Blackdog1

Sam....use the contact an admin section with your ideas. I know the idea was presented but put on hold due to the changes from TG Mod pack to ACE Mod, etc, so apologies if this was not communicated back to you.

Also there is no "arguement" to be had with regards CoOp versus TvT, CoOp IS the focus of TG and TvT will be thrown into the mix on organized events and when people like yourself want to host a session.

The reason Domination is oe server 1 is simply somewhere where people can gather and play if for example a mission is fully loaded on server 2 or not JiP. There is absolutely ZERO stopping you from stepping onto server1 and asking if anyone is interested in a TvT, the problem being, if you spot 20+ players playing lets say Dominaton, there is a reason they have this many players......they are enjoying what they are playing.

Therefore it is sometimes difficult to then say "hey shall we switch to something else".

I have often gone into the server, changed the map and sat watching to see if people will join, in order to play something different. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnt. But it requires YOU to make the effort if that is something you feel passionate about.

As admins we do all we can, we dont get paid for this, for give up MANY hours of our time to help try to keep this server running the best of our ability, therefore a little more support from people asking "how may I help" is ALWAYS greatly received and welcomed rather than the "whhhaaammmbulance" screaming by complaining about what the TG servers dont do.

Just a thought and consideration that everyone should reflect upon.

As it happens, I am just producing something a little different to put on server1 which may become the default for a little while. It's TvT and yes it is in the desert...

I have called the mission "Desertstorm 2" and it will be a 60 player TvT "Capture and Hold" map. It is respawn, JiP and should be a nice population builder and being Capture and hold to a time limit, it should be an interesting change to the norm.

Fingers crossed it SHOULD add a nice change while we get ready for the A2 switch. However IF I then see moaners and whiners saying..."yeah it's ok but I dont like Desert maps" dont be surprised if my sand shovel comes whistling past your ears!

Ghost, thanks for your suggestion we will have a look.

BD1

sparks50

I just dont see why PVP and Coop is on separate servers. Arcade(domination, server 1) and tactical(server 2) is a good way to part things I think, but PVP and COOP is essentially played by the same crowd, it makes little sense IMO to move the PVP to the arcade server.


Not to be slamming on the TG admins, you guys are doing a great job.

__________________

Also known as Sparks444 in Project reality

Blackdog1

Its about settings.....

TvT needs player markers etc removed, CoOp not so much, and we truly enjoy some of the videos that have been created with 3rd person view enabled, so this is the reason why we have two servers running different settings...

Slick_nor

After reading all your replies, it seems like the only one of my concerns that is actually a real issue is the targeting for aircraft. That should be a simple thing to change for any modding community, where can I suggest this for the ACE guys?

beita

ACE mod forums thing: http://dev-heaven.net/projects/show/ace-mod

A10s are overkill in Arma missions really, harriers are perfectly fine, unless you are going up against a full tank company or something ...

Apocal

A-10s with rockets and dumb bombs are OK in my book. I linking up with my brother as FAC and using the Pave Penny to help me line up my bomb drops and strafing runs.

beita

Well, the A10s in ACE and Arma and Arma 2 have Mavericks which are instakill so .. they don't have "just" rockets and dumb bombs ..

Apocal

I'm 98% certain I've flown a loaded (nothing fired) A-10 that had no Mavericks in ArmA.

Lhowon

The default loadout for the A-10 in ArmA 2 is:

- 2x AIM-9X Sidewinder
- 2x AGM-65 Mavericks
- 5x GBU-12 Laser Guided Bombs
- 14x Hydra FFAR unguided rockets
- 1350 rounds of Armour Piercing 30mm

This seems quite a good compromise to me. You still get 2 Mavericks, but so long as the mission maker either makes it impossible or very time consuming to reload, there shouldn't be a problem with the jet clearing the area.

The sidewinders are obviously AA only, the LGBs need ground support (good!), and both the FFARs and 30mm would need communication with ground teams for attack runs imo.

Ghost02

Sidewinders can take out a t-90 if you use both on one target.

Tobruk

I remember TG used to get invited to another server for BigMondays or something that was a weekly big TVT game. That was fun.

Slick_nor

I understand that the people that have played Arma for several years, and love the game as it is tend to be more preoccupied with the little details than the larger concept.

My issue, as a 27 year old man that has played games since the days of C64, is that developers seem to forget the point of the game: Making it fun! Arma, as a self-proclaimed military simulator has a very narrow audience. Guys (mainly) that get a kick out of feeling like a part of an army that can defeat a counterpart in a way that is as close as possible to the real thing, that is who I believe Bohemia is trying to appeal to. For me this is the main issue, and in my own mind the prescription for this is very simple: Get players to see the benefit of working together to defeat a very real (but yet virtual) adversary. I personally don't appreciate games mainly because they look and sound authentic, but because they _feel_ authentic.

Like my opening post stated, I love playing PR but miss more space, better graphics and a more authentic feel. And as an Air Force man I would like some way of flying a plane and working with ground forces in a game that does not have the same limitations as the BF2 engine has. I just find it so strange and frustrating that no game can be developed that is both realistic and appealing for online, combined arms gaming. I wanted Arma2 to be that, and my reason for posting was mostly to see if anyone shared my views/concerns.

Now I'm tired and I forgot why I began writing Good night!

Slick.

fuzzhead

my comment was not about TG specifically, more like about fact that vast majority of arma1 online public servers have the arcade settings... which is I think an important point to bring up for original poster coming from a PR background where all the settings on all servers are "forced" to realism settings and ALL have VOIP. In contrast, most Arma1 servers run without VOIP and have all "cadet" difficult settings enabled.

To blackdog: I've not spoken for many weeks now about arma1 difficulty settings, you've stated its currently broken for TG, so we wait for arma2 and see if it gets fixed... I think I've written quite extensively in the past about the TG community, you can check my post history to see for yourself I was just commenting with Sam that I agree with his statements, I was not trying to sound overly negative but at the same time, I am going to speak the truth and not white wash everything and censor myself just so things may appear more enticing to outsiders.

As for slick: I think you'll love ArmA2, but it definitely its not a complete replacement package for PR... player numbers is a huge factor in multiplayer games, and right now PR is vastly more popular and much larger server numbers and regularly populated than ArmA1 and I suspect ArmA2 will be simular: tons of servers with 10 or less players, but VERY few servers with more than 40 players, whereas PR is the opposite with many servers at 60+ players and few servers with less than 20.

And as blackdog mentioned, ArmA players are focused more towards coop and fighting the somewhat moronic and static AI... standard tactics for ArmA players is standing in the open on large hills and shooting down at AI who are clueless and dont react... this is seemingly the bread and butter of ArmA1 public servers. Not to say this is a fault of TG or that this happens often at TG, but I've played on enough ArmA servers to see this kind of "tactic" used so many times, where if they were fighting a human opponent they would get utterly obliterated as its utter lunacy to do such a thing in a scenario - go to the highest most exposed position and shoot at anything that moves hehe

TG and other communities like shacktac / ic arma / sim hq / etc have some very talented mission makers and they have really helped to kick this nasty trend in Arma gameplay I think, but its still apparent in the general behavior and attitude of players when approaching missions I think. I think the ArmA2 AI will drastically improve the situation though, as you cant use these ridiculous tactics anymore and get away with it as much.

Slick I think you'll enjoy both games for what they offer, but if your like me I think youll be yearning for some kind of combination of the 2: a way to mesh the great graphics, large environments and more realistic scope of ArmA, with the intense and strategic intelligence of human combat of PR. Maybe ArmA2 will have missions designed with such a purpose, the modding community of OFP/ArmA is quite talented and massively dedicated!

Blackdog1

The primary issue Fuzz is not a "whitewash" as you put it, but I and the other admins for TG ArmA are simply NOT going to allow THIS forum to be like the PR forum, whereby people feel they can opinionate at will, even if it is against the efforts of TG admins.

I and the others want to see "Balance" and it was actually having reviewed your own history that I actually made my observation. In short what I am telling you is that I want more input (in a constructive manner) from you personally, which will then earn you the right to discuss what may or may not be right with TG servers. We are gladly going to accept any help in organising events etc, or helping with mission/server settings etc, IF you want to help us, the thing we wont stand for is sideline chanters that point out everything that is wrong, more than they say what we are doing that is right/acceptable. Just something for you to consider and if you wish to discuss further then use the contact an admin forum section.

To all...
The key here is how things come across. Discussing ArmA and how it is played on other servers is not only inappropriate for here, but it also has no relevance here as discussing how the masses elsewhere stand on a hill and shoot down at AI is NOT what I see for the most part now at TG.

We have some pretty damn good players now starting to take leadership roles, who are getting people to use some true tactics. In fact not so long ago, I took a squad when Ghost was CO and cleared a village using tactics pretty much straight out the manual, when it comes to CQB. Result....one casualty, completed objective and not a single person sitting in any open area for more than a few seconds.

TG is going to be increasing the number of TGU classes with ArmA2 and I expect to see a great improvement on squadplay, be the opposition AI or human.

They key thing and getting back to the point in question is the fact that ArmA is not PR and as such it will be played in a different manner, i.e. slower. I will take a server of 40 dedicated players playing ArmA in the TG manner rather than 70+ people with 30+ of those players doing the "charge for glory" rather than using realistic tactics to complete an objective. We will cover this in the first revised ArmA TGU class on mission leadership, this way it will be clearly shown what is expected of a Commander, a Squad Leader and a Fireteam Leader. It will also show how to liaise Air and Armour with infantry to an effective outcome not only for mission result but also gameplay satisfaction....

In short...TG ArmA servers are a country mile better than the majority of servers you will encounter on the net and as such...this is what these forums are designed and dedicated to discussing. Can we improve? Always.... but people offering their assistance is what we are looking for most. If people choose NOT to offer their assistance but simply their personal views then they wont last long here.

I have no doubt Slick that you will find exactly what you are looking for in ArmA2 at TG.....and for that you will just have to trust us! most importantly if it does not deliver what you are looking for, then step forward and offer your services as a team leader, commander etc and you will receive all the support you can imagine from the admins in helping make a session/mission play out the way you would like it to be played.

Rgds
BD1

beita

Not an easy thing to do. Making it too accessible and easy to use promotes some rather strange tactics and leads to an experience that doesn't "feel authentic". Making it too difficult and filled with hurdles scares off tons of players and you are left with small scale engagements of Players vs. AI simply because of lack of numbers.

I've been trying to make a fun and realistic feeling TvT mission for Arma for about a year now. I've tried a LOT of things and some have been more successful than others. The latest incarnation of this process is likely to be released sometime after Arma 2 launch on Steam. I REALLY want to have a "persistant" adversarial mission very similar to how the PR maps are played; a lot of players fighting over a "front" trying to gain ground from the enemy. That is my goal.

OFP, ArmA, and now ArmA 2 are very unique in the fact that they aren't as much games, as they are massive sandboxes where you can make almost anything you can think of. Unlike BF2, you can add or remove as many arbitrary limitations very easily. Things like kit limits, crew restrictions, vehicle limits, etc etc are very easy to do in Arma 2. Problem is, they are NEVER the same across multiple missions, unless they are by the same author.

With the new found publicity and player count Arma 2 is going to have, there is a really good chance that this style of adversarial gameplay could take off. I started making missions for Arma in the "Great Arma Depression" where player counts were at an all time low. They bumped up a bit when ACE released, but they were always low. To make an adversarial with all the fancy toys (tanks, jets, choppers) playable and interesting, you NEED lots of players, if you don't have them, these heavy assets can ruin the game for others very quickly.

Hopefully new and interesting TvTs that are fully JIP and respawn compatible (this means they are designed and take into account the many problems of JIP and respawn) show up, so that part of the community can really start to grow.