thats never really happened... - Page 3

DrunkenPirate · 05-09-2008, 04:39 AM

That's why I put the '??????'s I don't believe it's a netcode issue either but I'm not a coder so I don't know any better.

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 05-09-2008, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soulless

I'd disagree. I've had this problem on small maps with only 1 tank per side.

We played basrah's bushwack, had this happen once.

Had it happen 2 times in a row on ummmm, that one map with the train station thing in the middle as the only capable flag, 2 tanks each side, river, trees. Don't remember name.

Also, would netcode only affect POE? Maybe something in the server files or something? I've played highway to tampa both on vanilla bf2 and 21cw and have never seen or heard complaints about hit detection and there is a ton of armor on those maps.

So you have had this happen in other mods? The big problem with this particular bug is that we can not duplicate it. While we can see it again every now and then in game, there is no one thing that we can do every single time to make it happen. When we can not do that, it makes it very hard to focus on where the problem is. This is one I really want to fix, especially with Matador coming in our next patch (Armor map).

It could be something to do with the ammo switching, it could be an issue with the material ID for the tank or the shells, it could be a dozen other things.

There is another issue which I have seen as mixed up with this one. That is each static has a Level of Detail (LOD) and the farther you get from it, the less detail it will show. Some of the smaller statics will disapear entirly such as the hay bales. With that in mind, I have seen tanks fighting on Rolling Thunder at range where both tanks are visible but not the hay bales. So if one or both of the players was hiding behind the hay and not taking damage then it would appear as if the rounds were not doing damage. I am not saying this is the sole problem but it is part of it.

Soulless · 05-09-2008, 01:24 PM

I may have a demo of the basrah's bushwack incident, dunno if that would help.

I know the issue with the haystacks and all that, seen it a lot since I like long distance shooting.

I have not seen this happen in the 21cw mod which used the t72 from the USI mod.

I keep thinking it's the ammo switching as well at times, so I sit there and pound 1, then goto 2, pound 1 and see what happens. Maybe later i'll see if I can get with some fftf guys and duplicate it.

I haven't really noticed this problem shooting at any vehicles other than tanks. So it could be something wrong with the Sabot round.

I do remember one time, firing a sabot round into the ground, then it seemed like 2 times after that it would not damage enemy armor anymore. Also sometimes when it happens, it looks like it's just exploding before it actually hits the amor. I think.

Gahlas · 05-09-2008, 01:39 PM

The broken tanks is getting really frustrating for me, to the point of where I no longer want to play. It seems to happen 2/3 times I am in one, and last night it was really bad. It is not just the sabots for me either, I get it with the coaxial, HEAP rounds, the works. I have put 500 rounds into stationary guys and 10 heaps watching them fly 5 feet in the air taking no damage. It seems to happen most often on Sambir and the Map with the bridge in the center (Can't recall the name). Getting out of the tank doesn't fix it, neither does switching seats. The only cure seems to be to drive away from the location I was in.

This problem also occurs in single player. I have gotten it to happen even in choppers when I have sat them on the ground in sambir and switched to the gunners seat to engage infantry. They will just take the hits flying up in the air for hundreds or rounds with no effect. I would rather just have the rounds completely removed and replaced with sped up vanilla ones than have to deal with this. I am about done with tanks all together. I will have to use the APC where it takes 45 hits to bring down a chopper and makes me want to smash my monitor.

**HiTestFest** · 05-09-2008, 01:48 PM

At least its not me who is frustrated with being in a tank..
Sometimes i never even hear being hit.. talk about wanting to bash your monitor!!!

Smokeyandthebandit · 05-09-2008, 02:01 PM

Is it just me though, or does the hit detection bug happen the most with the T-84? (Firing the shell and it not registering that is)

Mr.McFeelme · 05-09-2008, 02:13 PM

I wonder if the problem with the sabot rounds isn;t the same one as the vanilla bf2 problem of at rockets not hitting the fast jeeps that are directly approaching you.

I don;t know how to muck about the bf2/poe files, so does anyone know the following info:

in poe: the speed of the sabot rounds
In vanilla: speed of the at rocket and the max speed of the fast jeeps
if my theory is correct, the speed of the poe tank round should be greater than or equal to the speed of the vanilla at rocket plus the max speed of the jeep.

**Buflak** · 05-09-2008, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [tR]Greasy_mullet

There is another issue which I have seen as mixed up with this one. That is each static has a Level of Detail (LOD) and the farther you get from it, the less detail it will show. Some of the smaller statics will disapear entirly such as the hay bales.

This one also happens with small vehicles like the dingo or the dozor. The muzzle flash or the dust cloud behind the moving car can be seen but the car itself remains invisible until i get closer.
I think LOD works by "dumbing down" the objects mesh depending on the viewers distance. This means less polygons as it gets further away. I could imagine an object like the hay bale being so simple that it wont even show up from a long range due to so few polygon count. Or maybe there is a modell of the object for every different range, and somehow the hay bale is missing one.
It is also possible to raise the level of detail with the ingame "geometry" setting. If this is on high, then the range at which an object gets a minimal (visible) lod also gets higher. This means spotting the enemy chopper sooner then on low settings.

I'm not sure if the LOD has anything to do with the tank problem, but as far as i know it works like this in the engine.
Also sorry if this is not too clear, english is not my first language

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 05-09-2008, 02:39 PM

Way to think out of the box McFeelMe. I dont know if we have looked into that. But your theory has good standing as I know that movement and hit detection are bad in BF2. So perhaps the speed of the round is part of the problem then. We can also compare that speed to that of the AT rounds and see how the stack up because as far as I know, the AT kits rounds do not share this problem.

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 05-09-2008, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buflak

This one also happens with small vehicles like the dingo or the dozor. The muzzle flash or the dust cloud behind the moving car can be seen but the car itself remains invisible until i get closer.
I think LOD works by "dumbing down" the objects mesh depending on the viewers distance. This means less polygons as it gets further away. I could imagine an object like the hay bale being so simple that it wont even show up from a long range due to so few polygon count. Or maybe there is a modell of the object for every different range, and somehow the hay bale is missing one.
It is also possible to raise the level of detail with the ingame "geometry" setting. If this is on high, then the range at which an object gets a minimal (visible) lod also gets higher. This means spotting the enemy chopper sooner then on low settings.

I'm not sure if the LOD has anything to do with the tank problem, but as far as i know it works like this in the engine.
Also sorry if this is not too clear, english is not my first language

You understand it correctly, that is exactly what is happening in that situation.

**Iamthefallen** · 05-09-2008, 03:07 PM

Just to throw this out there... its been a few years since BF2/POE was released, can the view distance/drawing distance be increased as new hardware is a bit more capable?

Some maps of course the fog and limited view distance adds to it, on others it would be great to be able see further.

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 05-09-2008, 03:16 PM

Quick question, has anyone ever seen this happen when firing the Abrams?

**[tR]Greasy_mullet** · 05-09-2008, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iamthefallen

Just to throw this out there... its been a few years since BF2/POE was released, can the view distance/drawing distance be increased as new hardware is a bit more capable?

Some maps of course the fog and limited view distance adds to it, on others it would be great to be able see further.

We still have some people that stuggle to play now. I know some of the maps have a harder time than others.

One thing we would have to do if we started to extend the view distances would be to increase the final LOD of the vehicles or else they would simply disapear (some do now). Like on H2H, the ground vehicles tend to disapear to the planes because they are farther than their lowest LOD yet the view distance allows the pilot to see that area.

Smokeyandthebandit · 05-09-2008, 04:08 PM

Abrams, Leopard, and T-55 shells hit way more often then T-84 shells. At least from what I've played. (and why I always ditch the T-84 if there's a Leo 2 around somewhere.) T-84's shells seem to fly way slower then the others. Maybe that's a factor?

**Buflak** · 05-09-2008, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [tR]Greasy_mullet

One thing we would have to do if we started to extend the view distances would be to increase the final LOD of the vehicles or else they would simply disapear (some do now). Like on H2H, the ground vehicles tend to disapear to the planes because they are farther than their lowest LOD yet the view distance allows the pilot to see that area.

My point exactly. This also affects the chopper, the eurotiger can lock on cars sooner then i actually see them.
It would be nice to see this fixed, as it makes locating targets much harder and the gameplay less realistic.