Seraosha

UCB Assaults
Players acting within their commander's authorization MAY attack structures (UAV Trailer, Radar Dish & Artillery) within the enemy UCB, vehicles within the UCB are OFF LIMITS. These attackers may also STAY in the opposition's UCB to make sure the destroyed structures STAY destroyed. It is the responsibility of the commander to determine if maintaining an assault on the enemy UCB is tactically viable and strategically advisable.

It is the responsibility of the team which owns the UCB to play the necessary defense to remove the attack from their UCB, even if it means pulling soldiers, or even squads, out of the field of battle and "back to base."

Could I please receive further clarification of the bold text as to how to operate in the enemies UCB? Eliminating enemy assets like helicopters, tanks, jeeps, AA etc is not acceptible? You can't drive away in a tank thats sitting there? You can't put C4 on the BlackHawk in anticipation of it flying over multiple CP's? You can't place landmines under the wheels?

Just want to get this straight, so there is no confusion. As a Scout for the US Army, "stealing" enemy assets was called "reconning", and we did it (as OPFOR) every chance we got. Getting back behind enemy lines, reconning a hummer and lighting up the enemies TOC was not only fun as hell, but tacticaly/strategicly sound actions. It forced "Blue Force" to use defensive emplacements on their forward AO, and tied up enemy combatants from the front as they waited for us to infiltrate.

But that's not allowed on TG Servers?
Really?

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Telorn

It's not allowed to sit there and blow everything up the moment it spawns. It is acceptable to move in, destroy, and move out.

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Telorn

Seraosha

Thanks for the reply, but that doesn't answer the question of "vehicles being offlimits".
Thats very broad, and again man, I appreciate your response, as camping spawn points is teh lamerz, but if someone is going to get the boot for reconning a Black Hawk, I want to know before I do it on a TG server.

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asch

http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlefield-2-ranked-vanilla/56537-ucb-vehicle-thiefs.html

See if that thread helps clarify a bit as it has some examples. We'll work on clarifying the wording in the SOPs.

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TEMM

I agree with Seraosha, if were moving into the UCB with the purpose of stealing and/or destroying important assets we should be allowed to. I agree with not being allowed to camp in the UCB and ruin the game for the people spawning there, but we should be allowed to take anything they arent using or protecting. If the equipment is that important to the team they should be using it or losing it.

Mateo

Destroying, not stealing. You can go into the UCB only for tactical strikes, not because the rest of your team already grabbed the jets/helos and you want one.

I disagree. Last night we had people hanging out in the hangars to grab the jets. Not acceptable, either from a command standpoint (as noted in other threads) or from a player standpoint.

Then what exactly SEPARATES TG 1000 other pubs?

Alex

How useful is that, though? If I destroy a vehicle in the UCB, it's going to spawn again in a very short amount of time. If I steal it... Well, I'm not sure what the rule is there. Does it become one of "ours" or does it still count as "theirs" for spawning purposes?

If it's still one of "theirs" then I'd want to take it and tell my SL that our squad or team has another asset. If our squad doesn't need it then my SL should tell the commander who would then tell me where to drop the asset off. This might not matter so much for rolling stock (Hummers, buggys and whatnot) but denying the other side their tanks, APCs, jets and helos for a while is a big deal.

SmokingTarpan

How fun is it for the defending team to be pushed back into their UCB and be confronted not only by all of the enemy vehicles, but all of their own as well?

TEMM

Whats the difference if you destroy all of their vehicles as opposed to jacking them. Either way they dont get to use them.

I questioned what was wrong with opportunity stealing or going on a raid to steal whatever resources are available. Im not condoning UCB camping, but when in rome. If you are in the UCB to destroy stuff you should be able to steal it instead. That doesnt mean if the stuff isnt there you should sit and wait for it.

The fact that if the powers that be decided to allow stealing vehicles from UCB's but still not allow UCB camping that the rule would probably work and be enforced.

I do agree that people loitering around in the enemies base to pick up vehicles is rather stupid, but as i said in this post and the last post, if my mission brings me to the UCB and theres a vehicle there, what is the difference between me hopping in and using it against them and me destroying it.

[EDIT]

Its their own fault if they werent using the vehicles. The vehicles are there to be used and if they are just sitting there someone will use them, be it friendly or enemy. Chances are if you are trapped in your UCB and the enemy has your planes, had you been using them, you would have had the option of the pilots capping another spawn point. By not using the planes you give the enemy the opportunity to not only steal them but to lock you into your base by ground and air superiority.

asch

There may be moves that are "tactical" in theory but we've found in reality they are much different. And I mean the reality of the game. There are game limitations, etc. that lead us to restrict outright stealing of vehicles in a UCB.

One thing TG was built on was that we wanted great "battlefield" action and not "supply-line" action. Restricting outright UCB vehicle stealing is one of the rules we have put in place to keep the battlefield action intense.

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TEMM

I dont want anyone to think that because I am questioning this rule that I will openly disobey it while playing. I just like to have my arguement heard.

asch

Destroyed vehicles will respawn. Stolen ones will not respawn until they are destroyed.

If a squad is in a UCB to destroy the assets and has completed that mission, they may take a vehicle to leave the UCB.

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SmokingTarpan

Here's the flaw with that.

So a team goes into an enemy base to destroy infrastructure, and they decide to hang around to keep it down. Well, somewhere off across the map an enemy plane or tank gets shot down, and respawns. The special ops team sees it and says "hey Joe, take that plane, they're not using it!" Then this situation repeats until each man of the invading team takes away an important vehicle, leaving the enemy with none.

We've all been in a situation where a vehicle spawns at a capturable flag, and it becomes a race between the defenders and attackers to see who snags it. I dread this happening at a UCB. One of the things that I really like about TG is the fact that if my team has a UCB, I know that I will have a mostly safe place to spawn that also contains assets that will allow me a chance to get back into the fight again if things go bad.

A hard line needs to be drawn in the sand and held; too much wiggle room will allow people "legit" and "tactical" reasons to spawn camp. I can quickly see the above argument of "it's their own fault for not using the vehicle" degenerate into "it's their own fault for not being fast enough to kill me before I killed them as soon as they spawned".

Telorn

Mind you that doesn't mean 1 vehicle PER squad member. That means enough vehicles for you all to fit in.

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Telorn

TEMM

There we go Thats all i wanted to hear.