Alll tgers at the same side - Page 2

**Dick Blonov** · 09-01-2006, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grunt 70

Take Hoban Washburn for instance...completely new guy (me thinks) but following orders and playing TAC MOD like a true TG'er

Cheers...

Agreed.

DB

ABRA · 09-04-2006, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BaneII

In my experience, the squad has to be 66% TGers to be functional and effective. Anything less and you spend too much time trying to impose order while you are getting whaled on. Add to that the fact that we only have so many proficient squad leaders to go around at TG. There is really no way to get proper leadership all the time unless there is a significant number of veterans playing. So yes, there will certainly be times where things are very unorganized on the server. That's just life.

I just got back so my perspective on this is either irrelevantly out of touch or a valuable outside opinion. But my experience has been exactly like Bane's. Re-read your TG mission statements and what TG is seeking and I think you'll realize there is a big difference between a flock of non-TGers who have learned how to school in the same direction, and a squad truly employing real-world tactics and not jsut engine exploits. Especially since PoE is so armor based, command and control is much more tactically sophisticated.

Secondly, TG players are entitled to a good night gaming as they pursue the TG mission in their own gameplay. They did not subscribe to have the priviledge of being a dedicated SL of a squad of non-TGers. It is ridiculous to suggest long-time TG veterans be mandated to form evangelical missionary squads of the TG gospel to the hethen masses.

I for one as an experienced SL and instructor of non-TGers in TG events think that if we wish to both retain the dwindling base of experienced players in BF2 and foster new growth, we need to cater to both groups. Satisfying TGers with no interest in teaching by having them EXEMPLIFY rather than instruct is our best bet. A TG majority squad shocking and awing those who have never seen it spreads our message much better IMO than a frustrated TG SL leading a disfunctional squad.

Optimally, a patient TG SL could lead several TGers who just want to play into battle with a few new TG players tagging along for what will be the best ride of their online lives. Even if the demographics won't allow everyone to participate in this because of the ratio of TGers to pubs, I find this much preferable to comprimising our standards of play and losing the grandeur of our reputation in half-hearted attempts to teach by those more interested in exemplfying through their gameplay.

Short of this a new mod with a bunch of complicated dynamics is the perfect opportunity for a educational bootcamp if any veteran TGers not committed to a maritime vocation have time to spare. I challenge any TGer who is suggesting to others how to spend their time online to first dedicate their own time to the goal at hand rather than trying to teach half-heartedlywhile they are primarily at play. If you are serious about recruiting and developing pubbie talent, then stop playing around and start working at it. Schedule some open practice time and I gaurantee through even just modest promoting on the forum you will have more students than you can handle. I did.

I cannot believe I am hearing TG vets tell TGers that they cannot achieve the TG vision when they manage to have such good squadmates as to be able to and that they are to cease and dissist such TG behavior. That they must instead dilute it throughout the server to a point that I think we all honestly know will make it nearly imperceptable. On such a course, if am to leave land again, I fear there won't be the same TG as I know it when I return.

[TG] IronClaw · 09-04-2006, 04:31 AM

ABRA

Outstanding post

IronClaw

**Grunt 70** · 09-04-2006, 09:52 AM

@ Abra....

Bravo...

Evo<^|SiNz|^> · 09-04-2006, 10:28 AM

Abra, good post.

I think the problem is that it's just plain unenjoyable to be stuck in a squad with people who have no voice comms and have no interest in working together. If I join a squad with a bunch of people I don't recognize, I radio check right off the bat to gague who is going to work with me and who isn't. Then I just start to talk and call out enemy positions to help the SL. If I ain't getting a response, I'm probably going to find another squad.

People who have no interest in working as a team or playing tactically are not going to change their minds when you start telling them this is the way it's done here. They'll ignore you in my experience. That's what makes it unenjoyable sometimes.

I'll say though that it happens pretty seldom on either of the TG servers. Usually if I enter a squad of people I don't know, I'll hear a lot of comms and teamwork before I even announce my presence to the SL.

BaneII · 09-04-2006, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABRA

Secondly, TG players are entitled to a good night gaming as they pursue the TG mission in their own gameplay. They did not subscribe to have the priviledge of being a dedicated SL of a squad of non-TGers. It is ridiculous to suggest long-time TG veterans be mandated to form evangelical missionary squads of the TG gospel to the hethen masses.

Exactly. Let's not forget that we game to have fun. Playing drill instructor all the time isnt fun (at least not for me). So if you see a group of TG vets squadding up, let them have their fun. They still contribute to the community through their gameplay. We dont have to do missionary work all the time.

I will say that I did have one great squad of all non-TGers on Fallen on Sunday. Even though everyone did not have microphones, they did stick together and follow orders. Unfortunately, the server resetted before I could get everyone's name. But since the mod came out, I've been squad leading 90% of the time and that was a first. Hopefully as time goes on, maybe it wont be as rare.

P.S. Welcome back, ABRA. Your prose was certainly missed.

**Acid** · 09-04-2006, 12:34 PM

Well, now with the PW nights coming back, we have the full TG squads we all like.

Rick_the_new_guy · 09-04-2006, 02:13 PM

@ABRA, your writing style is very good IMO. Very fluid.

Please give the FNGs more time. We need sound SLs leading the way.

I am noticing a lot of talent and potintial out there.

We do have the two password nights now, so that should help out with those who desire to play with more TG players.

It is a struggle to keep the "pubs" in large squads as is. They will also feel un welcomed if many TGers do not want to play with them.

I believe the "New TG" squad name gets good sign ups. Two good TG tags in the squad is needed. One SL and one Bravo leader of a three man fire team.

As a Irreg, it is in our mission statement to greet new players and welcome them to the server. Our model of game play is indeed atruistic. So we spend a lot of time playing with FNGs.

ABRA · 09-04-2006, 04:10 PM

YEah Rick, no worries, I don't think we know each other but I actually share your beliefs on most of this. Unlike my compatriot BaneII, I do enjoy spending good chunk of my time as a drill instructor. I just felt that the viewpoint of the non-instructing TGer wasn't yet communicated in this thread adquately. My personal frustration is that I just got back and am learning PoE and not yet ready to lead an effective Learn TG squad in that mod. What I personally do need is a TG Labratory Squad of vet TGers where we can find out what works in PoE and then teach that. And the difficulty I have been having finding such a squad has led me to post thusly.

Rick_the_new_guy · 09-04-2006, 06:13 PM

Indeed, this is like some kind of major draft with PoE2. Or like rush with college frats. Bad metaphor, i dislike frats.

With time, we will get the FNGs who play by the TG primer on the server more often.

In some sort of natrual selection, the ones who get kicked and baned will not be playing on the server.

Furthermore the ones who do not like our style will hopfully not come back. The hammer is ever so deadly.

09-04-2006, 04:31 AM	#18 (permalink)
[TG] IronClaw Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 115	Re: Alll tgers at the same side ABRA Outstanding post IronClaw

09-04-2006, 09:52 AM	#19 (permalink)
Grunt 70 Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Massachusetts Age: 43 Posts: 2,502	Re: Alll tgers at the same side @ Abra.... Bravo... __________________ \|TG-22nd\|Grunt "When force is necessary, it must be applied boldly, decisively, and completely. But one must know the limitations of force; one must know when to blend force with maneuver" - Leon Trotsky

09-04-2006, 10:28 AM	#20 (permalink)
Evo<^\|SiNz\|^> Join Date: May 2006 Location: Alexandria, VA Age: 27 Posts: 1,160	Re: Alll tgers at the same side Abra, good post. I think the problem is that it's just plain unenjoyable to be stuck in a squad with people who have no voice comms and have no interest in working together. If I join a squad with a bunch of people I don't recognize, I radio check right off the bat to gague who is going to work with me and who isn't. Then I just start to talk and call out enemy positions to help the SL. If I ain't getting a response, I'm probably going to find another squad. People who have no interest in working as a team or playing tactically are not going to change their minds when you start telling them this is the way it's done here. They'll ignore you in my experience. That's what makes it unenjoyable sometimes. I'll say though that it happens pretty seldom on either of the TG servers. Usually if I enter a squad of people I don't know, I'll hear a lot of comms and teamwork before I even announce my presence to the SL. __________________ "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country." - Attributed to General George Patton, Jr.

09-04-2006, 12:34 PM	#22 (permalink)
Acid Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: MA Posts: 3,581	Re: Alll tgers at the same side Well, now with the PW nights coming back, we have the full TG squads we all like. __________________

09-04-2006, 02:13 PM	#23 (permalink)
Rick_the_new_guy Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Beach Age: 29 Posts: 1,789	Re: Alll tgers at the same side @ABRA, your writing style is very good IMO. Very fluid. Please give the FNGs more time. We need sound SLs leading the way. I am noticing a lot of talent and potintial out there. We do have the two password nights now, so that should help out with those who desire to play with more TG players. It is a struggle to keep the "pubs" in large squads as is. They will also feel un welcomed if many TGers do not want to play with them. I believe the "New TG" squad name gets good sign ups. Two good TG tags in the squad is needed. One SL and one Bravo leader of a three man fire team. As a Irreg, it is in our mission statement to greet new players and welcome them to the server. Our model of game play is indeed atruistic. So we spend a lot of time playing with FNGs. __________________ (PO3) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Member (CPO) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Leader (LCDR) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Commander Squad Member pledge to their SL:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...ad-leader.html Squad Leader pledge to their team:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...r-platoon.html Commander pledge to their SL:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...d-leaders.html Last edited by Rick_the_new_guy; 09-04-2006 at 06:09 PM.

09-04-2006, 04:10 PM	#24 (permalink)
ABRA Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: NORTH ATLANTIC (offline) Posts: 584	Re: Alll tgers at the same side YEah Rick, no worries, I don't think we know each other but I actually share your beliefs on most of this. Unlike my compatriot BaneII, I do enjoy spending good chunk of my time as a drill instructor. I just felt that the viewpoint of the non-instructing TGer wasn't yet communicated in this thread adquately. My personal frustration is that I just got back and am learning PoE and not yet ready to lead an effective Learn TG squad in that mod. What I personally do need is a TG Labratory Squad of vet TGers where we can find out what works in PoE and then teach that. And the difficulty I have been having finding such a squad has led me to post thusly. __________________ Xbox Live Gamertag: TG ABRA live.xbox.com/member/TG ABRA Friend me!

09-04-2006, 06:13 PM	#25 (permalink)
Rick_the_new_guy Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Virginia Beach Age: 29 Posts: 1,789	Re: Alll tgers at the same side Indeed, this is like some kind of major draft with PoE2. Or like rush with college frats. Bad metaphor, i dislike frats. With time, we will get the FNGs who play by the TG primer on the server more often. In some sort of natrual selection, the ones who get kicked and baned will not be playing on the server. Furthermore the ones who do not like our style will hopfully not come back. The hammer is ever so deadly. __________________ (PO3) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Member (CPO) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Leader (LCDR) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Commander Squad Member pledge to their SL:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...ad-leader.html Squad Leader pledge to their team:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...r-platoon.html Commander pledge to their SL:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...d-leaders.html

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