Re: Dedicated transport squads vs Air cav

**Sam Hoy** · 05-17-2007, 12:10 AM

Air Cav=6 man squad with a dedicated transport helo. IE a pilot in the same squad as infantry and working as a unit.

Air Trans=Dedicated helicopter squad which supports/transports squads on a SL-CO request. Meaning, an asset squad of just pilots and an infantry squad temporally working together to evacuate and insert as needed.

Hope that helps Fall.

**gerardnm** · 05-17-2007, 05:33 AM

In a transport squad would it not be better for the SL NOT to fly. I.e. on JAbal direct air operations and assist pilots rather than fly himsel

**Terminal Boy** · 05-17-2007, 06:18 AM

If the SL of an Air Transport squad wasn't airborne himself, where's the best place for him while he's playing Forward Air Controller?

In the Main Base or at a flag or RP where he has eyes on the next LZ his helos will be visiting?

Alternately, what do people think about having each transport helo fully crewed, i.e. a pilot and 2 guys in Crewman/Combat Engineer kits permanently manning the helo's guns? This way, one Transport squad can crew 2 helos.

One of the gunners could be the SL to relay the CO's orders to the pilots over the Squad VoIP.

While this means you can only carry a 3 man Fire Team +1 in each lift, you could gain experienced doors gunners that can supply well directed fire while the helo enters and exits a hot LZ. Just having a pilot per helo means that the helo loses any defensive and offensive capability the moment the passengers hop out.

I fully understand that flying a transport helo into a known hot LZ is no-one's idea of smart, but how many of you have flown into what appeared to be a quiet and empty LZ right up to the point you flare out and all Hell breaks loose?

**mingmong** · 05-17-2007, 07:24 AM

Having good covering fire from the air means nothing if you can't put force on the ground. And if the squad leader isn't flying then he would be leading the troops on the ground.

**gijoe** · 05-17-2007, 10:09 AM

yesterday me and ebodude had a air squad going. It worked really well. I fly em in, they take the bases i fly em out and its all good. Sl marks a target i go to it. Its not hard to understand. Its like the 101 airborne division except in helis

**Terminal Boy** · 05-17-2007, 10:28 AM

Originally Posted by gijoe

yesterday me and ebodude had a air squad going. It worked really well. I fly em in, they take the bases i fly em out and its all good. Sl marks a target i go to it. Its not hard to understand. Its like the 101 airborne division except in helis

Exactly like the 101st Airborne (Air Assault) since they traded parachutes for helos after Vietnam if memory serves..

**Donagel** · 05-17-2007, 01:17 PM

If there is an active commander, then air trans is the way to go.

Air Cav definately can be used to enable a squad to acheive a series of single goals. With no CO, each SL needs to be looking big picture and attempt to fathom what other SL's are doing (or not doing) towards winning the map.

However, with a CO present, that resource needs to be open to use where ever he/she sees it needed in the big picture. That could still include the deployment of the transport to a particular squad as Air Cav. While there would be communication issues, they would not be so great as to necessitate the pilot being in-squad.

**Fallosophy** · 05-17-2007, 03:59 PM

Yes, but havn't we decided that one squad using a helo just for their squad is not the way to go on our server?

**mingmong** · 05-17-2007, 05:24 PM

That would display a pretty atypical narrowmindedness. Any requests via text for a squad needing transport are noted and dealt with, just like with the dedicated transport squad. It's hardly being selfish, or anything like that.

**Fallosophy** · 05-17-2007, 08:09 PM

oh ya I understand then. If an aircav squad is paying attention to other squads just as much then it seems alright to me.

**Terminal Boy** · 05-18-2007, 04:50 AM

Think of it as a Quick Reaction Force that also fly infil/evac for other squads while the QRF's shooters are on the ground.

**Belhade** · 05-18-2007, 04:13 PM

Alternately, what do people think about having each transport helo fully crewed, i.e. a pilot and 2 guys in Crewman/Combat Engineer kits permanently manning the helo's guns? This way, one Transport squad can crew 2 helos.

The problem with this is the number of seats in the BHawk: 1 pilot, 2 gunners, 4 in the back. With two dedicated gunners, you can't transport a full squad in one load. With a dedicated transport it's better to leave the guns to the squad being transported. Permanent gunners would only be useful in a gunship or Air Cav role.

**SloppyJoe** · 05-18-2007, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by mingmong

- Issues regarding whether the choppers are for anyone's use are clear

??

One of the main reasons I stopped playing PR is that trying to secure the assets was a frustrating if not futile effort and a large waste of time. Tried several approaches from trying to explain to teammates the need and tactical usage of helos, to actually going through the CO to secure helo assets. From my experience, admins won't touch this. If players choose to play E-spam, and many do, have fun. Even with CO-SL organization, I've been told that assets are not something that can be assigned, they are there for the players to enjoy.

Until the staff start protecting organized play around assets such as you are suggesting, you're going to need to get quite lucky in the playground and have players that go along with the air squad + secured asset configuration, or have enough guys in your squad at the pad willing to E-spam to get the helo.

If you want organisation, realism, and a lack of monkey players, hey, check out ArmA.

**mingmong** · 05-18-2007, 04:36 PM

I'm pretty sure an admin said that if a CO gives a clear order regarding kits or vehicles, it has to be followed just like all the other CoC infractions. Case in point being grounding the A10s on Basrah.

**ChernobylKinsman** · 05-18-2007, 05:29 PM

The average pubby doesn't care or even read the rules before joining, as is often painfully evident. Pointing them in the right direction or carefully explaining things can help in some cases.

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