Bommando

Sorry for starting a new thread for this one, but I thought I'd do a detailed de-brief with my take on the tactics.

First, I'd like to say props to AGE for fielding a well-organised opposing team and giving us a hell of a fight. The rounds were much closer than the scores imply and they never let up on any CP we held during any of the rounds.

Thanks also to Apophis for bringing this together in such a short space of time and being so organised with filling the teams and allocating forums / TeamSpeak channels for the event.

Apologies to any non-Supporting Members who missed out on playing. Hopefully this will be a regular thing, so we will all get more opportunities in the future.

I'll post a bit of a de-brief on each map from my perspective and it would be nice if Apophis and Azrael could add their own tack from the maps they were CO for. Anyone who has any comments or suggestion on areas we could improve would be more than welcome.

Strike At Karkand

CO: Apophis

It seemed to take forever to take the South MEC flag and once we did take it, it was just as hard to hold. Once we got a foothold at the bridge, however, things started to stabilise. Having the Battle Recorder on made the going tough for everyone and the lag was totally unbearable for the first 15 mins. All we could do was just face a bunch of enemies and try to unload in their general direction. Once it was turned off, things seemed to smooth out a bit.

Once we started the face-off across the river, the tickets started to drain to our advantage. Our Medics were awesome in keeping us alive and we got out to a good 70 ticket lead before long. Keeping the bridge down was key and we managed to suppress the infantry rushes across the river. The artillery war was hell and we definitely took the brunt of their fury.

When they got the bridge back up, we got in a bit of a bother because they managed to steal a HMMWV and proceed through to take 3 Western CPs in quick succession. My squad fell back and luckily got little resistance when we headed West to re-cap them. By then they were trailing by 150 tickets and the game was pretty much at an end.

Result: TG USMC win 159 - 0

Daqing Oilfields

CO: AzrealDarkmoon

This one got off to a shaky start and was much closer for most of the game. A couple of our squads hit the centre flag and soon realised that the enemy weren't going to make much of a stab at taking it. We just kept getting bombed and hit with arty, so ended up moving out to the West.

My squad worked together with the 42nd to capture the Western CPs and had a real hard time holding them under fierce opposition. Constant attacks from their UCB and artillery / bombing runs still caused us heaps of grief. They did a great job at avoiding our mines and I'm sure they had an Engineer disabling them for the incoming vehicles, because they seemed to roll straight over even some of our thickly mined positions.

Pretty soon, we were taking so many casualties from armour that I ordered my squad to take overwatch positions on the Northern hill in order to spot incoming vehicles and try to pre-empt some attacks by weakening their vehicles with AT and minefields. The voracious spotting from that hill enabled us to call in effective air support and our jets saved our butts more than a few times. Their attack helo was made largely ineffective and our jets made sure to soften any approaching armour columns. I don't remember their attack helo causing us much grief at all despite spotting it a number of times.

We experienced ticket bleed for a good portion of the game, but we managed to get out to a good enough lead for it not to matter.

Result: TG USMC win 88 - 0

Dalian Plant

CO: Bommando

My tactics for this one were clear from the beginning. We made straight for the 3 East coast flags and manned the AA guns. I sent the 1st MIP to the Southern warehouse, but they were met with really serious opposition. I needed to move a supporting 7th squad to aid them in creating a nice little killzone in the warehouse. The attack helo squad did great to help them out there and after a short firefight, we took it off them and quickly held enough flags for ticket bleed.

For the first half of the game, the Eastern squads didn't see too much opposition, so repelled invaders pretty easily. They threw pretty much everything they had at the warehouse to the South and this is what really hurt them. The 7th and 1st MIP were stoic in defence and I directed the jets and helos to rain down on the incoming forces from the North West. Combined with my artillery strikes, they suffered huge casualties trying to take this position and never really did get a foothold until very briefly at the end of the game when we relaxed a bit.

Once they realised taking the warehouse was futile, they threw everything they had at our North East flag. Again, we put up an incredible fight and the 42nd held them back for a very long time. I diverted the air support to the North and again, they were caught in a one-sided battle. That flag did eventually fall, but not before we inflicted heavy losses. Once they captured the North East, they left the West wide open and the 1st MIP made a rapid move to capture it and keep the tickets bleeding.

Our squads did a great job suppressing attacking infantry long enough for me drop defensive artillery on their advance. There were many occasions where I was able to destroy entire squads because they were made to stay still on attack. Combine this with infantry readily calling for air support and we had this in the bag after a very short space of time. I think we exerted ticket bleed for probably 95% of the time.

I really got the hang of using the B key to talk to individual squads as CO and did a lot of multiple selecting to talk to a couple at a time. I used the specific squad channels almost exclusively, so I would appreciate some feedback on the radio noise and how effective my comms were, especially with the air squads. I tried as much as possible to vocalise targets, so the jets knew what to expect on their passes.

Result: TG USMC win 298 - 0

Rounds: TG 3 - 0
Total Tickets: 545 - 0

De-briefing comments:

Really, we couldn't have played a much better set of rounds. Our teamwork was superb and squads were extremely dedicated to following CO orders to the letter.

I am especially proud of the fact that we were able to adapt to a very different set of opponents than we are used to on our own servers. Well done.

If I have one criticism, it is for the occasional lapse in concentration by forgetting one of the fundamentals of defence: Do not leave a single vehicle unattended. On a couple of occasions, we allowed them to steal vehicles and use them against us to almost devastating effect. This was particularly true on Karkand, where a stolen HMMWV allowed them to break through our ranks to the West and set us back severely. Not a big deal this time, but something to be aware of for the future.

Thanks again to Apophis and everyone who participated in making this an awesome event. Let's hope for many more in the future.

Divisions:

1st MIP
7th Infantry
42nd Recon
VMFA531 Grey Ghosts
Attack Helo

Props also to my squad 7th BOM. I couldn't have hoped for a better team:

Ultrablue (Medic)
JMJ (Assault)
Jayhawk (Medic / Engineer / Assault)
Bubba (Support / AT)
Clorox (Sniper / AT)

Cheers,

Bommando. 7th Infantry.

TG_Trigger

I have to say your stragedy on Dalian Plant was TEXT BOOK and excuted to perfection. It was a thing of beauty... true TG form tactics make the difference.

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[age-c1] [conduct]
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday.

Santa

I didnt really have any clue as to how to command dalian but after seein how you did it i think i have a rough idea.

Phelan Ward

I'm just sorry that the attack helis couldn't help you more on Dalian. We got distracted by other helis from time to time. I tried to keep us focused but those enemy helis really didn't like how I was nailing them with TV missles. They obviously hadn't experienced missle sniping before, but I remeber them trying to hit us with them and they even succeeded once.

On both Dalian and Daqing my pilots didn't really know what could be done with a TV missle at long range. I also found out how much more sluggish a joystick is compared to a keyboard/mouse when flying a heli.

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John CANavar

Bommando,

CO-SL radio communication was excellent. I didnt have any difficulty to talk to/listen my squad.

Your Dalian Plant strategy was flawless. I like your "peripheral capture/defense" plan. This is the second time I see its application under your command (the first one was "Daqing Oilfields")

Wulfyn

Scrim TG vs AGE 20-Aug
42nd Debrief


Pre-game:

Having signed up and registered our preferred kit loadout we saw that we were going to have 5/6 people in our squad. Fortuantely we were joined by Ragged, who performed so well in both teamwork and ability that he has since been invited to become a regular member of the team. Using a mix of my own experience and the suggested kit loadout by Bommando, I pencilled up a rough kit plan. However I did make it aware that kits may have to be changed depending upon the situation. The plan was for me to start as Sqaud Leader, but to switch it to Lagomorph at some point in the evening.


Karkand

The 42nd were tasked with a quick and quiet takedown fo the north-west flag. Equipped with Spec Ops, Medicx2, Assault, AT and Support we made our way up through the eastern buildings. Our progress was good as we met only light resistance, and fortunately we were experienced enough not to get drawn in to the massive firefight that was kicking off to our flank, but pushed up away from it. We met some heavier resistance nearer the flag, but with me hanging back I was convinced that we would be able to get people in position. Unfortunately the enemy commander had time to drop an artillery strike on us, all but wiping out the squad, and killing me. We started again, and were keen to get back into position. The really crucial factor was the squad that had taken the Bridge flag. Although control was short lived it divided the team in the north west flag, and the reulting cap by the 42nd was swift and easy.

We set about establishing a defensive position, but Apophis was keen to use the initiative our teams had gained in the early stages, and we were ordered to a high-line defence, relocating to halfway betwwen the two flags, using the heavy cover and elevation to help take the fight to the bridge flag. With 4 of our guys pushed quite deep we did manage to lay some good covering fire down on them, with myself and Strikefear as a medic hanging back a bit in case we were flanked. The 1st MIP used our position to work around to our north side to put some fantastic pressure on the flag, and shortly after we were sent up to join them.

One of the crucial skills I think that a SL should develop is the ability to quickly and reliably 'tell it how it is' to help inform the CO of a situation that is not working. One of the crucial skills of a CO is to listen to this and act accordingly. The 1st MIP and 42nd were bunched quite tight to the north of the bridge flag, and this was attracting a lot of artillery fire. After signalling to Apophis were were asked to relocate halfway between the Bridge flag and the land bridge. This changed ourt role drastically. No longer designated strictly with base defence, and knowing that at this point enemy armour was our biggest threat I wswitched myself from Spec Ops to AT, and Xeil from Medic to AT. We then set about using the cover of the trains to keep the enemy armour on the opposite side down.

This hailed for us the winning point of the match, and there were a few key points that I thought was crucial to the 42nd role in assisting this. Firstly StrikeFear and Sabre-6 were paramount in keeping our personalk ticket loss low by providing lots of health and ammo. This allowed us to not worry about ammo, so that if we were up against APC/Armour shooting back we could 'fire and forget' with our rockets. The second factor was that even though we did not secure many kills againt the armour, the hits on them forced them to withdraw from the front line to repair, reducing their firepower back. This in turn allowed us to step up our assault, allowing us more time for a good guidance. The firefight was moving in our direction. The 3rd crucial point was our dynamics. We were very keen to help out at both the bridge and the land bridge, and spent much time running up and down to counter threats. Our main assisting priority were to the guys on the land brige, who had a lot of armour coming at them. The final point was that we dealt with artillery a lot better than the opposition in my opinion. I felt we got quite good at drawing them into a fight on the opposite side to us, and Apophis seemed well able to capitalise on this. In return we were able to listen out for the enemy guns. When we heard them firing we abandoned our position very quickly. Especially the first time we did it it worked a treat, as the artillery struck right on our previous position, and we didn't lose a single casualty. I made a few bad judgement calls later on, but the medics that abounded were more than able to pick us back up. The only really embarrassing call was when we heard the enemy guns and I looked at the map to see that the groups to or north and south were bunched whereas we were spread out. I confidently called out that we should stay still as we were a low percentage target. I think we lost the whole squad on that one

It was clear we had a very good lead as things got messy towards the end. The group to our north pulled away, and I made a call for us to move north to cover them. I readjusted the squad back to the previous kit loadout, which I think worked as the one time we began to lose the flag I had some c4 planted on the flag to take out the enemy APC that had moved up to cap it. A few more small battles were had before our position was reinforced, which was good as at one point we were the only squad left on the bank of the river, and I was worrying that it was going to get messy. But that was pretty much the end of that map.


Daqing Oil Fields

This was a flase start for me. Our sqaud was initially tasked with taking and holding the centre flag, but I suffered a gfx lag problem, and had to reboot. I came in later to find the squad over on the western flags, and quickly reassembled. Thanks to the squad for giving a great sitrep to get me back in the running asap. The game was actually fairly quiet for us, and initially revolved around us working with Bommando's 7th to take the bottom flag. Although I agree that SL to SL comms would be useful, this was a great example of good but silent understanding and interaction between two squads. Bommando's unit moved quickly and quietly to a point to the west of the compound, clearly looking for a quick take, using the dense cover from that area for a surprise assault. We decided to oblige their tactics by making as much noise as possible, and began a reasonably suicidal frontal assault. Sabre 6 in particualr bravely had a Humvee's 50cal working on overtime. Our squad took some nasty hits, but the plan worked smoothly, as Bom's squad near effortlessly took the flag. They were then tasked with holding the north flag with us the south. I set upon a rapid reaction plan, and set up the squad halfway between the two flags on the hill. This allowed Apophis to keep the Linebacker in the trees safe from bombing runs, and for us to react to the frontal assaults on the north flag. Lagomorph's mining of the bridg to the north forced the tanks to come at us much slower through the trees to the north east, which allowed Bommando's group to set upon it hard. Meanwhile I was lying in the hills, guarding the south, as with great line of sight we could move back before things got too close, and I had the extra reassurance of having c4'd around our flag.

That's pretty much how it stayed for us. I think this was a crucial point, as we took a lot of pressure off of Bommando's guys whilst still acheiving our objective. Late on we were asked to assault the centre flag, which got bogged down and eventually repelled - the second unsuccessful mission so far on both maps. The game looked fearsom to the east, but for us it felt quite controlled, and with no disrespect to AGE at no time did it feel like we might be shrugged out of the area completely.


Dalian Plant

Lagomorph took over as CO for this one, as I switched to AT. We were tasked with the norht-east flag, and quickly secured the area. We then pushed on with all haste, and capped the north east. The plan was not for a full out hold of this area, as Bommando was too experienced to allow us to be stretched too thin. However we did steal the APC, and retreat to the north warehouse to keep the enemy pinned down. There were 3 crucial but hairline mistakes that I made in this game which I am a little disappointed about. The first was losing the APC. I had called for a supply crate behind the warehouse to repair myself if I took heavy firepower. The plan would have worked, but with the APC damaged from 2 rocket hits I mistimed the turn and clipped the corner of the warehouse, blowing the vehicle and killing myself. Disappointing. With the nemey now having that APC Lago made an excellent call in pulling our defence line back. I spent a large amount of time from here taking down APC's and buggies that moved towards us with the rocket launcher, whilst Xeil, who had pushed a little further ahead as a cout set about sniping anything from longe range.. even more impressive as he was using the M16! With Apophis on the AA, and Sabre and Ragged reacting to threats as well it really highlighted how great BF2 can be when people are working as a team.

The advanced recon held us in good stead for reacting to any invasion, and no matter which direction they came in we had warning. I had the most amazing bad luck when a jeep full of guys sped towards us. As they were moving across the hills to my right (north) I could not get a good shot, but I knew the buggy would stop at the wall just the other side of the building to where I was. I pulled back and waited for it to arrive, which it surely did. I was now 20 meters maximum from the car, with the scope aimed, and a clear shot. I let fly and to my horror the rocket passed underneath the topsafety bar of the vehicle, through the driver and gunner, and out the other side! However luck was to make ammends when an enemy tank which was called in to take us out got heavily damaged, and the driver bailed. One of the other guys hopped out. I quickly jumped in to rescue it, just as Lago was screaming out to save the tank. I did a quick scan and saw a supply crate nearby, backing up to get repairs just as SL Lago ran forward to give us some repairs. Now with me in the tank and Sabre6 in the APC we were just getting harder and harder!

It was at this point that the enemy switched tactics and decided to hold off from the main assaults and get infantry in close from the south, which was a bit of a blind spot to us. It would have worked quite well I think, but they were unlucky that we had two pieces of armour, and the infantry began to die in droves. Apo did a superb job keeping the enemy aircraft off of Sabre6 and I, and then did even better by flanking the infantry that the armour had pinned down to sweep them out. However one push was a little too much, as the enemy switched tactics to focus on me (knowing they would get the tank back). We repelled the attack, but I died. This was the second disappointing action for me, as I really should have had sense enough to use Sabre6 as a sacrifice (knowing we got him and his APC back) instead of trying to repel the attack.

Eventually they pushed enough at us that we were completely over-run. Superbly Bommando had encountered for this, and the squads seemed to switch clockwise one flag, still putting us 4-3 up, and still giving us the ticket bleed. Even here I feel we acquitted ourselves well. Lago kept his head down allowing us to maintain the pressure on them, and keep their additional forces that were used to gain the flag. This lasted for about 2 minutes, which hopefully kept them from reinforcing elsewhere. It was a nice strong win. 42nd man of the match has to go to Lago for his fantastic SL, a clear head, and well given orders.


Conclusion

I think the 42nd should be pleased with how they performed. Overall we only failed 3 objectives in the entire scrim (failed 1st assault of NW flag on Karkand, failed assault of centre flag on Dalian Plant late on, and loss of the NE flag on Dalian Plant). I'm sure other squads also had a similar success rate, and we also thank all of them for working well with us, and saving our asses when we needed it! There are obviously things that we would look to improve upon, but I have to say that considering a lot of our in game squads are complaining about how 'not ready' we are, when it comes down to the cruch the general good play on TG shows what can be done when everyone has the same teamwork ethos.


Finally of course a HUGE thanks to AGE who were both full of ability and ideas. I'm sure both communities will take a lot from this scrim, and learn a lot on how to improve. No doubt the next scrim will be even closer!

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AzrealDarkmoon

Just a few thoughts on how the game I COed, Daqing Oil Fields played out. Bom asked me to command shortly before the start of the first game and I agreed Knowing I had a decent amount of experience playing the map. As opposed to the other maps its a more open map with a lot more free roaming associated with it. My sound settings only allow me to be in BF or Teamspeak, not both so I was talking to Bom when Apo came in and informed me the game was starting in a minute, so I hopped in with like 30 seconds left before the start so I was slow on the get go.

Quickly I identified where I wanted everyone to go. My general strategy is hold the middle 3, with the most important asset being the flag south of the towers. All the squads did superbly and we settled in pretty well, for the beginning of the game they did not hit the middle and there was a nice firefight over to the west side. For the first 1/3 of the game the focused on the middle and west, I beleive it was squads 6 and 2 that held onto those and encountered a good constant rush from the UCB. John Can with squad 1 I beleive did an excellent job of holding the southern flag, which is key to my strategy. I think the flag only was in danger towards the end and then it seemed like they were hitting hard at that point.

The east was a constant push there, great defense on that point. The middle was an interesting place on the map, since it is an important point but its not as important as people think. I think if Bommando had been commanding he would not have even bothered with it, but it is crucial to keep it as long as you can before the enemy overuses their assets on the point, then I hit the periphery. We took it initially, partway through the game they took it and held it for most of the game, it bore the brunt of my artillery. The enemy commander seemed to focus on one point at a time and hit it hard then move to another, fortunatly I had a squad that could back up any squad in a minutes notice.

Squad 5, or my utility squad became my demolitions, defense, offense and assistance squad all rolled into one. Wherever there was a hotspot I knew they would be there to assist wherever need be. Hats off to the utility squad. Also air assets deserve special mention, I am not the best CO when it comes to air but these guys were always willing to go where need be and they always got the job done.

Has a CO you sometimes get into that intense game where you don't even notice the tickets, you just focus on the enviroment and the plan. All I knew it was a close game for a while and then I looked up and we were ahead by 80ish tickets, we never relinquished that lead.

Had a great time, and hats off to Bom and Apo for excellently COed matches and all who attended the skirmish.

Az

John CANavar

Just like the other COs of our team, you did great AzrealDarkmoon. You gave clear and specific orders and radio channel was clear (I guess you were also using the B key to talk to squads)

At one time, you ordered me to send an armor unit to backup the central flag and I guess it was a very timely decision. Unfortunately fire team bravo (our tank) had to deal with a strong resistance (air and armor assets) en route and could not reach to target, but they did their best under those circumstances...

StrikeFear

Ok, here's the obligatory monstrous, technical, and intimidating post by StrikeFear, rambling on about the jets.

I know this is a long read. I apologize, but I've trimmed it to the bare essentials. Please - COs and squad leaders, read this thread so you are informed and can help the air force integrate with the TG armed forces and not just be some unattached vehicles in the air above you.

First I want to say that I'm surprised I haven't heard any criticism or complaints from the squads about the poor air support, because, aside from Mishkan's excellent flying, I think our coverage was fairly substandard. I think we neither bombed enough nor protected you from bombing enough. I expect great improvement in the future.

Commanders, don't take anything in this debrief personally. There's no judgement or criticism here, just laying out the facts so we can improve.

NOTE: This entire debrief is written from the perspective of the air squadron. So keep in mind that I'm aware that strategy is a matter of balancing priorities, and what the jets want isn't always what the jets gets.

Outline:

1. Opening notes
   1. First gauge of competency
   2. Pilot Skill
   3. Squadron tactics
   4. AA positions
   5. Opposing air force.
2. Comments - Daqing Oilfields
3. Comments - Dalian Plant
4. Conclusions for future consideration
5. End Notes
   1. Argument for SL-requested air strikes
   2. Air strike protocol (SLs)
   3. Air strike protocol (COs)

Content:

1. Opening notes
   1. First gauge of competency
      First combat sortie.
      The 531st is still VERY new to operating as a coordinated unit. Tactics, ideas, SOPs and procedures to coordinate with the rest of the team are still brand new. Unlike the infantry squads who have lots of opportunities to work together and typically pull from experience in other tactical FPS games, the 531st is, in many ways, paving new ground.
      As such, we would've been pleased to simply hold our own. But I think we might have come out a little ahead, overall. Please do your best to support our growth as a squadron, and try to work with us as we experiment with ideas we think will support the TG armed forces (like, for instance, SLs calling air strikes via teamspeak). http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlefield-2-general-discussion/58463-sls-pilots-get-set-up-call-air-strikes.html
   2. Pilot Skill
      It's a whole different world at 5,000 feet.
      Because your team has only 1-2 jets, and the other team typically has the same, pilot skill is crucial. The enemy jets are likely going to oppose your air force directly, so if you can't outgun them, you are likely going to lose. In an infantry squad, you can rely on your teammates, and if you go down, there are 5 more. If they go down, there is another nearby friendly squad.
      But in the air, it's YOUR skill which is going to make it or break it for your team in the air.
      The AGE pilots were excellent. They had clearly chosen well from among their members to represent them. By my estimation, the pilots we put in the cockpits for the scrim were slightly better.
   3. Squadron Tactics
      We didn't have any real sound tactics, and certainly hadn't practiced them enough (we've only had one practice). So we can only improve from here.
      We're not really sure yet what balance to use when assigning missions to aircraft. (Does the fighter protect our bomber? Or go after theirs? does the bomber help out with AA? When? Who's the priority enemy target, the fighter or bomber?)
      In short, we don't yet have a good air force strategy, so unlike the ground forces, which have mature, practiced strategies, we're still pretty clueless. We're working on it, believe me.
   4. AA positions
      AGE was very good at manning EVERY AA position they had control over. I was actually ASTOUNDED. NEVER have I encountered SO MUCH air opposition! It seemed like I heard the lock tone constantly the entire map. It would appear they made it part of their strategy. I suggest we work harder at that.
   5. Opposing air force.
      Along with the notes on the importance of Pilot Skill and manning up AA positions... Consider that during our normal TG server play, whether you have an air force at all, much less a competent one, is a matter of luck. So the opposing air force has free reign. Not so in a community vs community scrim. They WILL have an air force. They WILL NOT suck. They WILL BE gunning for your jets and bombing your armor.
      So, what we're used to, is that it doesn't matter much if you man up the AA, or if you keep someone manning the 2 USS Essex anti-air stations. In a scrim, I suggest that it does matter, and we might consider dedicating a player to an anti-air role. I think VMFA-531 can prove that it's worth it.
   
   
2. Comments - Daqing Oilfields
   Good
   1. Mishkan. Bravo-zulu pilot. Fantastic "up-time".
   2. The initial setup with Mishkan in fighter, since he was more effective in that role than I was.
   Bad
   1. The Pilots failed to follow our simple wingman tactics.
   2. No gunner for the bomber. We requested, via CO and TS, a volunteer to gun the bomber. No on volunteered, which is certainly the prerogative of all players. However, you also suffered the associated consequence. You should also know that (for whatever reason), the enemy bomber appeared to have no gunner. That means if we had manned one up, we would have had a SERIOUS air support advantage.
      This should have all been established prior to the map anyway - but RL issues made my 10 min break go right up to the wire. My bad.
   3. Early game issues.
      Early in the game, we didn't own the south base with the smokestacks. It's real hard to bomb that spot, since you have to fly between the stacks, and a mobile AA spawns there.
      Also early in the game, we didn't own the base west of that - which also spawns mobile AA. Those two sites can get locks on jets (or fire missiles that will follow them) all the way to our airstrip. If China owns either of those spots, it can be very difficult to operate. Owning both creates a "no fly zone."
   4. Commander didn't know air strike protocol and strike requests were verbose. I educated him, of course. See notes below.
   5. Commander rarely called in air strikes. Those that were called were against helos (which should be secondary - the jet's strength is armor targets, and there are a lot more of them). See notes below.
   
   
3. Comments - Dalian Plant
   Good
   1. Mishkan. 'nuff said.
   Bad
   1. The Pilots failed to follow our simple wingman tactics.
   2. AA not manned up enough. One of the points of the strategic briefing included owning 3 CPs with AA stations. (1, however, is pretty vulnerable to ground attack)
   3. Commander didn't request enough air strikes. Didn't always specify target type. See notes below.
   
   
4. Conclusions for future consideration
   1. We have a LOT to learn. We need to work on individual skills, tactics, strategy, priorities, communications. The works. On the other hand, we already don't suck.
   2. COs can't make air strike requests. I'm convinced. There are a lot of reasons. (Detailed discussion is below, if you care. If you're a CO, SL or pilot, you care.) Instead, we need to move to SL-requested air strikes.
   3. SL-requested air strikes - different for TG-play or TG-scrim. As you know, we've worked out some TS stuff to help with air strike requests. We don't need that in the scrim. Better to put all the SLs in the Scrim command channel along with the pilots. If an SL can't get on TS, put a squad member in there as a "relay." That won't work in TG-play, because all teams, all servers, share the same TS channel.
   4. Air strike protocol (examples below). We need to all get on board with this. Air strikes can often happen within 10 seconds. If you can't make your request in under 10 seconds, you are causing a problem. This includes Commanders, who can do it in 2 words. See my protocol examples below.

Argument for SL-requested air strikes

1. COs can't do it fast enough.
   With fighters, we can strike every 20-30 seconds. COs are too busy.
   With the bomber, we can strike every 10 seconds. COs are too busy to issue the jets orders every 10 seconds.
   LISTEN! The COs really don't actually want this job!
   (NOTE: There are occasions where the CO needs to designate a priority air strike that no SL would call in.)
2. COs don't have enough information.
   They can use the targets that players have spotted - but the jets can see that too.
   They can use the UAV - but the jets can see that too.
   They can use the scan - but it doesn't tell them what is armor or helo or infantry.
   They can use what the squads tell them - but the squads can just tell the jets.
   In EVERY case, there is ANOTHER problem. The CO doesn't know what the priority targets are. We may all see that someone has spotted a tank off on the horizon. But ONLY a squad knows (within the 20-second window), WHICH target they NEED eliminated to complete their mission.
   The jets don't know. The CO doesn't know ALL THE TIME. The information must be shared for us to be effective. If someone goes through the trouble of hitting the TS PTT key to call an airstrike, we darn well know they need it, and we WILL BE THERE.
   Otherwise, we spend our time wandering around wondering if the kills we get make any difference other than costing the enemy a ticket or 2.
3. Proof is in the pudding.
   During the scrim, a CO previously commended for his use of air squads, and another CO who actually has spent time flying - both of these COs recognized for excellence, one of them determined to keep in mind to use the jet squad well - failed to use the jet squad with ANY reasonable effectiveness. NO DISCREDIT TO THEM. None at all. I am convinced that the tools necessary to do that job well just aren't in the CO role. They didn't, because they couldn't.
   The best thing a CO can do for his squads concerning the jets is say, "Here squads, here are some jets. Use them as you see fit, until I need them for something specific."

Protocol for SL-requested air strikes
First, read this thread:
http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlefield-2-general-discussion/58463-sls-pilots-get-set-up-call-air-strikes.html

Successful protocol
SL2: Squad 2 requesting air strike.
531: Airstrike available, Squad 2.
SL2: Tank, northeast of our position.
531: Airstrike ETA 20 seconds.
SL2: Airstrike positive. (or "Airstrike successful." or "Good kill." or "Target down.")

Once familiarity with the protocol is established, it can be shortened. This is helpful, because air strikes can often be completed inside 10 seconds.
Successful protocol - abbreviated
SL2: Squad 2 air strike.
531: Go squad 2.
SL2: Tank, northeast.
531: ETA 10 seconds.
SL2: Airstrike positive.


Special conditions:

Not available
SL2: Squad 2 air strike.
531: Negative, Squad 2. (or "Airstrike not available, Squad 2.")

Airstrike failed
SL2: Squad 2 air strike.
531: Go squad 2.
SL2: Enemy armor, northeast of our position.
531: ETA 10 seconds.
SL2: Airstrike negative. (Give new target info)
Examples: Target moving north. Target same location. Wrong target killed. (We hit the jeep instead of the Tanks. Oops.)

Abort
SL2: Squad 2 air strike.
531: Go squad 2.
SL2: Enemy armor, northeast of our position.
531: ETA 30 seconds.
SL2: Abort air strike, target down. (Target has been killed already)


Protocol for CO-ordered air strikes
CO: Creates attack marker waypoint
CO: "Target: helo" (NOTE: 2 words. Loud and clear.)
531: "ETA: 20 seconds"

There are only 2 excuses for not complying with a COs air strike order:
1. Currently dogfighting ("Strike unavailable-dogfight")
2. Jet is down ("Strike unavailable-jet down")

If either is the case, report that to the CO instead of giving an ETA.

__________________
"You live and learn. Or you don't live long."
- Lazarus Long

Ragged

Excellent post as usual StrikeFear. Some really good points in there and we should all try to utilize the fixed wing support much better.

I want to ask what the protocol for requesting support against an enemy bomber is though. On Dalian we got whacked over and over by a guy in a bomber. We could spot him but of course he was gone 10 seconds later. We clearly didn't have air supremecy on that map and it hurt bad. The armor wasn't really our problem, we handled that pretty well even without air strikes, but that bomber had to go.

Since the CO can't really give a specific point where the enemy bombers/fighters will be should we just call for something like "Combat Airspace Control" on TS? Like "Squad 2 requesting CAC" That would help distinguish between the need for a bombing run and the need for someone to clear the skies.

__________________
Never lock the dogs when the wolf is in the darkness.
[age-c1][conduct]

Bommando

OMG! Christ on a bike Strike! You're hurting my already fragile mind. I think I'll go play Tetris for a while.

Now I understand that you are not criticizing the COs and I take what you say constructively. I'm not sure how many times you have been CO on a 64 player map, but let me give you a slice of 60 seconds as CO:

• Scan and register troop movements and positions.
• Determine most ideal artillery target by concentration on blips.
• Zoom in on this target to check whether moving or static. If not primarily infantry or target is moving, zoom again and choose a more static target.
• Place UAV where most useful between friendly and hostile troops.
• Spot smaller troop concentrations for squads.
• Ask if supplies are needed.
• Drop supplies for squad 3.
• Inform squad 1 of incoming from NW.
• Inform squad 9 of incoming from W.
• Inform squad 5 of incoming from shed to the SW.
• Spot as many tanks and attack helos as you can.
• Inform squad 2 that their supply request was already given to squad 3 and take note to drop supplies to squad 2 in 20 seconds upon supply recharge.
• Check whether artillery was effective and warn nearby friendly squad if not.
• Respond to air support request from squad 1.
• Give waypoint to Jets squad. If target type is available, state it.
• Give waypoint to Attack Helo squad. Tell them which squad needs support.
• Tell squad 6 that air support has been given to squad 1 due to heavier troop concentrations.
• Deny artillery strike for squad 5, since it has been used to the NW of squad 1.
• Scan has now recharged. Do some more spotting while waiting for other assets to recharge.

All of this is assuming everything is going to plan. If things aren't going your way, then it's a different story altogether.

Now with every rotation, I may or may not see the need to assign new orders to one or more squads. I might also not receive any requests for air support.

Rest assured that all squads know that air support is available and request it if they need it. A request for air support NEVER goes unanswered. When you asked squads to mount up on the AA, I passed it on immediately. When you asked for a target type, on two separate occasions I had stated the target already, but you must not have heard me. I almost always said "new infantry target" or "new armour target".

Take special note of the fact that we were well and truly whooping ass for the entire Dalian Plant map, so I simply didn't feel as much urgency as I would have in a close game. I was content to see the jets and helos take initiative, look at the UAV and choose targets of opportunity for most of the game. The needs of the infantry took precedence here because I wanted them to hold their CPs, which they did with great success. If they were in trouble, I called in the air.

As SL on Daqing, I called for air support many times and most times I got it. It saved my butt, so I was happy with the CO's response on this map as well.

Also take note that comms are two-way. If you believe you are being under-utilised, then use your commo rose: "requesting new orders" or just remind the CO by voice that you are still there. You may feel like you do not need to remind him, but you are 1 squad among 6-8 others, so a little coaxing might be needed.

We won the map 298 - 0, so we must have been doing something right.

Again, don't take my comments the wrong way, but until you sit in that chair in a large-scale competitive game, then I don't believe you can wholly understand the logistics involved.

You guys did an awesome job and I felt that every single person on that 32 man team was putting in 110%

I do believe that there is room for SLs to make direct air-strike requests, as long as the CO's orders take precedence. Personally, I don't see why it's any slower to follow this protocol:

SL: CO, we need air support on incoming (infantry, armour, helo).
CO: rgr that.
CO: Jets squad, we need anti(infantry, armour, helo) air support here. *Sets waypoint and places UAV if available).
JETS SL: rgr.

That does not seem hard to me. If the SLs are not using this system, then why would they be any more likely to use a direct system?

The jury is still out.

EDIT: I understand that the crux of our post is to state that the CO is simply too busy to call in air strikes and to some extent that is true. Having said this, if I received even 4 times as many air strike requests during Dalian, I could easily have complied. I could comfortably issue a strike every 60 seconds during my standard asset rotation *if it were requested*. If SLs are not making use of existing avenues (the CO) to request air strikes, then why would they make use of a direct system?

There is definitely a place for what you suggest, but I don't believe we are there quite yet. I am interested in trying it by all means.

DigitalAssassin

I was SL of the 2nd (i.e. non-Bommando) 7th squad Saturday. I had 2 non-supporting members (one became a supporting member after, I think the fun we had Saturday pushed him over the edge) but they fit right in with our strategy and followed orders to the letter.

Daqing Oilfields was by far the most exciting for us. The eastern flag was our objective the entire game and we must have been the reason it was comparatively quiet on the west side because they were hitting us with everything they had. At one point we had their attack chopper, 3 buggies and 2 tanks trying to take us out and we got a fair share of their artillery strikes throughout the game.

I tend to be a more conservative player when I'm SL and it worked to our advantage because even though we lost the flag a few times it wasn't their's for more than a couple minutes because I was using all of the tree coverage and hills to provide a close re-spawn.

With the amount of armor they were sending in I knew we'd lose it at least for a little while so I stayed just out of sight. We were able to turn the flag back so quickly the first time I just played the same strategy the rest of the map. It worked quite nicely, because before they could get a decent defense set up we were assaulting them and taking it back.

Feedback on my SL responsibilities is hereby requested and appreciated, bad as well as good. I believe it was my squad that left a vehicle or two unattended during the evening so that will be a focus for me in the future.

__________________

Bommando

I think you did a great job DA. You guys got the brunt of the action on Daqing and never let up for a second. Likewise you held the SE on Dalian with equally strong defence.

Sorry for jumping down your throat about the empty vehicle as CO. I happened to be zoomed in at the time and when I saw it happen, I was really afraid we would lose that SE flag because of it. You guys took down the tank within seconds, so no harm done. This was the *single* slip up in an otherwise exemplary set of rounds.

Judging by your performance, I'd say your squadmembers would be equally happy with you

John CANavar