Flying Helos - Page 2

sloth · 06-01-2007, 08:50 AM

PR is going back to the BF2v flying system? That's a shame if it is true. Vanilla is nice for letting anyone grab anything and fly without practice but should aircraft be that easy to fly? I don't think so.

FlumBom · 06-01-2007, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sloth

PR is going back to the BF2v flying system? That's a shame if it is true. Vanilla is nice for letting anyone grab anything and fly without practice but should aircraft be that easy to fly? I don't think so.

couldn't say it better my self.

no I'm gonna go a little OT.

Murderous and Felt. have you flown the hellos in BF1942: Dessert Combat mod ?
cause I'm still think they have the "best" feeling to it.

and do you have any nice tip on a good (and economic) combat-Helli / Helli sim ?

Morganan · 06-01-2007, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sloth

PR is going back to the BF2v flying system? That's a shame if it is true. Vanilla is nice for letting anyone grab anything and fly without practice but should aircraft be that easy to fly? I don't think so.

What was said here that would make you think that? The physics in the game engine have always been the same, they can add some modifiers to each vehicle to adjust for example how responsive it is to movements on the X Y or Z axis making it either faster or slower. The BH in PR was using a bad "adjustment", which apparently they have corrected to a better "adjustment".

sloth · 06-01-2007, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabre_Tooth_Tigger

It seems all set to change in 0.6 back to normal bf2 style which is regretable imo.

Did I misunderstand the intended meaning here?

**w.WAREHOUSE** · 06-01-2007, 04:50 PM

Just like we have a reserved slot saved for supporting members, it would be pretty cool to have a server with reserved vehicles for those players that have completed "flight school" or "armor training" etc.

You might try finding |TG|SWITCH in game, as he is one of the best little bird pilots I've seen in terms of knowing some great approach angles and being aware of the big picture. There are quite a few other notables, most of whom have already posted in this "flight" thread that can get you up to speed on the PRM maps. I'd be happy to team up in a Cobra sometime if you ever see me IG.

**Murderous** · 06-01-2007, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabre_Tooth_Tigger

The blackhawk in pr is nuts, I think its great

Same for that strange chinese equalivant of the littlebird, it hops rather then glides or hovers.

I dont for a second think they bare a relation to real helis but they at least force you to concentrate and occasionally panic and struggle to control them which is the realistic bit?

I wouldnt mind hearing how these helis fly in real life. Is the blackhawk like a tank or is it more like a overweight littlebird.

I'd like to see all sorts of things matter like number of passengers altering handling and crosswinds, turbulence, weather patterns.
Not likely when we dont even have rain though

It seems all set to change in 0.6 back to normal bf2 style which is regretable imo.
I think of the physics like puppet strings, in pr we have them very long and something you did a mile back can still effect its feel seconds later. Each axis is like a pendulums arc

I use a mouse to fly, usually does ok except an extreme dive or swerve might need multiple pickup, drop and drags to get enough yaw, etc

The hawk is like a Ferarri in the air my friend. Extremely fast, maneuverable and "feels" light because of all the available power.

mingmong · 06-01-2007, 06:49 PM

Having the following players on my team sways me towards making an Air Cav squad rather than an infantry one, because I know I can trust them in the air:
crawlingeye
Craaaazie8 (I think ¬_¬)
Switch

And several others who I have no doubt forgotten.

Morganan · 06-01-2007, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sloth

Did I misunderstand the intended meaning here?

You said PR is going back to the bf2 model, I misunderstood your meaning of your statement.

And yes, they should be easy to fly. Realistic flight models are for flight sim's, not an arcadey FPS game.

**Sabre_Tooth_Tigger** · 06-01-2007, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murderous

The hawk is like a Ferarri in the air my friend. Extremely fast, maneuverable and "feels" light because of all the available power.

Pretty dam surprised by that description

I disagree Morgann, like how one fellow bf2 transient said to me pr is no longer an arcade game, its got much more atmosphere and the pace is completely different.

However they alter the handling, things like warm up time will stay completely relevant to gameplay in general.

I also believe how the choppers handle does affect how the games play out. Supply chains, army progression and infantary mobility is a massive part of how flags are won or lost at present and helis are the fastest way to travel for any infantary unit.
Make helis arcadey and it will have a general feedback imo

Lavaman000 · 06-01-2007, 09:19 PM

Ok first i have not actually flown the BH in PR yet but i did have a quick go on the LB in a empty server and subsiqently found it to be alot more challanging than in bf2, but in the long run i believe it should be more challenging and strongly dissagree with Morganan's catigorising of PR as a "Arcadey FPS game" i would say that PR is one of a very few games i would catigorise as "Battlefield Sim" and therefore in need of more challenging flight controls...

Lavamanxtra

Morganan · 06-01-2007, 09:59 PM

It is an arcade game with some realistic aspects put into the game, nothing more or less. If it wasn't an arcade game, twitch skills would have little relevance, which they obviously do.

Braidedheadman · 06-01-2007, 11:06 PM

The reality (or realistic aspects) bit is disputable. It's more like an arcade game with a wider array of restriction.

Morganan · 06-01-2007, 11:45 PM

Agreed, as I said, realistic, but far from real...

**RazersEdge** · 06-01-2007, 11:52 PM

Do you not need twitch skills in real life to fight in CQB? Seriously Morganan, just because of that you label it arcadey? And seriously I would be deeply saddened if the helos were made easy for anyone to fly. I think planes need to be made more difficult to fly as well, possibly adding a black-out script for the pilots, so if they go TOO extreme in their maneuvers they can black out. Not on the A-10 of course but on the F-16 and Mig-29 definitely

sloth · 06-02-2007, 01:02 PM

For a realism game to be fun IMO it doesn't have to be perfectly realistic, but it does need to approximate it as best as it can. Since we assume that all "soldiers" in BF2 have had basic firearms training the rifle kits should all be straightforward for anyone to use. Since pilots receive quite a bit of advanced training before they are put behind an aircraft's controls I think making players spend a bit of time practicing before they fly in BF2 seems realistic. I know the flight model isn't great, but just making it technical enough that you can't jump in ADDS not subtracts from the fun of the game.

You are welcome to disagree with me but I agree with Razers, if anything make aircraft more difficult to fly.

06-01-2007, 08:50 AM	#16 (permalink)
sloth Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 43	Re: Flying Helos PR is going back to the BF2v flying system? That's a shame if it is true. Vanilla is nice for letting anyone grab anything and fly without practice but should aircraft be that easy to fly? I don't think so.

06-01-2007, 04:50 PM	#20 (permalink)
w.WAREHOUSE Join Date: Apr 2007 Age: 31 Posts: 530	Re: Flying Helos Just like we have a reserved slot saved for supporting members, it would be pretty cool to have a server with reserved vehicles for those players that have completed "flight school" or "armor training" etc. You might try finding \|TG\|SWITCH in game, as he is one of the best little bird pilots I've seen in terms of knowing some great approach angles and being aware of the big picture. There are quite a few other notables, most of whom have already posted in this "flight" thread that can get you up to speed on the PRM maps. I'd be happy to team up in a Cobra sometime if you ever see me IG.

06-01-2007, 06:49 PM	#22 (permalink)
mingmong Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 323	Re: Flying Helos Having the following players on my team sways me towards making an Air Cav squad rather than an infantry one, because I know I can trust them in the air: crawlingeye Craaaazie8 (I think ¬_¬) Switch And several others who I have no doubt forgotten.

06-01-2007, 09:19 PM	#25 (permalink)
Lavaman000 Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 5	Re: Flying Helos Ok first i have not actually flown the BH in PR yet but i did have a quick go on the LB in a empty server and subsiqently found it to be alot more challanging than in bf2, but in the long run i believe it should be more challenging and strongly dissagree with Morganan's catigorising of PR as a "Arcadey FPS game" i would say that PR is one of a very few games i would catigorise as "Battlefield Sim" and therefore in need of more challenging flight controls... Lavamanxtra

06-01-2007, 09:59 PM	#26 (permalink)
Morganan Join Date: Mar 2007 Age: 37 Posts: 481	Re: Flying Helos It is an arcade game with some realistic aspects put into the game, nothing more or less. If it wasn't an arcade game, twitch skills would have little relevance, which they obviously do.

06-01-2007, 11:06 PM	#27 (permalink)
Braidedheadman Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 933	Re: Flying Helos The reality (or realistic aspects) bit is disputable. It's more like an arcade game with a wider array of restriction. __________________

06-01-2007, 11:45 PM	#28 (permalink)
Morganan Join Date: Mar 2007 Age: 37 Posts: 481	Re: Flying Helos Agreed, as I said, realistic, but far from real...

06-01-2007, 11:52 PM	#29 (permalink)
RazersEdge Join Date: May 2007 Location: Southwestern Ontario, Canada Age: 19 Posts: 57	Re: Flying Helos Do you not need twitch skills in real life to fight in CQB? Seriously Morganan, just because of that you label it arcadey? And seriously I would be deeply saddened if the helos were made easy for anyone to fly. I think planes need to be made more difficult to fly as well, possibly adding a black-out script for the pilots, so if they go TOO extreme in their maneuvers they can black out. Not on the A-10 of course but on the F-16 and Mig-29 definitely

06-02-2007, 01:02 PM	#30 (permalink)
sloth Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 43	Re: Flying Helos For a realism game to be fun IMO it doesn't have to be perfectly realistic, but it does need to approximate it as best as it can. Since we assume that all "soldiers" in BF2 have had basic firearms training the rifle kits should all be straightforward for anyone to use. Since pilots receive quite a bit of advanced training before they are put behind an aircraft's controls I think making players spend a bit of time practicing before they fly in BF2 seems realistic. I know the flight model isn't great, but just making it technical enough that you can't jump in ADDS not subtracts from the fun of the game. You are welcome to disagree with me but I agree with Razers, if anything make aircraft more difficult to fly.

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