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Old 10-04-2006, 06:57 PM   #31 (permalink)
 
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Re: Attn E-Male: Response to Defensive Triangle Strategy

I agree with Acid. This tactic worked briefly in vanilla but now that tactics have evolved this tactics seems obsolete. Also in PoE in particular something seems to make it even more difficult, maybe the tweaked damage modeling and different weapon strengths.

I find that a dismounted engie repairs so much faster than mutually-supporting mounted engies,that the tactic is inferior. Additionally stationary targets being repaired can easily face you with front armor while mobile, flanking targets are forced to expose at least their tracks. The favorable accuracy of firing when stationary, coupled with this locational damage advantage, is greater than the gained evasiveness of movement(the tanks just aren't that fast to cause even an average stationary gunner to miss with decisive frequency).

You can argue the dual tanks mutually supporting can fire twice as fast as the stationary single tank with the dismounted engie repairing. And that this makes up for the difference in repair rates. But that's already a 2 on 1 match-up. If we wanted to play numbers games two stationary tanks against two mobile tanks are even more successful. Even the mobile tanks' ability to flank in oppose directions and force a single target to expose less protected faces is nullified against two targets next to each other(and thus possibly receiving mutual mounted engie repairs in addition to dismounted engie repairs). This is because they can each face their front armor at the enemy flanking on their side and essentially form one target that has what amounts to heavy front armor on two sides, effectively upping its sum armor ratings when it sustains damage. If the two stationary tanks in this example chose to instead spread apart to be more difficult of an air target, much of this would still be an effective superiority over the mobile armor force. By seperating they elongate their front and make flanking movements travel longer-distances before gettinig that track shot. The advantage is only increased if they select favorable hull-down terrain.

And as was said, this tactic is obscenely decimated by even a lone pilot of below-average skill strafing the formation with rockets. The mobility of the target is undermined by effectively increasing the size of the bull's eye many times over.

All in all, while I agree that a mobile tank without dismounted engie repair is better than a stationary tank and employ that tactic often myself, I abandon it the second I suspect that the enemy is remaining stationary due to an dismounted engie repairing him.

In that case I still favor maneuver, though now screening those movements is a requirement of success. If my movements cannot be screened while I advance against the enemy I would rather take long-range shots in the haze(using the look off to the side to increase draw distance technique--enemies appear at longer ranges along the edges of your screen and nearer your cross-hairs, this can allow you to land effective yet blind fire on an enemy that remains stationary). Such techniques often lure the tank into an open field of fire that I am able to engage from cover or from terrain that allows for my screened maneuver even if he remains in cover(think all the fences and cat-and-mouse tank battles at Train yard on Rolling Thunder).

Now that I have forced the battle to occur in terrain, my maneuvers and pop-out attacks allow for me to take shots at his less armored sides and rear. Often with less probability of returned fire if I approach by stealth or time my pop-outs during he reloads. This is the only tactic I have found in which a solo tanker maneuvering can face even or better chances against a tandem tanker-dismounted engie team.

As far as the tight group of mounted repairing engineers goes, I honestly think two engineers are a more effective force sharing a single tank than occupying two. Two tanks without dismounted engies will far very well in many situations obviously, especially by engaging the same targets in tandem. But in a pitched tank battle the stationary tank should get the first shot and be able to dispose of one of those tanks while his dismounted engie keeps him alive. He can then pop smoke, disengage while his engie revitalizes him to half armor(soloing against two tanks probably will leave him highly disadvantaged in the fight against the remaining tank which is often full strength since all of the earlier fire was concentrated on the first, destroyed tank). Once at half-armor, the single tank with dismounted support can defeat even the full health tank without support. Perhaps the truist measure of this success, is that as a SL I have had better results with two engies in one tank than in two.

Your tactic can have measured success if the tandem tanks can perform the alternating screening maneuver at full speed, while circling the target, while putting accurate fire on target(meaning they will be steering blind by memory of the map or the low-res minimap). That would be a miraculous(AKA, improbable) feat though. And honestly, when I have seen it, the problem you encounter is that as you pass your target 'circle-strafing' in a double-helix pattern with graceful, uninterrupted ballerina-like precision, your window of fire at a single armor target from when it becomes exposed to when it disappears behind terrain is not long enough to destroy it. Ironically with this tactic, if you do it right, you are too successful and are unable to kill the target in one pass oftentimes and your only recourse is to slow down effectively eroding the mobility advantage of this tactic. Not always, but I've seen this happen.

But it is a lot of fun to try and bring it all together in that fashion. I'll give you that. Just don't expect to defeat the simpleton tanker with the dismounted engie.

My bad, kinda long, but that essentially covers all the major concerns of the armor tactician in my mind. I had to say it though being so reliable on maneuver. On the rapid switching gears from full forward to full reverse once I enter a screen so that when I re-emerge it is not along my predicted path. You can see why your tactic is a pet peeve of mine. I hate it when some bright engie in a tank rear-ends me the moment I pop-out effectively blocking me from popping back into cover again. Nothing kills me quicker in a tank than a friendly behind me repeairing me from a vehicle.
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Last edited by ABRA; 10-04-2006 at 07:16 PM. Reason: Friggin long and full of typos
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