khaerus

Mostly I agree, and believe me, if we get a guy TKing on purpose, he'll take a vacation. As for why we don't discuss it, I think of it this way: If we won't allow a person to bring a ban discussion into the public forums, why would we do that to someone else? The same reasons we don't allow that kind of discussion are mostly the same exact reasons why it would be bad for us as admins to air dirty laundry. I'm willing to let a banned player go quietly into the good night, and spend my energy on the positives here.

As far as guys not listening/playing poorly/all that: We've been through new player influxes plenty of times, and we always do pretty well building a solid player base out of the new guys. We'll get through this time fine, too, as long as we get the experienced players calling out the errors as they see 'em. "Reporting" really does work wonders.

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TG Primer--TG FAQs--BF2 Rules/SOPs--TeamSpeak--Admin!

ikonic

Khaerus has hit it on the nose. Keep in mind that the game environment is what you allow it to be. Admins can only w/k/b what they see or what they are told and are around to enforce the rules when called upon -- so if you let dirty hooligan players do their thing definitely let an admin know by PMs, Contact an Admin forum, TS and/or Xfire/Other IM methods in order to maintain a healthy in-game experience.

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imnotacanadian

Project Reality doesn't even have this problem, and name tags don't show up for enemy or friendly troops. You either have to recognize the uniform from 400-500 yards off, or pull up your map (as there is no minimap anymore) and check and see if you have any friendlies lined up in your field of view. There are also times when things are happening quickly in urban combat and you come around a corner and to your suprise you find a squad of friendlies, but rarely is somebody teamkilled. Most rounds have ZERO teamkills, and alot of times the tks will come from a badly thrown nade or such. I think this is due to the high awareness of the TG rules and expectations. And those that aren't get informed. Then there is the rare and extreme case of intentional teamkilling which is always taken care of immediatly via the reporting system, talking to an admin via TS, or writing down who did it so the battlerecorder can be reviewed. Any problems can be solved, I'm positive of it since we have little on the PR server.


No, it tells you who teamkilled you. It's the kills vs the enemy that don't come up. Buuut, we do have to ask who is camping the enemy main with a tank when we play Kashan, or who is sniping into the main and mining the base on Operation Ghost Train. Usually somebody will speak up or the basecamper will withdraw, but this is where the problem lies for PR.

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Braidedheadman

o rly?

Actually, that is a problem with the mod in general, if you ask me. But that's an old argument going back a long, long time referring to PR maps where so-called "main" bases were not marked as UCBs but people insisted on applying UCB rules to them anyhow. Major turn off right there. I haven't played the mod in months as I felt rules like that restricted tactical use of the map and assets too severely as whole by disallowing anything but a zerg-fest at the current "assaultable" flag(s). I've moved on, however, and don't want this to reopen that debate. I just thought I'd offer a dissenting opinion - you are in the POE forums, after all.

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ikonic

I say take it to the PR forums if there is something you don't like about it if you ask me.

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ParkBench

Interesting that Silent brought this up... This is primarily why I've been on extended leave... In the 6 months I've been part of the community... This topic comes up every so often, and we rally together to the good of the community / server. I decided this time, I put the cool aid down, and rest the headset for a bit. I won't say I haven't missed playing with all of you, and mostly hanging out long distance with some guys I think are good guys and would buy a beer if they found their way to central Maine.
but...
Its all a double edged sword. I don't like getting so p.o.'d at pubbies, reporting them and getting some kicked... then playing 8 on 8 maps. and Maybe its the natural progression of a games life... they just don't age real well... (Mosely is trying to convince me to play TF2, but I'm not buying it. I played Unreal and Quake Arena, I'm so over it) But what can you do? You spend the time and effort to make a nice field, the other kids learn about your field, and want to come play on it... they do, and they just don't take care of it like you do... sometimes you get angry / sad and you just don't play anymore. other times you take a break, hope they move onto the next field. Or you go play on someone elses field. I toyed with the idea of trying PR again... but... I just got good at not killing my own team in POE, I don't need to go TK PR team mates.

I don't have the answers, just an "I second that", long after the fact for Silent.

now 8 on 8 pirates... I'd play that.

I hope you are all well...

-pb

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Park Bench

professionally trolling the forum full time.

imnotacanadian

Hahaha. I realize I'm in the POE forum. I took a walk out of my cozy home in the PR forum and ventured into the rest of the world. I expect very different ideas, gameplay styles, and opinions, and want to hear them obviously or I wouldn't of bothered posting...but that doesn't mean anything has to get malicious or nasty. A friendly debate never hurt nobody . I do agree though that some of PR's maps limit strategical play, such as OGT, since some of the main bases (the main is defined as the last flag to go into play for either side) are in very close proximity to other flags, which by the way are assaultable at any time....just not always cappable. Most maps allow for excellent tactical manuevers and strategical play.

The reason for the UCB rules were to keep the game enjoyable. With people spawn camping your main...which is sometimes your only place to spawn...while half the map is still in play ruins gameplay. Yes, it may win the round for one team, but who wants to be on the recieving end of that? Spawn, die. Spawn, die. Yes, you do spawn and die over and over again sometimes when going up against an efficient squad on the frontlines...but that is very different, you can change the outcome of that by using different tactics and outmanuevering the other team.



No reason to. Nothing will happen there, I was just trying not to be biased and pointing out PR's flaws in gameplay that show up occasionally. I'm not complaining here.





I have never played on the TG POE server....as I don't have POE. But maybe this is what needs to be done? From what I gather the server isn't exactly full of respectable people with all the teamkilling etc. If you would only have that small portion of people still in the server after all the people who don't understand the concept of TG were removed....maybe it should be done, so the server can fill up with those that DO get the idea. Those that DO want to play like the rest of you want to. But I don't know for sure, I might have to download POE and take a peek for myself

Having a smacktard free server is a huge plus. It might stay a bit unpopulated for a little bit after getting rid of the non-rule following regulars, but soon it will fill back up with those who value the TG gameplay.


Oh yes, and one more question.
Is 8 vs 8 with tactical, strategical, smacktard free gameplay not better than 32 vs 32 with excessive teamkilling?

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Braidedheadman

^ I understand your point about the spawn camping aspect and fully support that, especially in PR with the longer spawn times. I was mainly referring to tactics involving disruption of supply lines. For instance, people giving me flak for flying over a base-not-ucb-marked-but-still-ucbs-in-people's-minds in an A10 and whacking their empty tanks, transports, and other gear or other assets before or just as they're being deployed to the frontline.

No one was being hurt who wasn't fully aware of their surroundings or spawn camped in any way, but the hue and cry that went up was near deafening. I saw it as a valid, realistic tactic and I'll note that I only pursued that tactic on maps with non-ucb bases like that desert map with the USMC airport whose name I forget. Real insurgents face that kind of pressure on a 24 hour basis. Gamers seem to think that gamey insurgents shouldn't have to, however, despite their mod's given name. "Oh noes! That's too realistic!" was their mantra as they marched the warpath against my point of view and those who felt similarly. They wanted their zerg-fest, got just what they asked for, labeled it "realistic", and that's where I took my leave.

It might be fun to debate this further, but this isn't the place for it so I'll leave it at that.

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rich73

Actually, doesn't the teamkilling level itself out soon enough since after 3 punished ones, it boots you?

DrunkenPirate

Probably just a bad run of luck, TKing in TG is pretty rare and when it does happen it's 90% accidental.
Intentional TK's are reported within 10 seconds of them happening and swift administrative action isn't far behind.
This is far better than what you would get on vanilla servers.

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