people, they are right on the edge between becoming an islamic nation or a western nation. CNN, of course, only shows the fighting in Fallujah and the rants of one extremist and ignores all the new schools that have been built, ignores the Iraqis working side by side with Americans, ignores the average Iraqi on the street's opinion.

It's kinda like Wag the Dog, except the media's doing it just to sell papers/TV ads.... And it's working. The people of America are accepting the media's biased stories as the complete truth. Sad.

agreed really as a byproduct of my location i am in the midst of alot of imigrants from middleeastern countries. and where ther are some of them that praise binladen and then recieve a kickin from me, there are those who thank the British for removing sadam and even those who say they had imprisoned family members in iraq because of their polictical beliefes.

you have to remember that cnn or any news organisation are looking for what sells pappers and keeps you tuned. was there a media frenzy when the constitution was signed no. it was a constitution which effectively could help develope iraq for the better, but news organisations were concentrating on killing another car bomb and anything which makes you go oh no ill have to read/ watch/ listen.

its pure crap and as a result you get a very unbalanced look at iraq through the eyes of a minority of sick and twisted individuals.

on a side note i have to say the speech by donald rumsfeld today was a class act, the Bush administration should be proud of the definition he quoted between the actions of a few individuals and the way is is dealt with in a western society.

it just occured to me that nobody until now has argued yes this soldier may have committed this crime. but it was not a policy and not suppoerted by the governemnt and when it was found out, the western world stood up and said these men shall be held to account....

[xliipapa6]

I Work at Walter Reed Army Medical Center in DC and get to speak with the injured soldiers who've improved to the point that they can eat in my dining facility.

I also spoke to a chaplain who, moved into Iraq with the 3rd Infantry division. after speaking to him a great length, seems to me that the problems are coming from the Sunni Traingle, the areas around Baghdad. The other 85% of the cities welcome the Americans and are doing very well. From all looks and appearances, The reach of the Clerics arm of control is limited to the cities in and around Baghdad. that's where the problem lies. but the press makes it seem like across the board speaking, that Iraq is acting up and fighting us.

We need to take a "either your with us to help facilitate getting your new government into power or, we come in and snatch you out of your bed as you sleep, or we snatch you off a street as you shop for those who incite insurgents against our troops."

But the soldiers believe in what they are doing. Since we are here in the US, Canada or whereever, we can never really know all the facts as the truth gets skewed, the government won't tell us either. Only the soldiers coming home can tell us what really is going on.

[fr1j0l3]

Originally Posted by xliipapa6

But the soldiers believe in what they are doing. Since we are here in the US, Canada or whereever, we can never really know all the facts as the truth gets skewed, the government won't tell us either. Only the soldiers coming home can tell us what really is going on.

Without a doubt.