The State of Affairs - Page 3

**Bernout** · 11-05-2007, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gillespie

Teamspeak chatter: All that chatter and babbling nonsense is the reason this particular game's community is still so strong. The familiarity and joviality between the players here have created close-knit binds that keep the aging BF2 series going. I propose that those that have problems with such chatter join a different, "quiet" teamspeak channel and adopt channel commander to talk to the admins (after asking an admin to do the same). Either that, or get TS overlay. Or turn Teamspeak's output volume down so you can still hear TS, but it doesn't intrude on the game. Stop being old men about it.

With someone doing all this chatter in the main PR channel, how exactly are they communicating with their squad in game?

I don't mind the odd comment but what really gets my goat is when there's a group of players on the same team who start using it as a team channel irrespective of who else is on. I've encountered this situation a couple of times and I fail to see why I should be the one forced to switch channels when we have two perfectly good "team" channels available. It just comes across as discourteous.

My understanding was that the main channel was primarily for admin issues and friendly chat between rounds. Sure it shouldn't be hard to maintain that?

Quote:

Team swapping: You can jump either way with this, but I'll be honest and admit that team swapping is never a priority with me. Win... lose... whatever. If I've found a good crew of guys that I'm having a blast with and we've played through 2 - 3 rounds together, I'm certainly not going to switch to the other team just because they're disorganized and can't seem to get their act together. But that's just me... wanted to express my opinion on that particular matter.

Let's face it...team swapping to balance the teams sucks. It's disruptive, gives you a 1 min. respawn penalty, and noone ever thanks you for doing it. Plus since you are by definition on the winning side, chances are good you are having a good time with your squad. This is what makes it such a tough issue to solve. At the very least we should try to balance out our groups. Having the 1st and 6th with full squads on the same team for example should probably be avoided at all costs.

Bernout

TF2iSundance · 11-06-2007, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thegreatnardini

And the teamspeak chatter does need to quiet down a bit, I know I'm just as guilty as everyone else when it comes to this. We have four channels dedicated to PR: the main, private, PR team 1 and PR team 2 channels. Let's put them to good use.

I think TS is essential for the communication between SLs

Quote:

Originally Posted by BLKOPS NERDS_R_COOL

Hate to rock ur boat Ferris...... But I've seen many TG players break the rules/guidlines especially the one above lately(I could even name a few if needed for this little ditty of an infraction). Yes I've said something( typed). Response given by present admin: Oh, well hes a good pilot.

I've got a very fast PC that mean i can load a map and lock my very own squad in less than a minute therefore all assets on the battlefield could be mine, that's a no-no.
Making a 1 man locked squad for the only air asset doesn't give you the right to fly it unless you invited at least the few ppl that requested an invite, I know for fact that a chopper can be shared and a spotter put at good uses.
And if he's a good TG pilot then maybe you should think "tactical" and let the most experienced pilot go first. I think what's annoys me the most in this game is ppl that are exploiting the TG guidelines and then whine about it on the main chat when they don't bend the way they like.

kittykatnub · 11-06-2007, 01:54 AM

Yeah, getting a 1 man squad for lets say 1 transport LB isn't good. I do that at the start of a round then unlock it later that way people can get into squads with real SLs that aren't just flying around. I do unlock it later for those few people that can't get into another squad or enjoy talking to me (lol, i find a lot that do that actually) or want to get to a hill to snipe, etc...

**TurkishDelight** · 11-06-2007, 03:49 AM

I agree with what Skud says about locking squads. I operate very similarly and think that it is infact, more helpful to the team if I lock a "sniper" or "recon" squad. No sense in taking 3-4 more good players out of the immidiate battle just so they can blow our cover

In some situations I might lock the squad when it has 4-5 people in it, simply for the fact that I know the people and that it acts coherently together. Adding another member or two might actually make the squad less useful, if the new additions break up the liquid like movement of the squad. On the other hand if someone requests an invite to a "Non-Speciality" squad, I will usually give it to them unless I have reasons not to.

**snooggums** · 11-06-2007, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcannon69

I apologize but I merely was trying to point out the imbalance; I spoke up last night stating that the teams were "TG stacked". I did not though start crying that the teams were stacked because MEC could not capture South Village.

Note: I was the commander for the MEC on Kashan last night.
Lets begin by realizing the fact there at opposing team APCs at South Village and North Village flags. Why are they there who knows but they are not ment to be there in the first place. None of my guys spawned at the North Village APC while some USMC spawned at the South Village APC. I feel that this issue is a game exploit that wasn't fixed before the release of 0.6. Why is it that there are APCs at these flags anyway?

It was at this time I noticed that the teams were stacked and decided to inform others by typing in chat. This is a total coincidence that some people thought we were "crying" about the fact we couldn't cap south village. In addition, I had little knowledge about OGT the round previous since I had joined late in that round.

Yes eventually we captured south village only after the server population started dieing off. (it was late at night) Then the round turned into a boredom fest since it was like 15 vs 17 for 2 hrs straight until the server was restarted.

I have to take issue with this as it is an example of what Lucky was saying about misrepresenting rules, or in this case, the 'right' way to play a map.

Kashan has APCs at the first two flags so that each team can defend against the primary assault. It doesn't matter if this is a bug or not, it is the same for both sides and allows the fighting to start ASAP. I don't think it is a bug anyway, but cannot find a post on the PR forums about it. For the TG server forward assaults are allowed, every flag other than the main is in play at the beginning of the map. We had lost the previous map with our 'stacked' team so I was taking the initiative to try to hold the assault to make progress on the bunkers which has not always worked in the past but in this case another squad did get those taken care of. This is teamwork which we try to promote here.

We had little resistance at South Village, I saw some of your tanks in the middle of the map possibly shooting the bunker area which you did not need yet. We killed a few Vodniks that came in but there was no real resistance. As the other flags got capped the rest of our army arrived and we had a real defense, but before that there really wasn't a big assault. None of your guys spawned at north? That would be an issue for you as a commander, you should have sent guys there ASAP when you found that out as our team did not assault it as quickly as I wanted. I had to go to bed about the time that South Village would have been capped by our side (sounds like you fought them back).

My point is that all flags are in play, so saying it is cheap to attack forward when all flags are in play is misleading the way the server should be played. I know I've ended up on the wrong end of a flag rush on Al Jabal which is the most effective map for that tactic due to how the marines land, but that just means my team got outplayed. Getting outplayed happens, is the result of tactical play, and should be a learning experience.

*******
To everyone:

Do you have trouble finding a good squad to play with? Make a new one, learn to squad lead and people will flock to you so you don't have to search a good leader out. When people join, you get to make the teamwork happen. If you read and agree with the rules you can even put TG at the beginning of your name if you represent the community and even more people will join your squad. When you are a good squad leader, every squad you are in will likely be a good one since you get to tell them how you want to play.

JAMerica · 11-06-2007, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSkudDestroyer

After reading this thread, there are a couple of things that I'd like to comment on...

Locked Squads
To put it bluntly, yes, I lock my squads, send out however many invites (Be it 6th or people I know and like to play with), then, depending on my squad's purpose, I keep it locked or let whoever decides to join in.
Why do I keep it locked for a full round sometimes? There are usually a couple of reasons:
a. Specialty squad. Do you know how annoying it is to have people begging me for invites into a "3 MAN TANK" squad when I already have 3 men and it's going just fine? Or when I'm doing sabotage. Tactically, I only need 1-3 other people (For rally or for backup). If my squad's numbers meet my NEEDS, then I do not unlock it. 2 Man sniper squads stay at 2. 3 Man tanks stay at 3, Sabotage squads try to stay at 4, etc.
b. I'm playing with my mates from the 6th. I became a SM for several reasons, but becoming a member of the 6th has been a goal since I started playing with TG. We reserve the right to play together, and if it's at 5/6...sorry, we cant always open it up and take time to familiarize you with it. Does this mean we swap sides JUST to play together? Generally, no. But if the team is unbalanced by 2 or more players, and we see an oppertunity to play together, we try our best to. We are the 6th, we love playing together. Don't get fussy if you're not invited.
Alot of people have "invite diarrhea" as I call it. They expect invites from me, or just want one because I wear a tag. I'm sorry, but first of all, we're not super soldiers. Secondly, if I don't know you...why should I invite you? I give invites to those I KNOW will have my back 100% and are on the ball. I'm all for eventually playing with all of you, but it's MY squad, I do indeed keep certain players out, even TG tag wearers who I just don't like. This does not mean I sit in a 1 man locked squad...

Bravo. With a baditude like this, it's little wonder threads similar to the current one pop up once a week, and you guys feel the PR community is going downhill.
I'm not even close to being a part time PR player, I've only dabbled here and there, but posts like this make me want to stay far, far away from PR @ TG.

I suppose it could be up for debate, but I would go so far and say that these attitudes (bolded above) are not very consistent with the primer & the community. I'm surprised that this is standard operating procedure for any IHS, whom I've always observed to uphold TG principles beyond scrutiny.

So why post this if I'm not involved with PR? Cause PR is how I found TG to begin with and I was instantly impressed with the community wrt it's attitude towards new players of any skill level. More impressive is how TG is able to do this across games and genres. Many issues in this thread are not particularly specific to PR and have come up for other game titles here at TG, and the fact that many people play several titles means we are all likely to bump into each other eventually (I'd like it to be a positive experience for both of us

). But quite frankly I'm puzzled, as it was quite rightly pointed out (and is true for any TG title):

Quote:

The hands of change are our hands, the players hands, not the admins. They cant do it alone, we have to pitch in and make the server what WE want it to be. If you want the server to turn into another pub server, please speak up and we can direct you to several other places to play that will accommodate that playstyle for you. But I dont think anyone here wants that. We've got plenty of posts here with people acknowledging whats going on, and words are nice but actions are better. SO LETS WORK TO FIX IT.

So how do the bolded attitudes above make a positive contribution to this goal?

**Tempus** · 11-06-2007, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAMerica

Bravo. With a baditude like this, it's little wonder threads similar to the current one pop up once a week, and you guys feel the PR community is going downhill.
I'm not even close to being a part time PR player, I've only dabbled here and there, but posts like this make me want to stay far, far away from PR @ TG.

I suppose it could be up for debate, but I would go so far and say that these attitudes (bolded above) are not very consistent with the primer & the community. I'm surprised that this is standard operating procedure for any IHS, whom I've always observed to uphold TG principles beyond scrutiny.

So why post this if I'm not involved with PR? Cause PR is how I found TG to begin with and I was instantly impressed with the community wrt it's attitude towards new players of any skill level. More impressive is how TG is able to do this across games and genres. Many issues in this thread are not particularly specific to PR and have come up for other game titles here at TG, and the fact that many people play several titles means we are all likely to bump into each other eventually (I'd like it to be a positive experience for both of us

). But quite frankly I'm puzzled, as it was quite rightly pointed out (and is true for any TG title):

So how do the bolded attitudes above make a positive contribution to this goal?

In PR's defense, I'll have to say that (fortunately) not everybody here shares Skud's feelings about locking squads. A majority of players understand how they got to TG in the first place, and if they want TG to continue being the best place to play, they need to keep welcoming new players with open arms.

**Jevski** · 11-06-2007, 01:09 PM

I totally disagree with you JAMerica.

As the saying goes, Respect is earned. I started playing PR around 0.5 and hung around TG more and more because here I found much more teamwork than elsewhere.

First of all this is a game and we are all here to have fun. Playing day after day with people who didn't even take the time to read the manual can be a strain on any fun. That doesn't mean that I don't want to educate new players, but there is a lot to do before running with the IHS. Among these things are reading tactics and tips on the forum. Get acquainted with the game and its playing style. Crawl before you try to run.

That Skud locks a squad because he dosnt need more people in a specops squad or an tank squad isnt being selfish, all he would accomplish by doing that is creating a lone wolf player.

I worked my way up from an ignorant noob who didn't know how to play it the right way, to a player that it mostly invited when I ask for an invite. So if I can learn to play the game right without having playing with an IHS, so can others.

Regarding keeping certain players out. Well I too chose not to play with some. It may be because I played with them before and they didn't respond to orders and kept ignoring the chain of command or it may be some other reason. But again i am playing to have fun not to sit in front of the computer getting frustrated at someone telling me to take a hike cause they just want to snipe.

So what to do? I'd say go play have fun. And eventually you will earn to play with some of the better players, because when you just started out everything will be new and confusing and running with the big boys does not help a lot cause you haven't got a clue what your squad leader is talking about.

/Jev

**Ferris Bueller** · 11-06-2007, 01:22 PM

I agree with Jevski. As I pointed out in my original post, locked squads are acceptable under certain circumstances. Hand in hand with this is the privelege that IHS members can choose to invoke by playing with their squad mates.

In this light, Skud was simply justifying his reasons against people that are invite-happy. I can tell you as a point of fact that Skud plays with unlocked squads and people he may or may not be familiar with far more frequently than he plays with a full, or even partially full 6th squad. His point was that if he chooses to lock his squad, he has a reason, and his reasons are well within the boundaries of the rules. You cant demonize him for this or even remotely tie it to the PR community going downhill.

Furthermore, it's not standard operating proceedure for IHS to lock squads to keep people out, but it is something that we are allowed to do. If you think otherwise, please have a gander at the thousands of TG Assault squads that Dirtboy makes that are filled up within 5 seconds of creation. Take a look at the vast majority of the squads that I run. We have no problem taking in other players who bear the 6th tag, but if theres a bunch of us on, and we want to squad up together, dont complain cause we wont let you in. Simple as that.

Also, Jevski made a very good point about instances such as the "3 man tank" squads that skud likes to run. If you have 3 players in a 3 man tank squad, that fills a tank. If you have four, the last guy is going to be questionable. Many times, Skud will let a veteran player that he can depend on in as a fourth so he can get a repair truck to follow his tank, but with the pub mentality that a lot of the random folk that come play on the server have and their complete ineptitude when it comes to following orders, you cant just open the squad to anyone, and thats perfectly justified. The squad system is designed so that the groups can function as a cohesive unit. This doesnt work if your tank has 3 guys and your fourth guy is across the map trying to HAT snipe cause he doesnt listen to you.

It's also very easy to get noticed in this community and become a trusted player. A good example of this is a fellow I met only recently: DemonsRage. I had never seen him before a week or so ago, but he proved very quickly that he can follow orders and do his job without whining or even bending the rules. If he has questions about what is or isnt allowed, he ASKS! We have a lot of people that come on the server, play for a bit, do something dumb and get banned, then they wonder why they got the hammer. If they had bothered to play with some degree of intelligence and awareness like Demons has demonstrated in the time I've seen him here, it wouldnt have been a problem, but alas, thats not the mindset of most pubbies that pop in.

**TheSkudDestroyer** · 11-06-2007, 01:25 PM

Respect is EARNED.

New players ARE welcome in my squad. I have nothing against helping new fledging players gain new experience in the game. Do I have much tolerance for those who refuse to read the manual? In short, no. Even as an experience PR player I still READ and CONSULT the manual and reality mod wiki.

There is no excuse not to read up before playing.

It all sounds arrogant, and to an extent it is. But once again, respect is earned. There are alot of Tg regulars that I've seen grow from pubbies to guys like Jevski, who like I mentioned, are ON THE BALL. They know what they're doing, they ARE on the same level of competence in the game as any IHS. They had to take TIME and effort to get to where they are.

Here at TG, we're all still LEARNING to an extent. But we shouldnt have to teach the basics. If a guy joins my squad and says "Hey I'm kinda new" I usually respond with "Alright, just follow orders and you'll be doing fine." GENERALLY, new players do very well if they simply follow orders. I don't need anything more than that: Follow orders.

Furthermore, shouldnt I have the right on the server to determine who I WANT to play with? I come here for my enjoyment. While that sounds terribly selfish, if I don't want to play with certain players, why should I be forced to? This is not "elitist," and I'm not going to bicker or debate how I run my squad. Everyone is given a fair chance and warnings.

**Dirtboy** · 11-06-2007, 03:19 PM

Ok...here is my take on this WHOLE situation.

Admins and Rule Breakers:

Admins cannot do this alone. I can tell you right now that the admin staff here are working our tails off. I get minimal amounts of sleep and I regularly monitor the server via BF2CC. I am almost always on Teamspeak and I leave it on and turn it up when I go to bed just in case someone needs me. I have NO PROBLEM getting up and helping out. It is my job here, and I know that the other PR admins are the same. That being said, it is YOUR responsibilty as players to report people that are breaking the server rules. When somebody asks "Who is doing the H-AT sniping on the MEC side at Grid B-5" over Teamspeak, there better be at least one person spilling the beans. We cannot see who is doing what over CC. This must be monitored by YOU..the player.

Team Stacking and Locked Squads:

A minor problem, but a problem nonetheless. When I join the server, the first thing I look for is what side my IHS is on and see if I can switch over. If me switching will cause the server to be lopsided, I will not. I rarley lock a squad up and when I do, its because I want to play with my IHS. But for the most part I create the "TG Assault" squad and leave it open and for players to join if they choose too. I normally get a good mix of Regulars and Pubbies and I that is what I look for. The problem with this is that it normally fills up in about .2 nano seconds and I don't really like kicking people because I operate on a first come first serve basis. I don't care if you don't have a mic...just communicate. A good example is BF2DefaultPlayer...I have never heard his voice but he follows directions to the tee and never deviates from the plan. I enjoy having new players coming into my squad and I am sure they enjoy having me as their SL.

Having random pubbies in your Squad does 3 things...

1. You can mold them the "right" way.
2. Introduce them into the community.
3. Gaining a reputation in PR.

Locked Squads are sometimes needed. As previously stated, you don't need a full squad doing a "sabotage" mission or being a part of a "2-man sniper Squad". But once again, having a designated "Chopper" squad is a touchy subject. Everyone thinks that they are a ub3r-1337 pilot and that they automatically deserve a spot on that particular squad. This is what I propose to you...What is good for the TEAM? How will you HELP the team win? If you know that you aren't the greatest pilot...maybe you should think about letting someone else be in that squad. There is nothing worse than seeing 12 people at the mainbase waiting for a single chopper with 3 different locked Chopper squads. Discuss who will be the chopper Squad beforehand and settle it like grown men...don't whine to an admin, and don't create another chopper Squad. Granted, this is not a rule, more or less an Gentlemens Agreement.

Favoritism:

Come on now...are you serious? I don't show favorites whatsoever. I actually expect the |TG| tag wearers to a higher standard than the pubbies. But when someone reports that a repuatable TG member is doing something wrong, I will be a little sceptical but I assure you that it will be looked into and dealt with. I feel offended by your remarks Nerds...and you should be ashamed for those outrages claims. If you have a serious problem with something and you feel that you have been wronged, pm me or another admin. I, along with many others, pay SM fee's to provide YOU and everyone welse with a quality server. There is a reason why we are the Number 1 server for PR! But Blonov said it best so I won't get more into it.

------------------

Ferris brought this topic up with good intentions and has asked for ideas. So far, the majority of these threads are bashing and it will soon cause a huge flame war that I don't want to see. I do not want to lock the thread but will if it continues going in the same direction.

There...now I have to go back to work

**w.WAREHOUSE** · 11-06-2007, 04:21 PM

we have password night...
how bout we start having "VOIP-ONLY" night too?

|TG-X|Bootytrap · 11-06-2007, 05:03 PM

I've asked to be invited to Skuds 3man tank squad a couple times, and he let me in everytime making me the 4th guy. It might be because I typed in chat "Invite me and I will drive repair jeep." or it might not be....but he has let me in whenever I have asked, which I appreciate.

For all the occasional HAT sniping, and othe Tomfoolery...this is still the best server to play PR on by FAR....because of admins, and rule enforcement. Act stupid and there very well may be consequences. We can't expect 100% compliance because that would require some one to be in spectator mode observing the whole time like a friggin referee.....which would suck.

Gahlas · 11-06-2007, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by w.WAREHOUSE

we have password night...
how bout we start having "VOIP-ONLY" night too?

Why do you say this?
Some of the best squad members are mic-less ones. You will never find better guys than Robocop or Evil Lemon in your squad and they never used mics. Furthermore some of the worst players are those with mics. I see no reason to exclude a large portion of the community, both PR and TG.

Also, how many of you started playing without mics and then grew to love and be part of the community, then decided to get one?

**NERDS_R_COOL** · 11-06-2007, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirtboy

Favoritism:

Come on now...are you serious? I don't show favorites whatsoever. I actually expect the |TG| tag wearers to a higher standard than the pubbies. But when someone reports that a repuatable TG member is doing something wrong, I will be a little sceptical but I assure you that it will be looked into and dealt with. I feel offended by your remarks Nerds...and you should be ashamed for those outrages claims. If you have a serious problem with something and you feel that you have been wronged, pm me or another admin. I, along with many others, pay SM fee's to provide YOU and everyone welse with a quality server. There is a reason why we are the Number 1 server for PR! But Blonov said it best so I won't get more into it.

------------------

Ferris brought this topic up with good intentions and has asked for ideas. So far, the majority of these threads are bashing and it will soon cause a huge flame war that I don't want to see. I do not want to lock the thread but will if it continues going in the same direction.

There...now I have to go back to work

Theres a rather famous saying about "good intentions".

I read his post and was not angered by it. But felt like responding. By his reply, I got the feeling that he understood my post. But by the tone of various others TG and non TG alike it certainly stirred up a hornets nest. But the bottom line is these are things that I have seen from TG on your server. I do not feel "ashamed" for making "outrageous claims", as these things happened while I followed your guidlines/rules by another TG member, and when I brought it up the response given seems to go against The Main Point of Ferris' rant.

Frankly Dirtboy, if Ferris wanted a touchy feel good thread where everyone got along and held hands he could have picked a private thread to do this in. That way no one who wasn't a supporting member could see it or respond. If people choose to respond to my statement (whether in partial or whole) to say essentially "Well I pay for this server" then what you have on your hands is a server that is the same as 99.9% of the other

11-06-2007, 01:54 AM	#33 (permalink)
kittykatnub Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Milky Way Galaxy Posts: 541	Re: The State of Affairs Yeah, getting a 1 man squad for lets say 1 transport LB isn't good. I do that at the start of a round then unlock it later that way people can get into squads with real SLs that aren't just flying around. I do unlock it later for those few people that can't get into another squad or enjoy talking to me (lol, i find a lot that do that actually) or want to get to a hill to snipe, etc... __________________ unlocks_r_emo / Pistolfied ~ xfire = pistolfied ~ PSN = Pistolfied Video card shat itself. Awaiting on a new computer >.<

11-06-2007, 03:49 AM	#34 (permalink)
TurkishDelight Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 835	Re: The State of Affairs I agree with what Skud says about locking squads. I operate very similarly and think that it is infact, more helpful to the team if I lock a "sniper" or "recon" squad. No sense in taking 3-4 more good players out of the immidiate battle just so they can blow our cover In some situations I might lock the squad when it has 4-5 people in it, simply for the fact that I know the people and that it acts coherently together. Adding another member or two might actually make the squad less useful, if the new additions break up the liquid like movement of the squad. On the other hand if someone requests an invite to a "Non-Speciality" squad, I will usually give it to them unless I have reasons not to. __________________ \|TG-X\|Turkish

11-06-2007, 01:09 PM	#38 (permalink)
Jevski Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Denmark, Copenhagen Age: 37 Posts: 196	Re: The State of Affairs I totally disagree with you JAMerica. As the saying goes, Respect is earned. I started playing PR around 0.5 and hung around TG more and more because here I found much more teamwork than elsewhere. First of all this is a game and we are all here to have fun. Playing day after day with people who didn't even take the time to read the manual can be a strain on any fun. That doesn't mean that I don't want to educate new players, but there is a lot to do before running with the IHS. Among these things are reading tactics and tips on the forum. Get acquainted with the game and its playing style. Crawl before you try to run. That Skud locks a squad because he dosnt need more people in a specops squad or an tank squad isnt being selfish, all he would accomplish by doing that is creating a lone wolf player. I worked my way up from an ignorant noob who didn't know how to play it the right way, to a player that it mostly invited when I ask for an invite. So if I can learn to play the game right without having playing with an IHS, so can others. Regarding keeping certain players out. Well I too chose not to play with some. It may be because I played with them before and they didn't respond to orders and kept ignoring the chain of command or it may be some other reason. But again i am playing to have fun not to sit in front of the computer getting frustrated at someone telling me to take a hike cause they just want to snipe. So what to do? I'd say go play have fun. And eventually you will earn to play with some of the better players, because when you just started out everything will be new and confusing and running with the big boys does not help a lot cause you haven't got a clue what your squad leader is talking about. /Jev

11-06-2007, 01:22 PM	#39 (permalink)
Ferris Bueller Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Orlando, FL Age: 26 Posts: 4,970	Re: The State of Affairs I agree with Jevski. As I pointed out in my original post, locked squads are acceptable under certain circumstances. Hand in hand with this is the privelege that IHS members can choose to invoke by playing with their squad mates. In this light, Skud was simply justifying his reasons against people that are invite-happy. I can tell you as a point of fact that Skud plays with unlocked squads and people he may or may not be familiar with far more frequently than he plays with a full, or even partially full 6th squad. His point was that if he chooses to lock his squad, he has a reason, and his reasons are well within the boundaries of the rules. You cant demonize him for this or even remotely tie it to the PR community going downhill. Furthermore, it's not standard operating proceedure for IHS to lock squads to keep people out, but it is something that we are allowed to do. If you think otherwise, please have a gander at the thousands of TG Assault squads that Dirtboy makes that are filled up within 5 seconds of creation. Take a look at the vast majority of the squads that I run. We have no problem taking in other players who bear the 6th tag, but if theres a bunch of us on, and we want to squad up together, dont complain cause we wont let you in. Simple as that. Also, Jevski made a very good point about instances such as the "3 man tank" squads that skud likes to run. If you have 3 players in a 3 man tank squad, that fills a tank. If you have four, the last guy is going to be questionable. Many times, Skud will let a veteran player that he can depend on in as a fourth so he can get a repair truck to follow his tank, but with the pub mentality that a lot of the random folk that come play on the server have and their complete ineptitude when it comes to following orders, you cant just open the squad to anyone, and thats perfectly justified. The squad system is designed so that the groups can function as a cohesive unit. This doesnt work if your tank has 3 guys and your fourth guy is across the map trying to HAT snipe cause he doesnt listen to you. It's also very easy to get noticed in this community and become a trusted player. A good example of this is a fellow I met only recently: DemonsRage. I had never seen him before a week or so ago, but he proved very quickly that he can follow orders and do his job without whining or even bending the rules. If he has questions about what is or isnt allowed, he ASKS! We have a lot of people that come on the server, play for a bit, do something dumb and get banned, then they wonder why they got the hammer. If they had bothered to play with some degree of intelligence and awareness like Demons has demonstrated in the time I've seen him here, it wouldnt have been a problem, but alas, thats not the mindset of most pubbies that pop in. __________________ \|TG-6th\|Ferris Bueller Important TG Reading \| Support TG - Become a Supporting Member \| TacticalWiki - Your TG Guide Kicked/Banned? READ THIS FIRST! \| Complete list of TG Admins \| Think Someone Did A Good Job? Nominate Them For a Ribbon! Report Problem Players/Appeal Your Ban \| Learn TG - The TG Mentoring Program __________________ "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity." -Lazarus Long

11-06-2007, 01:25 PM	#40 (permalink)
TheSkudDestroyer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: NY Posts: 3,203	Re: The State of Affairs Respect is EARNED. New players ARE welcome in my squad. I have nothing against helping new fledging players gain new experience in the game. Do I have much tolerance for those who refuse to read the manual? In short, no. Even as an experience PR player I still READ and CONSULT the manual and reality mod wiki. There is no excuse not to read up before playing. It all sounds arrogant, and to an extent it is. But once again, respect is earned. There are alot of Tg regulars that I've seen grow from pubbies to guys like Jevski, who like I mentioned, are ON THE BALL. They know what they're doing, they ARE on the same level of competence in the game as any IHS. They had to take TIME and effort to get to where they are. Here at TG, we're all still LEARNING to an extent. But we shouldnt have to teach the basics. If a guy joins my squad and says "Hey I'm kinda new" I usually respond with "Alright, just follow orders and you'll be doing fine." GENERALLY, new players do very well if they simply follow orders. I don't need anything more than that: Follow orders. Furthermore, shouldnt I have the right on the server to determine who I WANT to play with? I come here for my enjoyment. While that sounds terribly selfish, if I don't want to play with certain players, why should I be forced to? This is not "elitist," and I'm not going to bicker or debate how I run my squad. Everyone is given a fair chance and warnings. __________________ \|TG-6th\|Skud 6.5 weeks Lackland AFB 8 months Keesler AFB, 1W0X1 - Weather The 6th Devils - Now with MORE Air Force! "...I simply stated "Video Games". They thought I was joking..." Last edited by TheSkudDestroyer; 11-06-2007 at 02:14 PM.

11-06-2007, 03:19 PM	#41 (permalink)
Dirtboy Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Las Vegas! Age: 24 Posts: 3,178	Re: The State of Affairs Ok...here is my take on this WHOLE situation. Admins and Rule Breakers: Admins cannot do this alone. I can tell you right now that the admin staff here are working our tails off. I get minimal amounts of sleep and I regularly monitor the server via BF2CC. I am almost always on Teamspeak and I leave it on and turn it up when I go to bed just in case someone needs me. I have NO PROBLEM getting up and helping out. It is my job here, and I know that the other PR admins are the same. That being said, it is YOUR responsibilty as players to report people that are breaking the server rules. When somebody asks "Who is doing the H-AT sniping on the MEC side at Grid B-5" over Teamspeak, there better be at least one person spilling the beans. We cannot see who is doing what over CC. This must be monitored by YOU..the player. Team Stacking and Locked Squads: A minor problem, but a problem nonetheless. When I join the server, the first thing I look for is what side my IHS is on and see if I can switch over. If me switching will cause the server to be lopsided, I will not. I rarley lock a squad up and when I do, its because I want to play with my IHS. But for the most part I create the "TG Assault" squad and leave it open and for players to join if they choose too. I normally get a good mix of Regulars and Pubbies and I that is what I look for. The problem with this is that it normally fills up in about .2 nano seconds and I don't really like kicking people because I operate on a first come first serve basis. I don't care if you don't have a mic...just communicate. A good example is BF2DefaultPlayer...I have never heard his voice but he follows directions to the tee and never deviates from the plan. I enjoy having new players coming into my squad and I am sure they enjoy having me as their SL. Having random pubbies in your Squad does 3 things... 1. You can mold them the "right" way. 2. Introduce them into the community. 3. Gaining a reputation in PR. Locked Squads are sometimes needed. As previously stated, you don't need a full squad doing a "sabotage" mission or being a part of a "2-man sniper Squad". But once again, having a designated "Chopper" squad is a touchy subject. Everyone thinks that they are a ub3r-1337 pilot and that they automatically deserve a spot on that particular squad. This is what I propose to you...What is good for the TEAM? How will you HELP the team win? If you know that you aren't the greatest pilot...maybe you should think about letting someone else be in that squad. There is nothing worse than seeing 12 people at the mainbase waiting for a single chopper with 3 different locked Chopper squads. Discuss who will be the chopper Squad beforehand and settle it like grown men...don't whine to an admin, and don't create another chopper Squad. Granted, this is not a rule, more or less an Gentlemens Agreement. Favoritism: Come on now...are you serious? I don't show favorites whatsoever. I actually expect the \|TG\| tag wearers to a higher standard than the pubbies. But when someone reports that a repuatable TG member is doing something wrong, I will be a little sceptical but I assure you that it will be looked into and dealt with. I feel offended by your remarks Nerds...and you should be ashamed for those outrages claims. If you have a serious problem with something and you feel that you have been wronged, pm me or another admin. I, along with many others, pay SM fee's to provide YOU and everyone welse with a quality server. There is a reason why we are the Number 1 server for PR! But Blonov said it best so I won't get more into it. ------------------ Ferris brought this topic up with good intentions and has asked for ideas. So far, the majority of these threads are bashing and it will soon cause a huge flame war that I don't want to see. I do not want to lock the thread but will if it continues going in the same direction. There...now I have to go back to work __________________ \|TG-6th\| Dirtboy Need an Admin? \| Want to help TG? \| The 6th Devil's Brigade Jump on it!

11-06-2007, 04:21 PM	#42 (permalink)
w.WAREHOUSE Join Date: Apr 2007 Age: 31 Posts: 712	Re: The State of Affairs we have password night... how bout we start having "VOIP-ONLY" night too? __________________ \|TG-X\|WAREHOUSE

11-06-2007, 05:03 PM	#43 (permalink)
\|TG-X\|Bootytrap Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Tacoma WA Age: 39 Posts: 122	Re: The State of Affairs I've asked to be invited to Skuds 3man tank squad a couple times, and he let me in everytime making me the 4th guy. It might be because I typed in chat "Invite me and I will drive repair jeep." or it might not be....but he has let me in whenever I have asked, which I appreciate. For all the occasional HAT sniping, and othe Tomfoolery...this is still the best server to play PR on by FAR....because of admins, and rule enforcement. Act stupid and there very well may be consequences. We can't expect 100% compliance because that would require some one to be in spectator mode observing the whole time like a friggin referee.....which would suck.

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