llPANCHOll

Thats where you got your "Acog of Infinite Magnitude", "Flak Vest of Invisibillity" and your "+20 Singing Dagger"



But to the point..
I can understand and empathise your rational behind locking your squads... Every single point rang true, and the Tenth on "occasion" locks their squad until everyone can get in, (On Password Nights) but then if there is room the squad is unlocked and it invariably fills up. Sometimes we get the guy that cant shut up, and sometimes we get a new face that brings something great to the table. It is not always rewarding on our part to have an "Open Door Policy", at times it can be hairpullingly frustrating, but I believe that in the end, it fosters growth and improves the Community as a whole. As you stated, TF21 is a Community, but as your Community often uses the playground provided by the TG Community.. I would suggest taking one for the team and Unlocking the Door every once in a while and giving back to the Community that you enjoy so much. You might make some new freinds..

As far as Teamspeak.. Try out the TG Teamspeak channel some Password Night.. You still have in game VOIP, and you might actually enjoy being able to communicate with other SL's without relying on the Commander to relay the message.

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UberJ

I don't think anyone is trying to fill any type of emptiness with tf21, or even trying to call out tf21. It's just the fact that it has been stated many times by admins that the locking of squads in these types of situations shouldn't be going on.
(See:http://www.tacticalgamer.com/battlef...eeds-stop.html)

People don't like double standards, and there will always be complaints as long as you have pseudo rules floating around that seem to apply to some people but not to others.

That being said, I could honestly care less if they lock their squads. I rarely have time to play anymore anyways. Just an observation from someone on the outside looking in.

JCTango

(edit: nevermind)

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Lord of the Mangoes
In the nuclear world, the true enemy can't be destroyed.
In the nuclear world, the true enemy is war itself.

Diligent_BF2

JCTango self-corrects too fast for me to comment.

Nvm x2

imnotacanadian

He also quotes himself more than anybody I know

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[TF21]Wolfe

Admin requests to keep squads unlocked is directed at the TG community, not the public. To use a quote from the link you provided:

The idea behind unlocked squads is get public players into TG squads, thereby showing them solid TG leadership and hoping they will become TG members. Public players are not asked to promote TG or encourage new players to join TG in his manner, nor should they be. That responsibility rests with the admins and other TG members, not the general population that plays there.

So when a TG member sees a locked squad they may think, "Hey, that squad isn't following the code of the TG community!" and they would be right, except for one detail: that squad isn't part of the TG community. They're public players.

TurkishDelight

Haha!

Randy I love it, it sounds like some of my magnificant speeches on various issues on this forum.

Great stuff!

One tip though, leave the sarcasm hints out of it, that way you can get cool pm's regarding your awesomeness

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|TG-X|Turkish

Steiner

Quite true, even though those public players are operating within the boundries of the TG-community. The responsibility with keeping the server good lay with those who play on the server. Once you join the server, it is your responsibility to operate and behave within certain boundries. Once you join the server - you are part of it. It is not up to a certain group of people/players to provide a good and positive gaming enviroment for all others. It is something that TG-members and public players alike have to do, or do you disagree?

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|TG-6th|Steiner

Can't work out how to have several different images [such as banners and ribbons] in the signature, so I will drop that project for now...

"-He has a wife, you know. Do you know what she's called? 'Incontinentia'... Incontinentia Buttocks."

"...and suicide isn´t an option either, since it would probably make some prick happy...

Taip3n

Not sure where this thread is going. The irony of TG 'clans' locking squads and then all this 'seemingly' animosity below the jokes does not pass me. But the thread starter in no way is being hidden, like this I mention above. The opposite actually.

Thanks for the insights there Wolfe, nicely written, kindly thought out and open!

Joined a squad made by a TF21 member last night (CET), actually - it was unlocked and was rapidly filled by all sorts of people - good people though. Everyone represented humility and humanity and kindness. One TG, one TF21 and the rest. No 'cool' names.

Had fun, till he had to go (logged for for reason unsure about but seemed maybe a kick). Thanks though, was good. I hope to have performed an SL postion to your standards once you left. I have to say, those 'all sorts' in the squad out performed anything; a credit to yourselves.

On that note I'd like to thank squad 5's brave defence of the North Bunker against overwhelming odds. Whilst we waited for the team to cap North Village, in Kashan (which we never did ^^). Not seen anything like it; totally amazing bit of fury, teamwork, compassion and the will to not drop - pat yourselves on the back! Credit is deserved and due - and you deserve it.

Since our team didn't do it, and with our spawn finally down, an APC hammering us whilst a squad tried to prize our position, we finally had to fall but those MEC found out rats in a corner have an angry bite.. plus one medic :P

All started by a TF21 don't ya know.

Anyway. What's this thread about anyway? Ah yeah, thanks Wolfe

Elwenil

I don't really understand the whole controversy against TF21 and TG IHS' locking squads. We don't do it all the time, and I think we balance out the time the squads are locked and unlocked. Point blank, if the 10th SL doesn't lock the squad, it's damn hard to click fast enough to get in it. I guess popularity has it's costs, but we are no different then anyone else. The point of having a locked squad is pretty much as TF21 has explained it. It allows players who want to play together the opportunity to work together and take advantage of their abilities as a team. Is that wrong? If so, why is that wrong? What would be the point of joining an IHS at TG if you were not allowed to play together as a team?

I think I speak for most of the IHS' here when I say that we aren't in it for the neat tag or to be in a cool "club" or something. We formed the 10th because we all had similar ideas about tactics and strategy and we work well together in game. How can that be considered a bad thing?

Now I know that it's not good to join a game and see 3 locked squads with only one or two players in them that basically are locked for no good reason, and I also realize that we should promote TG to new players, but there has to be a line in the sand here somewhere on this topic. All IHS members (with the exception of some of the Irregulars) are Supporting Members, which means we help pay for the servers we play on. Should we have a lesser experience because of people who are in effect "just visiting"? I don't mean to sound antisocial or anti-noob, but we have to come to some sort of understanding and I for one think it should be more in favor of the people here who pay for the server now, rather than in favor of people who may or may not join TG and become a Supporting Member.

Finally, I am just in general sick of all the whining that is associated with PR here at TG. I totally uninstalled the game because I'm just fed up with certain aspects of the game itself and just tired of the same old BS from various players in and out of TG. I may reinstall it later, but for now I'm taking a break from the frustration. There needs to be a hard, concrete set of rules on this and many other questions and complaints on the PR server that leave no room for error, interpretation, or debate. Then there needs to be some unyielding and consistent action taken to enforce these rules. I'm to the point that I don't care if the rules are in line with my own ideas or not, they just need to exist and be enforced. I know the Admins are doing a good job now, but there are too many grey areas that seem to be footholds for the complainers to get a grip and hang on, complaining all the while. Either understand that locked team oriented squads benefit the team in the long run, or just outlaw them and let everyone join where they will and lets see what happens then. This endless debate by people who feel they are missing out on some special, magical thing that happens inside a locked squad is a vomit-worthy waste of time.

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BloodAce

Personally when i join server i don't mind locked squads until there are others unlocked squads with free slots. Even if there are not you may start your own squad with other guy and try work as sniper/specops. The problem starts when max number of squads is reached and all are full or locked. But this not happen often and shouldn't be issue.

Anyway in my opinion the more annoying thing from locked squads is to see crewman in APC or sniper on the SL position with full infantry squad following him without any clue.

Taip3n

See your point there Elwenil.

Agree with all bar two things. Iron rules would swiftly lead to silliness in its own right.

Better to have a modicum of common sense and insight - or there would be no balanced judgement but oppresion. Sure you know that anyway.

Thing is, don't you think some form of 'elitism' lends itself to egoism? I for one heartily agree there is too much pomposity here - that's why I keep saying to 'chill out' and take the middle line.

And although people can afford to pay for supporting membership and get some benefits like loging on swifter - it does not preclude that they are 'above' someone who can not financially pay for a 'status'; infact the TG way is to view community and individuals in it, above and beyond all other status'.

So the problem, I think, is that people are not relaxed here - even paranoid (? methinks me detect a little here but no suprises) that people get at them. This leads to miscomprehension. Also I see too many views on the hard 'wings'. Or people believing in some sort of purity - often refered to elitism or the strive for 'perfection'; a sort of underliying mindset that leads to 'purity' that beholdens onto everyone else that just wants to hang out and be part of the community too.

I got a TG tag but not used it - because of the malaise. When I feel TG deserve my name to it, then I will wear it - it's not that I deserve TG. It's not that I care about the cash, when it comes to TG, it will come, till then real life comes, and no TGer would say otherwise.

Again - I refer to WhiskeySix's post on what it's all about..

Or you all loose the whole meaning up your own wind and gusto. As we say: can't see the wood through the trees.

Hoisted on your own petard, springs to mind too.

Try the middle ground and have some humour to laugh at yourselves, and Allow; as long as you are not a detriment, not being stupid, egotistical, selfish or high and mighty - but actually open, thoughtful, caring, friendly, intuitive and 'the other person' spirited.

Personally, I will continue to strive for the latter.

Again, well done squad 5 didn't get your names :/ Just too awestruck - or I'd give ya a big up in name!

Again.. Thanks Wolfe

Outlawz7

I know that's sarcasm but what about actually doing something like that?

A.WICKENS

Im in two minds about the locking squads thing which will probably surprise any one thats played with me who no doubt harbours the suspicion that I barely have one. TF21 can do as they please, the members I've met seem fine but I've no burning desire to join their squad.

If we end up with multiple locked TF21 squads to the detriment of other players then it will need to be addressed. This is a TG server and if if becomes full with players who use their own voip and have no wish to assimilate with the TG community then the foot has to go down. Supporting members don't pay for that. On the other hand I totally understand the point Wolfe makes about co-ordination so it is a difficult one. Perhaps a little more effort on both sides would help things along.

One thing I would like to comment on is the 'I am sick of hearing this' type posts that always crop up. This is a 'forum' for discussing PR. If you don't like reading about this sort of stuff then it's simple, don't read the post and certainly don't post. It is the literary equivalent of telling people to shut up and has no place on a forum of all places.

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Delta*RandyShugart*

I am glad to have some in depth knowledge of what goes behind the scenes at TF21. The history behind it is very interesting and I actually googled what TF21 stands for, very interesting stuff.

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P.I.C. No F.S.
NYY NYR