Jeepo_SAS

Interesting to see how this plays out though. In all the squads im involved in, i think there is always at least 2 medics....except Root's, he would have 5......

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|TG-22nd|Jeepo

loyalguard

Although I am in favor of the medic change overall, I am a little concerned that the VOIP limitations of BF2 will undermine the effectiveness. As Grunt said, this means that there will be more medics per squad which is less realistic IMO. The reason for this is since there is no inter-squad VOIP, the only reliable way to communicate to request another medic to come heal you is if he is in your squad.

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|TG| LoyalGuard

Switch

I think ferris needs to take a day off.

I'll comment more later -- ive been doing GRE prep for the past few hours and I don't have it in me to read the essay he wrote above.

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|TG|Switch

Better known as:
That noob who crashed the chopper.
That noob who ran over the mine.
That noob who TK'd me with a sniper rifle.
That noob who hit that APC at 300m with light AT! Our APC...

ednos

Consider this: Project Reality does not change the fact that units in BF2 still have "hit points", even though you can't see them on the screen. It doesn't matter where you're bleeding in the game, so until they remove the generic "hit", they shouldn't remove the generic "heal". It's a balance issue.

Ferris is correct.

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The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. ~ Bertrand Russell
I have a tendency to key out three or four things and then let them battle for supremacy while I key, so there's a lot of backspacing as potential statements are slaughtered and eaten by the victors. ~ Magna Centipede

loyalguard

I am retracting a little bit, not because I disagree with the change for realism sake, but because it could negatively affect gameplay from other aspects (too many or too few medics). Here is a post I made on the PR forum in a similar debate:

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|TG| LoyalGuard

ChernobylKinsman

At least medics get body armour and 3 field dressings now, that'll do for me.

The field dressings are usually used to free bodies however, rather than self healing, it'll be hard to remember to keep one in reserve to heal yourself, still as long as there is a rifleman around I'll cope I'm sure.

BigGaayAl

Excellent solution. The bandages were always a lame addition that hollows out the medic's role. The only class that should have this imo is maybe the spec ops, since he should be behind enemy lines, and will normally not have a medic around. All other kits should have their medic close enough.

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Support your right to arm bears. ~Cleveland Amory

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ChernobylKinsman

I'm also a little sad to see there are only 4 non special/limited kits to choose from now, variety is the spice of life...

Still, I mainly played Medic or Rifleman before hand, so I suppose it won't change too much for me personally.

Root

The medic changes aren't very helpful IMO and Ferris has pretty much nailed it. It also looks like there are going to be fewer maps with helos in 0.6. Very disappointing.

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Plan6

I find stuff like this amusing, is BF2 set in some strange alternate history where we still have medics from WW2, unarmed and totally focused on saving lives.

My brother, who just finished a tour in Iraq about 3 months ago sat down to play with me a little while ago. He switched to medic class and quickly noted that they did not have grenades. When he asked why, I also told him they didn't have body armor either.

His exact quote was "What the -=bleep=- army are they from?"

The whole "Medics heal people, they dont fight" argument is silly. Really medics dont have all the perks other kits have because of balance reasons. All the kits are giving what they have for balance reason. Although PR is all about making the game have a more realistic feel, its not to make the game just like real life.

Its clear that the guys at PR want medics to have a bit more front like combat abilities, and from what I hear they are getting body armor. Because of that their healing abilities are being reduced. Thats fine with me as long as they have more field dressings(at least more than the squad leader) to keep themselves going.

All and all I am going to give the new medic kit a try, but I do have fears with the lack of information be released and the number of things that are being limited. I have a hard enough time getting Heavy AT when my squad needs it, I would hate for that to happen with Light AT. APCs are a pain as it is.

Morganan

The medic changes are bad imo..

These changes basically pigeonhole a medic into playing a certain style. You no longer can play a true "support medic", medics after this change will basically be rifleman who traded their ammo bags and frag's for a defib along with bandages that dont need to be re-supplied. (the medic's bandages will be mostly useless for themselves since they will almost always end up dead long before that supply is used up)

These changes along with buggy bandages that sometimes just fall thru the ground, why even take a medic? Why not get an officer to lay over ammo bags and just drop a ton of bandages for his squad to use? The choice between wanting a medic in your squad over a rifleman has been made simple. With a medic you trade the ammo bags of the rifleman for the ability to save yourself a few tickets by using the defib's on friendly's. A fair tradeoff. Then you give up frag grenades for basically bandages that dont need to be resupplied? The only advantage to getting the medical bag over bandages is that the bandages are buggy and sometimes don't work. Since post .6 no medic is going to be running around trying to heal his squad/team with his med bag out, I can only hope to god they fix the bandages and quickly.

Lith1um

When this change has been instituted I'm positive we'll see less medics in the field. Furthermore, the medics we will see won't be risking themselves in the majority of situations. On days when the server is packed with TG minded players it should be marginaly acceptable, but on pubish days it's going to poison the mod. The waiting and walking will increase for medics and that's not fun imo. Less people will fill the role, deminishing the potential for sustained front line firefights. And speaking as a squad leader, getting two people to fill medic roles is difficult even now. And I virtualy always request 2.

Imo body armor doesn't mean squat. I'd rather have a frag or two. So I can take one more bullet, big deal.

And to be honest, I'm getting real tired of being force fed a steady diet of infantry maps. BF2 was designed for large, combined arms battles. Tanks, helo's, dogfights overhead, bombers, transports, etc. It seems like we never play maps that have anything other than a constant focus on infantry battles. Now they are removing one of the few vehicle rich maps we have. I'm getting tired of the rotation. Bah.

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stickyjeans69

you know alot of people are talking about risking it for the team mate, and that's pretty reasonable................but if there's a Squad member 300 yards away in the middle of an open field who just got laid out.................Medic ain't coming. should be the same way in the game, another statistic. a Squad leader won't risk his entire squad for 1 person. maybe in some situations the risk is worth it, but i could name quite a few where in order to keep everyone else alive the SL won't make the stupid decision of risking more men.

ChernobylKinsman

Personally I'd like them to have more than 3 field dressings, or some other method of freeing bodies from terrain.

Ferris Bueller

I'm not going to really bring up anything new, but the main reason this change sucks is because the medic is the only class that is defenseless when doing his job. A rifleman will toss out ammo very quickly and be back to his job. An engineer/mechanic will be hidden behind a vehicle while repairing (very few people play this class at the moment anyway, but that should change with the bunker additions). A medic cant drop his bag and is completely vulnerable when healing or reviving teammates. Now the ability to extend his lifespan as a way of compensating for having no offensive capability while performing the primary mission has been stripped and it's just plain wrong.

We're going to see a combination of two things in the coming days:
First we're going to see multiple medics in each squad, which will lead to more casualties and lower k/d ratios as well as an increase in ticket loss rate. Then, people will get tired of having to be a medic who is dependent on another medic to stay alive and will just stop playing medic. It's going to become an obsolete class very quickly.

And not to toot our own horn here, but I know that a lot of the PR devs read this board, and being that TG is hailed as one of the best, if not THE best PR server, I'd hope that this amount of outcry from the experienced players would have some bearing on the final decision.

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|TG-6th|Ferris Bueller