mat552

You are entitled to your opinion. You may be right to some, but without jets, or aircraft, why don't you all go play INS mod? Without those vehicles it is no longer BF2/PR. The Modern experience as portrayed by BF2 is the grunts moving along capturing CP's while tanks and aircraft duke it out for the right to support them. That is why PR attracted my attention is because it forces integration of all of those assets. Do not remove jets as they are an important part of the cycle in a good server. Simply because you enjoy CQB and ONLY CQB does not mean that I must endure them round after round. I enjoy them, don't think I don't. But they are tedious, especially when (like the .5 TG rotation) you could go 5 hours without encountering any sort of flying vehicle.
I tried. I think that the AA problem is that people point, click, and get mad when it does not work perfectly. I have had people shoot a missile at a 90 degree angle to me and then loudly complain that it "wont do anything ever"

I understand that it sometimes ignores an easy target, but that is a seldom occasion for me.

One last thing. Fast movers are needed again, very, very badly. 6-10 FAVs with low respawn time would make the game move MUCH faster.

msdz

I love the map but it is entirely to long right now. After that map was done we played Qwai, jeez, never played it in .6 and when we thought we were pushing the Chinese back we see a flag get taken that we had never seen before, WHY? Cause we never get to play that map cause Kashan is to long and hogs all the other maps!!! LOL

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Red

I am all for choppers and other vehicles but Jets are in my opinion so hard to get balanced when you have the small amount of players and small maps that you have in a BF2 map. To make it clear its only jets I see as a balance problem. They have to be powerful to be realistic but if one side get air superioritiy then its just a pain for the other team as they dont have anything to counter them.

And add to this that the implementation of Jets in BF2 makes them usually not coordinated with the ground troops so flying jets are more like lone wolfing and you have the great power to disrupt other players tactics and make them loose interest in the map.

As I stated before this is my opinion about jets, and thats why I loved PR with the no jets infantry maps. I still love the fact that there is Jets in BF and if they can get them balanced then I am all for having them. We saw this in the TG scrims we had when both side had great pilots that got orders from the commander.

But currently they just detract from my fun factor when playing battlefield.

mat552

Agreed, the jets, though balanced in hardware, are VERY lacking in pilots. The good pilots have favorite jets and they team switch to fly those, hence balance issues. Also, people do not know how to effectively counter jets, hence the hate (in my opinion). The jets slightly overpower AA, but if you mobilize your AA potential, you will be fine. A good CO is BADLY needed to enjoy a map with air. I can act on my own as an A10 pilot, but I just do not have all of the intel that I need to be as good as can be. Unless I have a spotter in the squad. I am also working on a communication guidelines for pilot squads and CO's.

BigGaayAl

Amdek has a point about the AA in the end. I've fired a dozen rockets at one jet, some definitely when there were no flares (30 percent I'd estimate) yet I got "0" hits. That is just rediculous. In a book I read about the SAS in Ex-Yugoslavia, a British jet, being guided by sas on the ground was downed by 1 guy, with 1 shot, from 1 SA-X (don't remember the number, 15 or something).

That is very, very different from the way it plays out in Kashan. Imo A locked-on shot with no flares around should hit at least 95% of the time (is this realistic anyone?) and the jets should also be disabled in one shot. I don't think any precision instrument is going to keep flying with the ability to land after being hit by a rocket.

By the way the British pilot survived, met up with the SAS, and got away safe. Most of the muslims in the town were killed or captured by the serbs' ss-like force, after they had neutralized the air threat.

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knewman

Yes I agree the handheld aa needs to be stepped up a little. I sat and the middle of Kashan for 3/4 of the map play time with a stinger and an apc for ammo and I only managed to down 1 frogfoot and one mig. I only got the mig because it stalled really close to me. It is really satisfying to down one of those jets tho...

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Morganan

That is actually probably well above the real life ratio of shots to kills. I mean, lets be honest here, if AAA missiles were as accurate as people think they should be every plane in the US arsenal would have been shot down a few times over from Vietnam to Iraq..

As for real life comparisons, those don't hold up in this game. The missiles in-game are heat-seekers, which are the least effective overall. Weasel missions aren't set up to take out heat-seekers, they are set up to take out radar homer's. Heat seeking is the backup mode on basically every mobile missile battery in the world. There is a reason for it being the "backup mode", that is due to it being the least effective. 1 Radical maneuver to get outside of the "lock-on cone" from the seeker on a heat missile typically gets that missile locking onto the sun. Hand-held missiles are only useful against targets flying below 5k meters or there-about's in the real world, which doesn't translate very well in-game. Ground fired heat seekers only take out bad pilots or get in lucky hit's, nothing more or less.

The bottom line is no matter how you try and cut it, air power tends to detract from pubbie games, which is all PR will ever have, the fine intentions of the server notwithstanding. That is why it makes for bad rounds. Leave the choppers, but the jet's have to go.

Sabre_Tooth_Tigger

I was on kashan and shot down a mig first try. I spent about 15 mins walking across the map previous to that but at least I actually got to do something hey

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