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10-15-2006, 11:57 AM #1
another Q for the admin.
First off I'd like to say that I spent the last hour looking through the SOP's, Primer, Server Rules and other required reading before posting this. Did we ever decide if it was a kickable offense to use anti vehicle munitions on personnel? I thought this was covered in the Accepted Use Page but that's no longer a valid link. The problem I'm having is that a certain individual (I won't name them until I know if they are violating a rule) constantly kills off several of my squad with an anti-tank rpg. Even after I've mentioned that it might not be in the spirit of TG to do so he just laughs and tells me "it's a game, theres nothing u can do to stop me" and in part he's right. So is he violating some rule or code that we have or am I just being a weenie about this? Thanks.
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10-15-2006, 12:27 PM #2
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10-15-2006, 12:36 PM #3
Re: another Q for the admin.
My understanding is that the practice is discouraged and should be avoided, consistent with the TG primer. I myself have a very bad habit of using anti-vehicle RPG's on infantry.
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10-15-2006, 12:42 PM #4
Re: another Q for the admin.
Other discussion here.
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10-15-2006, 01:16 PM #5
Re: another Q for the admin.
The only other thing to consider is if this was on a infantry only map and the AT kit actually is named the AP(Anti-personnel) kit.
I personally don't care especially on POE if someone hits me with a AT rocket. The splash damage is low like on vanilla and being unguiding and a weapon heavily effected by drop it means it was a good shot. On the other hand getting shot from 10 feet away by one is pretty cheap.
*edit* Also have you ever tried pulling out the one AT kits submachine gun? It takes forever to get to a point that you can fire it.|TG-12th| Sawviper

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10-15-2006, 01:41 PM #6
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10-15-2006, 01:42 PM #7
Re: another Q for the admin.
It is cool to use the RPG to fire into bunkers and into buildings and such. More realistic.
Fireing one inside a building would be deadly to your self and your squad. Same goes for the grnade launcher. I am currently going to noob tube close range use therapy right now.
Just think realistic and all will be well.
At least we are not getting sniped by those things anymore.(PO3) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Member
(CPO) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Squad Leader
(LCDR) Marcinko_R. (BF2 PR .509) Commander
Squad Member pledge to their SL:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...ad-leader.html
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10-15-2006, 01:52 PM #8
Re: another Q for the admin.
Using AT against infantry happens, and everyone understands it. You're running around looking for that tank and someone pops out and surprises you.. Well, you press fire and say Doh!
Using AT consistently against infantry, however, is not in the spirit of TG and is strongly discouraged. We always strive to play the game right, regardless of what is possible or effective.



-- Suits are what you wear when doing things you shouldn’t want to do anyway.
FROM THE TACTICAL GAMER PRIMER.
3) Support game play in a near-simulation environment. Where the focus of play would not be solely on doing what it takes to win, but doing so utilizing real-world combat strategy and tactics rather than leveraging exploits provided to players by the design of the game engine.
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10-15-2006, 02:05 PM #9
Re: another Q for the admin.
I'm guilty of it a few of times last night. A couple of times our flag was being overrun and I fired it in close proximity without considering switching to the staple gun they call an SMG. Sorry for whoever was on the receiving end of that. I felt bad... but then I got over it.
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10-15-2006, 02:25 PM #10
Re: another Q for the admin.
If you kill yourself with an AT rocket (or any other weapon for that matter), you are violating the suicide rule.
A policy of freedom for the individual is the only truly progressive policy. -F.A. Hayek
"$250,000 a year won't get me to Central Park West."
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10-15-2006, 03:22 PM #11
Re: another Q for the admin.
Peace through fear... since 1947!
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10-15-2006, 04:10 PM #12
Re: another Q for the admin.
And remember the AP rocket pickup kit is avaliable on many maps. So don't assume that incoming rocket fire is necesarrily AT, even on a m ap with the AT kits by defualt. Watch the kill notification for Themorbaric or BunkerFaust I think it is.
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10-15-2006, 04:46 PM #13
Re: another Q for the admin.
I know that there is an anti-personnel kit and I know what that one is for. I guess I should have been more clear with my question. There were only about 20 of us playing and it was agreed that we wouldn't use any vehicles. This individual was using the AT kit (After I got killed I looked to the top left to see what I was killed with, anti-tank) in close quarters. Usually the shot came from across the street or from behind us as we ran around a building. In areas that close even the staple gun would have been far more "sporting" than an anti-tank rocket.
On a good note I did find out that in the next map his SL told him to either use the appropriate kit on an infantry only map or leave since he wasn't playing the TG way. It all worked out in the end and no one got banned or kicked. Thanks for all the replies folks.
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10-16-2006, 12:52 PM #14
Re: another Q for the admin.
RPG's are a very valid Anit-infantry weapon. I think they only violate the spirit of TG when used at point blank or indoors on purpose. Everyone has been suprised and had those oops moments, but for people who run up and try to get point blank kills with little regard for their or friiendly health should be kicked/banned. In BF2 I think it was worse because of the guided side, but I have no problem with someone using them at range and adjusting for the balistics. IN most cases it's easy to dodge and they are easy to kill while reloading.
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10-17-2006, 10:39 AM #15
Re: another Q for the admin.
My take on it, as if more were needed:
In my experience as an AT, a kit that I play about 60% of the time:
I use the AT round as an all purpose round against armor, vehicles, and yes, infantry when there is a need. The design of the weapon means that if you die from an AT round, odds are that you screwed up, and you want to blame someone.
When I kill infantry it's normally either a sniper in a static position, or someone who comes running right at me, guns blazing. Either way, they screwed up.
I simply cannot engage a target who is moving with his squadmates behind cover and concealment. First off it's damn hard to hit them, secondly, it's absoloutely suicide to do so.
Once the AT has fired, he is dead since your squad mates will immediately engage him. But again, normally the guy killed by an AT round is a lone soldier who charged into combat without looking both ways before crossing.
And this is improper usage on the part of the AT soldier?
But because we can argue that particular point forever, let's just jump right to the source, the makers of the game, and the weapon itself.
From the POE website:
As opposed to the pure AT pickup kits:The RPG-7V anti tank round for the standard AT kit is an all-purpose round. It's effective against armor as well as soft targets and infantry.
The Panzerfaust3 anti tank round for the standard AT kit is an all-purpose round. It's effective against armor as well as soft targets and and infantry.
If the powers that be disagree with the distinction made by the POE developers, I guess that really is up to them. I'm just not sure how using a weapon the way it was intended to be used is going against the TG spirit.The RPG-7V Tandem anti tank round is the pure AT round. This kit’s only goal is to take out heavily armored vehicles such as MBT’s and APC’s.
The Panzerfaust3T anti tank round is the pure AT round. This kit’s only goal is to take out heavily armored vehicles such as MBT’s and APC’s.
I don't understand why people have such a problem with this. We want to play the game in a realistic way, use real world tactics, use weapons the way they're used in the real world, except for when the real world occasionally annoys us? Maybe I need the argument spelled out in smaller words, or just an admin to explicitely say "because we say so".
Tempus, how is using the weapon as it is described, designed, intended and implemented not "playing the game right"? I'm not looking to pick a fight, I just don't understand the argument when it directly contradicts the way the game was deliberately designed?
Now, what you don't ever see is someone walking around with a RPG on their shoulder inside a building. It just doesn't happen. The AT rounds also have a short arming distance (5m) in real life, and that may be a more useful metric for when it's OK to use it. If the POE crew would implement that arming distance, we would also do away with the whole suicide shot issue.|TG-12th| fallen

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