Re: Fallout Mission Critiques

**Sc[ + ]pe** · 12-28-2009, 06:01 PM

I like the changelog sofar Mikee, especially with regards to grouping civilians and having separate, dedicated spawn points.

One mechanic I'd like to see added is a supply-and-demand market. For instance, a Vector-21 rangefinder could be a real asset in the hands of any of the factions, but what if the teams that needed them didn't have batteries in their local cache? Assuming that the civilians can travel more freely/faster to acquire such random items as batteries, it would become a valuable bargaining tool for a civilian to possess. Other possible "resource" items could include gas masks, glasses, earplugs, smoke grenades, compasses, watches, radios, Kestrel rangefinders, and HuntIR monitors/rounds.

I'd also recommend lowering the firepower that a civilian can have access to under regular (non-faction) means: SKS, CZ-550, SMGs, pistols. Additionally consider scattering non-lethal weapons like flashbangs and CN gas so that civilians can arm themselves without killing others.

**fusionpoo** · 12-28-2009, 06:13 PM

I would like if you could make it so that cars cant break or pop the wheels on the car. The map is filled with rocks and such and for some reason the wheel will blow if you even get close to rock which quickly eliminates all the cars on map.

Also i think you should create repair points at each factions base so they repair vehicles at base without a repair truck. I think the repair trucks should remain destructible as is.

The white civi cars that are on the map are all locked and can not get it. every single one on the map, please change so that a couple arent broken completely.

I like the idea of capture-able points where people can show there dominance of a region or see where people have sided. ex the rebel alliance civi group we had took over the police station and no one would have known we had control of that area. The capture-able areas need to be able to be taken over and the area needs to go neutral if the faction is not in the area for a while

Make each civilian gang the same character or just have some way to tell the gangs apart

**Hashassin** · 12-28-2009, 06:16 PM

Originally Posted by Sc[ + ]pe

I like the changelog sofar Mikee, especially with regards to grouping civilians and having separate, dedicated spawn points.

One mechanic I'd like to see added is a supply-and-demand market. For instance, a Vector-21 rangefinder could be a real asset in the hands of any of the factions, but what if the teams that needed them didn't have batteries in their local cache? Assuming that the civilians can travel more freely/faster to acquire such random items as batteries, it would become a valuable bargaining tool for a civilian to possess. Other possible "resource" items could include gas masks, glasses, earplugs, smoke grenades, compasses, watches, radios, Kestrel rangefinders, and HuntIR monitors/rounds.

I'd also recommend lowering the firepower that a civilian can have access to under regular (non-faction) means: SKS, CZ-550, SMGs, pistols. Additionally consider scattering non-lethal weapons like flashbangs and CN gas so that civilians can arm themselves without killing others.

Yeah weapons are a bit too tough like i used to rush to the police Hq with a few guys id grab AT4 and M-16 while they would grab AK-47's and snipers the only thing is factions are a bit too trigger happy and open fire too much on a civ with a lowered weapon which most likely means he doesnt want to fight not that he wants to attack a group of raiders in MG trucks (duh).

The groups seem a good idea but it would be better if you didnt force groups to fight becasue even with out them we would end up forming a group and ambushing a faction for guns ammo and backpacks.

and maybe add a backpack for civs at ammo boxes or even maybe (somehow) a new backpack that is an old broken sack.

**Mikee** · 12-28-2009, 06:47 PM

No more sniper rifles in the mission, except for like 2-3 scattered around the map. This will prevent campers from killing people.

Dmented: Ground around Fort Bannister will be full of mines, so it won't be so easy to just go there.

Sc[ + ]pe: I'm thinking about creating a small market next to Megaton, marked on the map. Most of the times, Megaton is full of civies, so people could just come to Megaton and trade for weapons/equipment/medications.

fussionpoo: Fuel Trucks are indestructable and damaged cars will respawn at the position after like 45 sec.

Hashassin: Weapons that civies can use and access will be much less powerful, unless they find it on dead body. This is why market will be important place to trade.

I'm thinking how to solve problem with holding certain key points on the map by blufor/opfor/independece.

**randir14** · 12-28-2009, 07:15 PM

I don't know if this was a bug, but in the Raider town we had huge explosions going off randomly about every ten minutes and we couldn't figure out what was causing them. The graphic looked like a satchel charge explosion but no enemies were in town and any time someone died it said "so and so was killed" (it didn't say they were killed by another player).

**Thomas R Harper, Jr** · 12-28-2009, 07:27 PM

Based on your answer to my question about the "tank", I would suggest, if possible, a random initial spawn for it so no one will know exactly where to look for it ... or alternately .. a less than 15% probability of it actually being spawned in the game .. that is probably easiest to adjust. And, make it damaged as well as out-of-fuel so you have to have both a repair truck and a fuel truck to get it running.

My thoughts .... I kept wondering if that was what was blowing up houses in our town .. what ever it was, they leveled a significant portion of our available cover. I was beginning to wonder what we would do when all the structures were gone.

Thank God, the game didn't last that long.

**Mikee** · 12-28-2009, 08:31 PM

Randir14 and Thomas R Harper, Jr. There were explosions, because probably someone sneak in to your town, planted lots of satchels, set timer for few minutes and left.

**Mikee** · 12-28-2009, 11:39 PM

Version 2.0 of Fallout was released with huge help from |TG| Inq.
It will not be clusterfufk anymore. All feedback has been used to make this mission more tactical, playable and fun.

List of changes:

* added ACE Medical Module

* Fuel Trucks are now indestructible. If destroyed, they will respawn at the position after 60 sec

* all vehicles will also respawn

* civilians were divided into 6 different groups of 4-5-6 people. every group has a leader, this will keep people from getting out of control

* Marketplace point was created at Megaton. Players can meet there to trade equipment/medications/cars/etc...

* civilians can't steal anymore from Blufor/Opfor/Independece weapon crates

* now places can be sized by certain groups and everybody will see a message when this happens. example: Fort Bannister is now under control of (name of the group)

* added Hospital at northern part of the Fairfax city

* ending trigger was fixed

* JIP briefing works now

* Mariposa Military Base (Blufor camp) was moved to Ghost Church position (equal distance between Raiders and Regulators)

* there is no more one together respawn for civilians. now, civilians will respawn at their group towns

* now there is about 3 sniper rifles for whole map, this should solve problem with campers

* added few more things

DOWNLOAD: http://www.speedyshare.com/files/200....aiaktalik.pbo

**Sc[ + ]pe** · 12-29-2009, 02:54 AM

Nice work, Mikee!

For all of the complaints recently about RP missions, I think it shows great intent that you've created something so completely different. Keep it up!

**CFoxtrot** · 12-29-2009, 03:42 AM

I certainly enjoyed v2.0 more than the previous version, but I'll still try to address some problems.

-In v2.0 there was still alot of sniper rifles. Alot.
-The trading in Megaton was not so great because someone could sneak in the police station, or where ever, and take all the guns and supplies he wanted.
-The fact that we would respawn with our weapons was a problem. If death doesn't come with penalties, there is no need to heal/trade for medical supplies.

Despite these small problems, I think that this is a great mission. I didnt think the tank was too overpowering, because everyone and their dog has AT. When the tank ventured out of Megaton during the end of the game, it got blown up within 3 minutes. The map system was good; I couldn't see myself on the map, which forced me to navigate like RL, and I was happy I couldn't see anyone else on the map.

Some suggestions:
-Mabye add in a food system like in Cheneraus Life. This would increase trade, which as I stated previously was laking. It would also force factions to occasionaly cooperate, and that would add some interesting situations to the game.
-Limit the amount of radios so only big settlements ,i.e. Megaton, Fairfax, Canturbery Commons, can communicate with each other on global. This would draw people to the settlement instead of lonewolfing it in the middle of the wasteland.

**fusionpoo** · 12-29-2009, 08:08 AM

A few more critiques that i have come to after playing v2. and numerous people agreed with me on these thing through the course of the game. Real fun mission keep it up

-Less fuel trucks, we said the magic number is 3. The civilian group i was a part of managed to get 4 fuel trucks in under 5 min. Guarding multiple trucks was annoying and stealing guarding and managing to get all 9 trucks at a time i believe is impossible

-Make the trucks invincible, although it seems like a good idea of the re spawning trucks the fact is that people get a truck and shoot out the tires. In order to get it the truck you have to blow it up wait a min for respawn and then drive it away while being at an enemy base under heavy fire while your enemy respawns.

-Make it so that it shows that civilian groups have taken over the points on the map, ex fort bannister is now controlled by the railroad civis

-spawn without last weapons

-doctor/medic civilian units that can trade or be traded for there services

-more elaborate spawn system because spawn killing is quite rampant and annoying

- say in briefing that megaton is a neutral area(it might already). but enforcement of the neutrality needs to be enforced some way.

-----Biggest problem. there needs to be a way of telling the civilian squads apart. i personally have killed my own units because they look no different than the unit next to them. This would be easier if we had some more units to look like but that's a ace or server thing. simple solution would be to make for example all civis who spawn at the railroad be 1 civilian avatar "rocker" and all daves diner units be that old person unit. Even if it looks stupid it can at least work to differentiate between civi squads

**Inq** · 12-29-2009, 10:08 AM

Originally Posted by fusionpoo

A few more critiques that i have come to after playing v2. and numerous people agreed with me on these thing through the course of the game. Real fun mission keep it up

-Less fuel trucks, we said the magic number is 3. The civilian group i was a part of managed to get 4 fuel trucks in under 5 min. Guarding multiple trucks was annoying and stealing guarding and managing to get all 9 trucks at a time i believe is impossible

-Make the trucks invincible, although it seems like a good idea of the re spawning trucks the fact is that people get a truck and shoot out the tires. In order to get it the truck you have to blow it up wait a min for respawn and then drive it away while being at an enemy base under heavy fire while your enemy respawns.

-Make it so that it shows that civilian groups have taken over the points on the map, ex fort bannister is now controlled by the railroad civis

-spawn without last weapons

-doctor/medic civilian units that can trade or be traded for there services

-more elaborate spawn system because spawn killing is quite rampant and annoying

- say in briefing that megaton is a neutral area(it might already). but enforcement of the neutrality needs to be enforced some way.

-----Biggest problem. there needs to be a way of telling the civilian squads apart. i personally have killed my own units because they look no different than the unit next to them. This would be easier if we had some more units to look like but that's a ace or server thing. simple solution would be to make for example all civis who spawn at the railroad be 1 civilian avatar "rocker" and all daves diner units be that old person unit. Even if it looks stupid it can at least work to differentiate between civi squads

I did mention some of these points to mikee before release. (like the same civi units in each group & the respawn with weapons)

You are correct about spawn killing. I have to admit I may have spawn killed a few civ's last night simply becasue they were attacking me from their spawn.

I suggest that you make the spawns indoors (in a building) and as soon as a person leaves a building its fairgame. If you kill people in their spawn building Id get them kicked off server.

The major problem was too many weapons on the map (again) becasue of the refilling ammo boxes and respawn with weapons. I feel civi's should respawn with nothing and BLU/OP/IND should either spawn with nothing or a basic weapon of their faction with 2 mags.

I think you should make a trader group mikee for the megaton town, give them all profiteer units except the leader and make him a doctor. Its a fun part of the mission for some poeple, but others would want to avoid being a trader.

As for the main objective - Perhaps 6 trucks on the map and 4 trucks are required to win.

**Soupy_Norman** · 12-29-2009, 10:12 AM

The white civi cars that are on the map are all locked and can not get it. every single one on the map, please change so that a couple arent broken completely.

On my rather extensive whole map quest for food the other night i found a white civi car, that works!!! But has no fuel XD

**Mikee** · 12-29-2009, 11:38 AM

We are working with Inq on quick fix version 2.5.

It was my mistake for all the weapons yesterday, I forgot to delete weapon_respawn script.

With new version, civilians will respawn without the weapons.

**W-Cephei** · 12-29-2009, 04:23 PM

Its really hard to play as civilian on Expert mode... You get TK all the time...

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