Re: PoE2 Rant

**MoreGooder** · 01-08-2007, 09:49 AM

Pubbies without VOIP are dead weight. I believe that to play in a TG server, VOIP should be required. Unfortunately, with POE2 popularity waning (POE2 DEVS: NEW MAPS PLEASE!!) this new rule would have a further negative impact. I suspect, however, that many of the clans we see entering the server have their own Ventrilo or TS channel going and tend to not activate the VOIP function. I didnt' turn it on until I started playing POE2 because we had Ventrilo running. That all changed once I joined TG.

Oh, and SL's without VOIP are even worse than dead weight, especially when all 9 allowed SL positions are filled and a VOIP enabled SL is unable to start a squad!

**Sawviper** · 01-08-2007, 10:16 AM

I try whenever I have the patience to stay on the pubbie side of the maps. But one thing I am unwilling to do is stay in a squad with a SL with no VOIP. I join up and ask a couple questions and if I get no answer I usually just start my own squad.

Usually on infantry/light armor maps pubbies do a decent job except for your lonewolfs trying to not get kicked by the script. On air maps however usually the pretty candies of the jets and choppers cause squad cohesion to go in the toilet.

I know I am guilty as much as everyone else of joining the squads with the excellent SLs. I get home from work and want to enjoy my playtime. But just as our admins take their time to make our servers more enjoyable so should we. Make sure we keep some TG presence on both sides of the server.

Also I might suggest that on Spies we overload on the German side. A full team of pubbies can still make that map a wipeout even if they are whack-a-moling flags.

**tHa_KhAn** · 01-08-2007, 11:08 AM

SM with no VOIP doesn't bother me, but SL's that don't do. There are a few exceptions as you will find a SL without VOIP and they can be quite effective. Updated and atleast potentially effective orders is all I need from a SL, TG or not. It's just easier to find if you see a TG in the SL position.

**jmaker** · 01-08-2007, 06:55 PM

Oh, and SL's without VOIP are even worse than dead weight

Originally Posted by tHa_KhAn

SM with no VOIP doesn't bother me, but SL's that don't do. There are a few exceptions as you will find a SL without VOIP and they can be quite effective. Updated and atleast potentially effective orders is all I need from a SL, TG or not. It's just easier to find if you see a TG in the SL position.

I know this may be the case most of the time, but as I found out last night when my sound cut out on me in the middle of Fallen, I was still an effective SL simply by giving orders via the commo rose. I wrote in squad chat that my sound was down, and I didn't want to reboot since I was having a really good round. From that point on I simply gave orders to either move, attack, or defend and quite surprisingly everyone followed the orders beautifully. Basically I tried to move us to wherever the gap was in the defense. It worked out well. Who was in that squad last night? You guys did great btw.

**Lucky Shot** · 01-08-2007, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by B. Clawhammer

Como se dice "Defense"? Does the word "defense" still exist? The last few nights being on the German team have been horrible at best due to the lack of defense at CPs. It's like lemmings going from one flag to another. I have a suggestion: Once you take a flag, how about clearing the area out? How about making sure there isn't opfor within the vicinity before going to the next slaughterhouse? How about looking at the min-map and assessing where to make your next move before moving out with the rest of the herd?

There were numerous incidents last night alone where practically our whole team would be at a flag, and that flag would still go neutralized!! My squad would go back to capture it, with the other squads completely oblivious to the fact that the flag just turned neutral. WTF? If you're gonna SL, I'd suggestion you pay better attention to what's going on rather than what squad is ahead of you in points. You and you're squad aren't gonna get any ribbons or medals for best squad, so start playing for the team the way it's supposed to be played here at TG.

End of rant for now. Discuss/criticize/whatever....

It seems to happen whether it's a TG squad or not. We went to recap a flag last night and as we were about halfway there, Asch says, "You know the whole team is following you?" Sure enough, If my minimap was a doppler radar, that would have been one heck of a blue rainstorm between the farmhouse and lumbermill. It was ridiculous. What was worse, what was the other team doing as no one was defending the 3 other flags we had. For what it's worth, there were two TG led squads that were trailing us to the flag...

In regards to TG 3 max squads, that's something that the 5th will enact after the scrim. We need the repetitions until then, but it's important to let the community know that we saw what you said. Understand this though, having 2-3 5th led squads (As it would if they were 33rd, 7th, or 12th led squads) can lead to greater domination as we communicate between squads using teamspeak. This leads to greater coordination AND squads that will play defense. We've done it in the past and of course, we have been able to run top squads on opposing sides also.

Even after changing sides for Fallen and Carpathian last night to the Germans, and being able to watch our teammates on the minimap, we were left wondering what the heck the rest of the team was doing.

Lucky Shot

**jmaker** · 01-08-2007, 07:10 PM

Yeah last night was strange. For most of the night the Germans got completely overwhelmed. It seemed like we could barely hold on to 2 flags, even 1 at the most for a number of rounds. I know this happened on Orel, Dnipro River Valley and a couple of others.

**WhiskeySix** · 01-08-2007, 08:07 PM

yeah - I think it was just a matter of having more talented pubs on UKR for the night because I saw TG's switch, with no effect. On carpathian, UKR wasn't able to deploy armor for about 1/2 the map, but to my surprise, we (GER) still only managed to hang onto one flag and lost by over 300pts. Really wierd.

I think sawviper's suggestion of having our MVP's switch to GER for Spies is a good idea....

**Gman** · 01-08-2007, 09:03 PM

I came online just after the "switch". As a habit, I just joined squad while waiting for other TOC. That squad kept setting defensive positions in one of two triangles. First was the lumber mill, north cabin, crash site triangle and the south cabin, trenches, crash site. When TOC showed up, we formed up and did the same. I dont I think crossed the stream more than once.

On carpathian, we pretty much defended the west cabin. Actually... 3 defended west cabin, 2 defended east cabin and I spent most of my time sniping the squad outside our UCB and after they left, sniping the squad at the lumber mill (mostly Luckyshot).

I dont think the squads bunched up anymore than they needed to. It may have been just the right guys in the SL position. I feel there is a little bit of schooling needed on this server. I also think that you have a fair amount of Pubbies who have learned the lesson plan.

**thebleakaffinity** · 01-08-2007, 09:08 PM

I disagree about VOIP. Yes, it's preferable for a squad leader to have it, but I've seen many instances of good squad leading without it. BetterDeadThanRed is a good example - he provides intelligent orders, performs all the necessary duties of a squad leader, and uses the in-game chat to communicate.

**B. Clawhammer** · 01-09-2007, 07:10 PM

I too disagree w/the mandatory VOIP issue. While it would be nice to have an SL use VOIP, I don't think it's ever a real problem unless A) He/she doesn't know how to use the camo rose (sp?) (unlikely) and B) He/she just gives incredulous orders. The game lends itself to be just as effective w/o VOIP by using the orders supplied. And it's never that bad when at least one or two of the SMs have voip and are constantly communicating effectively to the rest of the squad.

**Braidedheadman** · 01-13-2007, 10:58 AM

I'd like to interject here, if I may.

First off, every night that I get a chance to saddle up and play PoE2 with you folks, the first thing that I look for is an available slot in any squad that has at least one TG in it, preferably as SL, because I know that that is a squad that will perform its given role in a sensible fashion. That and PoE2 have revived BF2 for me, a game that I would have binned long ago otherwise.

But there are few things that get my dander up more than following a squad around aimlessly from one CP to the next, often trying to take objectives that, to me on an intuitive level, make no sense whatsoever. Capturing all the flags furthest from the UCB, for instance, effectively cuts squads off from "supplies" in the form of armored support, abundant transportation, etc.

For instance, the defensive value that at tank brings to any squad at any given position can't be understated, especially when other enemy tanks come rolling in. And for the time that it takes a tank to drive from the UCB to a nearby CP to defend vs. having to go cross country, or worse take back flags on its own, the need that people have to chase after "the next flag" boggles the mind. I find that factors such as theses very often go overlooked, and tanks sit idle in their shed while flags swap nationalities like a round of musical chairs. (I should point out that this is common to BF2 flavors of any kind)

On that note, and the subject that I wish to address, I only rarely find that vehicles are used to their fullest potential. By that I mean, tank and APC drivers don’t squad up and don’t form armored columns with engineers and support kits to keep them at peak operating efficiency. They scatter across the map, often with no support of any kind whatsoever. Jet’s, where available also tend not to form squads and fly in wings whenever possible and so on.

TG’s teamwork is exceptional, above and beyond anywhere else that I have played. However, if I may, most of the guys I have played with seem to be very infantry-minded, a role which you all seem to excel at BTW. But my question is this:

Does TG put any effort into creating dedicated flight wings, armored divisions, and so-on in order to see that vehicles are put to proper use, throughout the duration of a round?

Whether I am part of an infantry squad, an armored column with a wrench in hand, or riding a hotseat through the skies, I am having the most fun so long as it is a team effort with good communication and sensible objectives.

Thanks for reading.

**Rick_the_new_guy** · 01-13-2007, 11:33 AM

@Braided.
Sound tactics on keeping CB adjacent to friendly flags.

However, due to the fast pace nature and the small maps of the game, taking flags in order is sometimes is not completed due to neccesity.

The all important keeping the enemy bleeding is.
You give me an idea. The team that is holding the most flags together should bleed the enemy more. Would not be possible to script I rekon.

With regrads to mechanzied use of tanks and stuff, during scrims things are really coordinated.

My first commanding role (SL) was during the Old school vs. New school TG scrim as a tank commander (the detail ahd four tanks). Myself and three others were orded to patrol a chock point. Really fun stuff.
Tybalt was the CO.
Granted, towards the end I had someone stop using the tank, but no big deal.

But again, due to the short count down timer and having squad members not delaying spawn, the inital deployment on casual gaming nights leave very little coordination.

You should check out the free Armed Assault demo. On the Capture the Island mode, supply trucks deploy from the next closes base. So like you said, capturing a flag way behind enemy lines has its drawback. Keep in mind, bleed does not matter, so infact getting the base would not be a huge disaster to the enemy unless it had a lot of assests.

**Braidedheadman** · 01-14-2007, 12:47 AM

@Rick_the_new_guy:
Certainly. I recognize that Bleed is super important and that sometimes it becomes necessary to cap distant flags. My argument really covers the early to mid-early game tactics. Establishing a presence at adjacent bases early (I like that word, thanks

) and staying put is key. Too often though, I see these bases capped only to find that the mechanized units, along with most everyone else roll off for the next flag, even though Bleed may already have been achieved. Somewhere along the way, BF2ers have come to believe that winning = capping all the flags. It’s too bad defense is not rewarded better or scaled against offense.

Anyways, while somewhat off topic, I would like to point out that armor is primarily a defensive platform, best suited for staying in one place and shelling from a distance, rather than capping flags. I know from reading other threads that some people may find that distasteful but it remains that a tank up close sees less than a tank from far away. Not to mention its minimum effective attack range, on level ground, imposed by turret angles.

**Rick_the_new_guy** · 01-14-2007, 01:50 AM

Yeah, you should watch the TGvs BF2C PoE2 scrim to see TG at its best.

Your right about tanks, but with the gameplay Tanks see really really close action.

However, just like in real life a tank team not supported by infantry in-game will be in trouble very quickly.

Unlike real life, things are really really in your face. The only thing that really is close to real life is the arty strikes. Death from Above, still the same after all these years.

**ANGELofDEATH** · 01-14-2007, 08:56 PM

First of all, great thread.. As some of you know, I play on the POE server.. daily

.. and totally enjoy the teamwork that happens daily, even if it is only happening on the other team :/ lol

Originally Posted by Lucky Shot

In regards to TG 3 max squads, that's something that the 5th will enact after the scrim. We need the repetitions until then, but it's important to let the community know that we saw what you said. Understand this though, having 2-3 5th led squads (As it would if they were 33rd, 7th, or 12th led squads) can lead to greater domination as we communicate between squads using teamspeak. This leads to greater coordination AND squads that will play defense. We've done it in the past and of course, we have been able to run top squads on opposing sides also.

Lucky Shot

This here is a great idea... I know you all want to be in a squad with your divisions, yet it leaves the rest of the pubs (myself) trying to find a squad that is working together to keep a flag. I also notice that the teams get a bit stacked at times.. and having 15 TG on the other team is just not fun for the pubbers on the other team... I am a frequent poster on the Planetbattlefield forums and am the "unofficial shameless POE cheerleader" lol.. and have converted a few players to POE2, and always tell them that playing on the TG server will show them what teamwork is all about... unfortunately, alot of the time, their first time on the TG is not enjoyable... and I think we all are trying to get more POE players , not scare them off.

I dont think putting a limit on SL with Voip working will work out(you may scare them off). Yet MAKING the squads of one and two joining up with other squads, i know you do warn people for the most part, yet I still see it alot. I do see alot of clans that come in and start their own squad and never use VOIP, and never work with the rest of the team(I like to join their squads and try and bring them into the game with the rest of the team)I use voice alot.. especially to tell my squad where I see a squad moving in from. I have seen pubbers get warned about locking squads with a few players in it.. Well that is kind of wrong when I see TG doing it all the time :/ Again , I know you all like to play with your divisions, yet you should be trying to get the pubber to play WITH the rest of us, and not just lonewolfing, like my most hated player cmbtengr, he always joins my squad and then never spawns on us and never even comes near the flag we are trying to take or defend, Yet use Voip.

Since you all are usually on TS, maybe if you tell each other.. "Luckys squad(for example)is keeping the lumbermill" then the other TG members will know this and work on other flags..
I know when Im in a squad with a bunch of pubbers, and run into Luckys squad(enemy), or see a squad of TG, I warn the squad.. because I know, If there is two TG, there are more

and they are probably watching eachothers back. In fact I have tried and tried to change my SLs mind about attacking the mill on Orel.. basically because I have been in his squad.. FFS it is going to be a slaughter LOL
Maybe even warn the enemy TG SLs in chat, would get some more squads to go to the mill.. getting the pubbers to turn themselves into teamplayers.. because we all know it takes more than one squad to take a well defended flag.

Anyway, you guys are doing good things on your server.. Keep it up.

Thread Tools

Display

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Re: PoE2 Rant

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

Project Reality: ArmA2 v0.15 -...

Rayne's Eye on Independant Gaming:...

Panzer Corps Named Wargame of the...

Two New Multi-Mission Events for...

Tactical Gamer Podcast Series - TG...

Recent Blog Entries

More Feedback from YouTube Viewers

:d

The Best Video Feedback

Beyond SOPA: ACTA, WIPO, and the...

Common Mistakes: #10