SmokingTarpan

I encourage you to read this thread to understand what I was doing: http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlefield-2-tactics-missions-discussion/57272-tarpan-r-l.html

I attempted to explain to the CO what my purpose was, and I thought he understood at first. Then he started telling squads to join my squad to fill it out, which defeats the entire purpose of my usefulness. I attempted to take a moment to 1) clarify my squads purpose and 2) offer the CO a chance to disband my squad as a whole.

Unfortunately, he either had me muted or he was ignoring me outright. Besides being extremely frustrating, this was especially annoying when, on Mashtuur City, my 3-man squad was supposed to act as a distraction to let a 6-man squad take a flag. Suddenly, in the middle of the firefight, I see the squad I'm supposed to be supporting start attacking a completely different flag, which left my squad completely surrounded and cut off in the middle of the city. Big props to DrunkenSoul and Nemesis, because the three of us managed to hold our position against a tank, humvees and infantry for 5-7min until we were overrun (I ended up running completely out of ammo, it was very Blackhawk Down-ish). During the firefight, I continually tried to raise the CO on comms to ask what was going on, but he never responded to me, only other squads.

When the map changed to Karkand, I again asked the CO for a moment to explain my operational status. He started talking over me eventually (the explanation took at most 5-7 seconds), so I don't think he understood my purpose. The night ends with me being kicked from the server right as we were about to take a flag. I'm not sure that an admin did it (it said I had been kicked from the server by punkbuster due to a prior ban/kick), but I decided to end my night there because my level of fun had gone into the negative.

To the people "screaming" at me in game over text chat to let them into my squad: I apologize for not responding very much. It's very hard to type and shoot at the same time, and I was shooting almost constantly because my squad was being used counter to its purpose. It was akin to using a wrench to break concrete instead of a jackhammer. I did type several times what I was attempting to do, but apparently no one saw it.

To my squad: Sorry I bailed, but I was kicked. I just couldn't return due to my level of frustration.

All in all, I got about 1 hour's playtime on what was supposed to be one of the more fun server nights. The treatment I received in general tonight has high chances of keeping me from attempting my new tactic again, because it doesn't seem like people can handle it.

Disclaimer: This post is not intended as a flame, insult, finger-point or whack at the hornet's nest. This was an attempt to explain to people what was going on with my squad tonight because, outside of my squad, no one seemed to have a clue or to want one.

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[squadl]
"I am the prettiest african-american, vietnamese..cong..person." -SugarNCamo

DrunkenSoul

being part of the squad tonight, i realize that the idea is a great one (if the other members of the entire team understand whats going on). From being a squad member, it seemed like the CO was telling us to go on a 3 man sucide mission to a flag defended by 2 squads when in fact we should have been going to some of the rear flags and letting our squads spawn there once we capped them.

I (along with the other squad members) were fustrated because this three man fast moving squad was not given permission to run efficently. I give props to Tarpan and Nemesis for at least trying to do what was possible given the circumstance.

Tarpan, it seemed like you were one of the many kicked. After you got kicked and before Nemesis unlocked the squad, me and him actually did what the squad was supposed to do and we took a humvee to the other side of the map (west side) and capped 2 flags (rather than go for a flag surrounded by 10+ people). This I think is the reason why we ended up coming back and winning because it allowed our team to start at more flags and it made the enemy less concentrated on the east side.

I dont think you should give up on the idea, it one only this time what we had a CO that didnt like the idea of the squad. Next time I believe that you should rename the squad from Tarpan-R because everyone wants to join Tarpans squad to something like 3manonly or 3manrapid

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1st Mechanized Infantry Platoon (C-Team)


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SmokingTarpan

Point taken. I wanted to name the squad TARPAN-R to let people know I was on the field, and I was operating as a rapid squad. If I do try this again in the future, I'll simply name the squad RAPID.

Personally, as much as I know people like to join my squad, I don't think they were trying to join just because I was there. The CO was telling people to join my squad, and never gave me a real chance to explain or operate. I actually like that CO, he's done a good job in the past.

Glad to hear we won. The MEC was basically screwed from the get-go because of the low freeze time. Within about 30-40sec of the round start, the USMC had captured two flags on the east river. Someone loaded up in an APC and went traveling, and the MEC had only 2-3 guys in the game at that point.

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[squadl]
"I am the prettiest african-american, vietnamese..cong..person." -SugarNCamo

AntiVisual

I enjoyed killing hte lot of you.

Nemesis

Don't sell yourself short here Tarpan...it's only due to the fact that you're leading a squad that so many people want into it. Myself included. Including tonight, I've yet to have one bad experience in any squad of yours that I've had the pleasure of being in.

It's funny, because like Drunken said as soon as you were kicked the CO says "Squad 1, here's your chance to show me what you've been talking about" and let us loose behind the lines. Had to wonder at the timing of it since it happened not 30 seconds after you were disconnected.

The thing is, it worked like a charm. We drew the USMC attention away from the bridge choke point and pulled them back to counter our quick flag taking...also allowing our team to rally.

It's not because Drunken and I did anything different....and I'm not taking anything away from the great job everyone did on that map....but we were allowed to do what you wanted us to do all along and, IMO, it made all the difference.

I felt bad that you weren't in the squad and I did get pressured to open it up after you left....so after we took a few flags, I gave in opened it up. Just didn't seem right to me to take over your squad/idea like that. I was booted myself at the start of the next map as I was forming a new squad so as not to ruin your good name.

Don't get down on things. Because, when you get right down to it, it's a great idea...especially if/when it's taken advantage of by whoever is in the CO chair. And that's something that you can only control so far. Hopefully, as people start seeing the squad running, they'll see how effective it can be if used in the way you intended it.

Thanks to both you and Drunken for kicking butt under some trying circumstances. It would be my honor to roll with you anytime.

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SmokingTarpan

Although having a CO that wasn't in exactly the same boat with things (being ignored on comms didn't make things better) was annoying, that only bothered me so far. What made me decide to finally just give up on the night was the constant stream of unpleasantness flowing my way from the general public.

People were constantly asking to be let into my squad, and then getting pissy that I didn't send them an invite. Multiple times I typed "I'm working as a 3-man rapid squad, sorry" in order to explain things, but either people didn't see or had selective vision. One guy even typed in "Stop talking to Tarpan, he's not responding to ANYONE". Sorry, but I'm not going to explain myself five dozen times in the middle of a fight. Poor Robocop even chimed in and tried to explain things on my behalf (he wasn't in my squad), but no one listened to him either.

Oh well, another day down.

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[squadl]
"I am the prettiest african-american, vietnamese..cong..person." -SugarNCamo

Alpocalypse

The 3 man squad is a neat idea, but if the commander wants to consolidate squads then I think it should be his call. After all, TG guidelines state squad leaders will obey the commanders orders and so forth on down through the ranks.

Experiment with the 3 man squad concept with a commander who will work with you, but if the commander wants full squads to help with micro management, I say help him out. Or how about splitting a 6 man squad into 2 three man elements operating independantly or in conjunction with each other? This would allow you to test out the 3 man concept and still have a full squad where no one gets miffed or excluded.

-Alpoc

Kojio

I've had my fair share of COs on this server who become ignorant and selfish over a simple game, and get kick-happy while they could spend time doing a better job. Whenever that happens, I just switch teams.

Lagomorph

I initially tried to get in to your squad on mashtuur while the player count was still down around 12, unfortunately for me I was just too slow on the draw. ;P
Later on on Karkand I led a great squad (Actually multiple thanks to PB) and as much as I could tried to help you and about 2-3 others who knew what you were doing explain it to the folks complaining. Actually I probably didn't help much due to the lack of empty game time a SL on karkand gets.

Anyway, don't get down on yourself or your idea. I think it is indeed a very good way of utilizing two previously "weak" things in BF2; pint sized squads and the often misused humvees/buggies. This was easily evidenced by the change that your squad made on that map once they were called to do their thing. I recall seeing your name come up on that long list of kicked players and then moments later hearing the commander call for your squad. =/

- Good work, don't give up!

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JayhawkGrunt

I think this idea could be used in another way that I have wanted to experiment with in the past, but have not had a chance to do so.

Lets say your squad is charged with defending a rear flag that is important, but is not and has not been under direct attack.

You could split your six man squad into two 3 man teams and have one stay back with c4 on the flag and mines on the main roads in and then use the other 3 man fire team as a rapid response/backup unit for other squads. The three man team could mount up in a buggy and assist another squad by hitting a flag under assualt from another flank or by assisting with the defense of a capped flag that is under assault.

If the flag they are protecting comes under fire, they can go back or spawn back on the flag or their squad leader. Otherwise, they may provide a little needed punch to take an objective or defend a different flag thus using team manpower more effectively.

Wulfyn

The problem with that JayHawk, is that the squad still operates in a different way. I've split off members of the squad before (and so has Tarpan from the reports I hear on the forum here), but it is still an auxilliary to your main force. It also takes extra attention away from SL trying to direct 2 'squads', or you need a 2ic to command the other squad, but then orders can get convoluted. Or you aren't really working together, which makes it pointless being in a single squad. It's not a bad idea, in fact it is a very good one, but it is not what Tarpan is trying to achieve.


Tarpan, the only advice (well not really advice, but support) I can offer is that you are not under an obligation to let people into your squad when that would ruin the point of your squad. I can only assume that the people that desperately want to be in your team (can't think why :P hehe) know you from the forums. Thus sooner or later they will stumble upon this post or your one in the tactics forum, and hopefully understand what it is you are trying to do. And if they understand it, and still want to scream at you... well then maybe they don't deserve to be in your squad?


And although I agree that renaming your squad might lessen the screaming, I don't see why you should have to call it something different just to stop getting grief. Teamwork is sometimes about doing things you don't like. I have disbanded my squad to join another before (losing my S/L role). I didn't like it, but that's the way it was. And it certainly seems from your idea that not joining your squad is a teamwork issue. Going up to 4 would give them a crap game, you a headache, and ruin the squad.


The CO is a trickier one however...

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Solo_Dallas

Dear Tarpan,
while I never fought nor with neither against you (European player and my GF wants me in bed with her by those very hours), I need to let you know that your behaviour is to say the least, responsible.
To even post here the day after to let people know what was going on? Taking a conscious responsibility of your own actions is not at all to overlook in my terms.

Wishing all internet players were like you I'm taking my hat off (I don't wear one but imagine it please).

EDIT BTW: If one thinks being serious about his own gaming will detract from the enjoyment, please think again. It's quite the opposite passed the 14 years old age.

Cann0n_F0dder

Tarpan

I am a noob here but I do read the forums daily. I read your orginial post and think that your idea for a quick strike squad is a superb one. You, and your squad bailed us out on the Kirkland map last night. I am very sad that you couldn't see the results of your efforts. I wish I could offer a solution to this prob, but I am just here to support you and your theory


Milkserip

walrus

Tarpan, was this on the 64-player public?

DrunkenSoul

yea, it was on the 64 player public....all this stuff was happening after the PW was put up, but im not sure what was happening before the password was placed on the server.

It was kind of fun trying to distract/run away from the humvees. What hurt us was that once we were out of nades, it was hard trying to kill the guy in the .50 cal

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1st Mechanized Infantry Platoon (C-Team)


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