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06-30-2009, 06:51 PM #1
Remember, Remember ...
*takes off the admin-hat and places it aside*
I’m not here to talk to you as an admin today. I’m here to talk to you as a concerned community member.
I have a feeling that we are loosing track on the server. Recently I see a lot of locked squads on the server. Recently I see often that a team is dominating the other. Recently I see quite an unwelcoming attitiude thoughts server visitors. Maybe some of you have noticed that too. Maybe some of you are thinking that something changed. Maybe some of you want to change that?
I know its fun to squad up with your friends. I know its great to play with your fellow IHS-mates. Its fun to see tactics work out. It’s fun to win. It’s great! It’s having a good time. Maybe just for a split of a second you ask yourself: “Is the other team having fun too?” Maybe after the game you say: “Good game!” But was it a good game? Was the game balanced? Fun for all? Was it one of those nailbiting rounds where one team wins by 1-0 or close to it? Rounds we all love so much.
And what do you do if someone on TS says: “Could we try to balance the teams a bit?”. The teams may be even by numbers but not necessarly by skill. Maybe there are 7 or more well known names on one team but none or only very few on the other. Mabye thats the reason why you just rolled the other team by 150 tickets or even more?
Take a moment and think about your first time on TG. You suddenly had to join a squad. You suddenly had to follow orders. You suddenly found a place where people work as a team. Work for theire team and not for themselfs. You found a place where people love teamwork and good sportsmanship. What do you think do visitors think about TG now when they see a lot of locked-squads? What would theire impression of the community be now? Would they come here and be happy to be a part of it? Would they recived trust? Or even - are they affraid of making mistakes? Would they feel a sense of belonging and/or companionship?
Is the game really just the ultimate ticket-game? In a scrim or competative situation very likely. But during a regular round? Maybe it is more! Like teaching newcomers, endorsing teamwork, spreading TG love/fun and that TG welcomes all teamwork-oriented players, no matter what skill or experience-level.
Those are a lot of questions. Those are questions you may want to ask yourself. I can’t answer them for you. But I turst that everyone here knows a good answer to those questions.
The most imporant question is: “Are we playing the TG way?”
Having fun is great. But having a full server having fun is even better.
*puts the soapbox back in its corner and puts the admin-hat back on*"Imagination is more important than knowledge" - Albert Einstein
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06-30-2009, 06:54 PM #2
Re: Remember, Remember ...
Everytime someone says “Could we try to balance the teams a bit?”
Zohar switches over and 8 more people and it´s the opposite case of rape as last round
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06-30-2009, 07:24 PM #3
Re: Remember, Remember ...
Well thats true Lyra and it´s sad that people just switch to play with a special person because they think " oh hey XYZ is at that side! they are gonna win for sure! "
The last time the skill-balance is getting a real problem in my opinion. People are somehow to busy kicking ass than having a look at the scoreboard to check out the teams ( well except of checking their K/D ratio.. )
I also have to agree with big-eye about the ticket-games... is there no room left for newcomers or standard tactics? If you have a team full of new player as SL you can´t work out these fancy tricky moves or can expect that much from your squad as you could with a full TG squad but you still have to work with it.. but it´s no fun running these squads against a full force of expert players who eat you alive. I don´t say " oh please let me cap your flags and frag you so i can have some points , too " I say even up the teams so you can use whatever uber-tactic you want but be sure the other team can stand a chance against it.. or is it that much fun for you to beat up little kids for their lunch-money as well?
I would love to see the server with auto-balance and a auto-shuffle of the teams after each round for a while... because we can´t relay on our mature community to enforce balance in each level anymore.. Just 2 nights ago after the NS scrim... i played for 3 hours and more and couldn´t win a single game.. nothing bad about it, i don´t need to win for fun but if i get raped with end-scores like 200-0 for hours... well there are more fun things to do than that. Our player-count even dropped dramatic and no one cared... At the end ( and after several people already left ) right before Belgrade finally someone responded at TS to the voices asking for balance. But why do we have to ask for that every time? We see the scoreboard at the end anyway.. so just have a look at each side, not just your own. Close games are more fun for every one and if you want to play with your buddies that hard... than just split up and make a competition out of it who is better!
Well i can´t write that much to that topic because it would go way to far... i would use words which are similar to sunlight for vampires...
I really wish we can get back to the way where where when i once joined.
Edit : i found something i wrote about that topic from our IHS forum.
It´s about what i think about dominating the other team
It´s a bit about why i don´t have fun dominating TG member.. because we are still a public server. We can use those humiliating tactics at scrims where really everything is about winning!Do you guys remember that day when the E-1st ( i remember Big-eye Silver rasta i think and myself ) went to the server and every one of us started a squad and we used the SL-SL communication-channels? The teams where even by players and skill but we owned them a few rounds in a row.. and instead of keeping it that way we stopped! sure it was fun seeing tactics work. sure it was fun working with my friends together, sure it was damn fun winning and having a laugh at the end about how much we rocked but jesus we stopped! Not because it was unfair.. the enemy team could have sued that option , too... but they didn´t and we are fair gamers! THATS WHY WE STOPPED! because we care about the fun of the opposite team... our enemy, the guys who killed our family, our dog, our dogs family and everyone we once knew.. but they are still TG.. we are still a family and we should act like that and thread our self the way we deserve it.
Maybe we should run more scrims to give those who more care about winning or just winning is fun i don´t know. So we can give everyone what they need to have fun here at TGLast edited by black_Mirror; 06-30-2009 at 07:33 PM. Reason: adding a quote
His capacity for love lost, the man accepts it into his glas of dispair. The Flames of burning anger unquenched, the man keeps drinking... but never gets drunk

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06-30-2009, 07:28 PM #4
Re: Remember, Remember ...
We are not perfect by any means, and everyone needs an attitude adjustment every once and a while. It is extremely difficult to strike a balance. I still believe that the TG community is capable to self regulate balance and I ask that auto-balance not be turned on. If anything, if an issue of extreme team imbalance were to happen, no one would be able to switch teams to balance.
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06-30-2009, 07:33 PM #5
Re: Remember, Remember ...
A quote from the past...
You want to be with your friends and the other team is lacking skill and loosing rounds after rounds with 200+ 0 score?
No problem.
You and your friends can switch teams and go help your fellow members.
Now go help your fellow members!
TG is all about tactics and teamwork and focus on the objective.
The overall objective is to win, but there are more elements on the equation.
Community camarderie, learning, communication and FUN.
And please do not say: "Get better, try harder!"Proud former member of TG-E1st
Active Games: BF2142 BF2 BC2 PR LFD2 POE
New to TG? - TG Primer - TG University - TeamSpeak
Report Infractions - Contact a game Admin - Submit a nomination for an award

"All wars are fought for money" (Socrates, 470-399 BC)
"Only the dead have seen the end of the war" (Plato, 427-347 BC)
"We make war that we may live in peace" (Aristotle, 384-322 BC)
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06-30-2009, 09:16 PM #6
Re: Remember, Remember ...
Ahhh the balancing issues...I brought this up once...glad to see an admin taking a good hard look...well....I move over whenever I can!


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06-30-2009, 09:27 PM #7
Re: Remember, Remember ...
The fifth of November?
Anyway, getting even teams is always a careful (wait for it) balancing act. I'm in agreement that too many locked squads lead to newer or non-IHS members getting left out (I for better or worse don't fall in this category because many people still know me pretty well and I've been in IHS before).
But it ALSO serves to decrease the amount of preparation before a map starts. Why is this? Because a locked squad creates hope. In general, TG tagged members will wait for a TG player to start a squad or at least wait for a critical mass of other TGers to join someone else's squad.
In an unlocked squad, this is fine. The first 5 players who were quick on the draw join. Then the rest know they need to form another squad. However, when locked squads exist, they extend this period where people don't know if they're going to get into that squad. As a result, the final squad or two of TGers often gets formed mere moments before launch.
However, it's important to realize that in order for IHS to have real meaning on the server, they will play together, and that's a good thing.
As for team balance, we walk a fine line. I suggest patience before calling unbalanced teams balance. This is ESPECIALLY the case now that the server only plays one round a map.
Because let's be clear: we should be encouraging players to go for the throat while they're playing. Their goal, once the round starts, should be complete annihilation. Otherwise it's YMCA baseball where everyone wins, so no one does. I hate that when it's 175-0, people get called team stackers... somehow cheapening a dominating performance.
All that said, I think the main gist is correct: individual players should take it upon themselves to (a) involve more members of the community and (b) even the teams in terms of skill between rounds.
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06-30-2009, 09:35 PM #8
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06-30-2009, 10:15 PM #9
Re: Remember, Remember ...
A disablement of autobalance may help with the problem of team stacking, as if I recall correctly, it is still on.
He was told that he should not kill, and he did not kill, until he got into the Army. Then he was told to kill, and he killed.


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06-30-2009, 10:17 PM #10
Re: Remember, Remember ...
Great post big-eye, and also great post Zoraster!
No-one likes getting pummeled into the ground by the opposing team, I mean lets face it when half your game-time is spent staring at "you have been critically wounded" you do lose some of the will to play. However at this point you are faced with the choice, you can either give up and quit, or you can stick to it and give it your best anyway. That is where your true character is going to come out.
I have been on the receiving end of several of these types of rounds lately. I believe it was yesterday that I hopped on and decided to squad lead for a couple of rounds early on in the day. The first round I got in was Tunis and we got destroyed, the game ended we had no flags and tickets were something like 150-0. My squad had a -K/D ratio and moral of the team overall was very low. The next map came up and it was Shingle, I squad leaded again and we began the round with determination giving it everything we had. We still ended up losing that match but the ticket count was much closer and my squad worked excellently together, taking flag after flag (which were generally promptly recapped
) but overall it was a much better round and my squad knew we had done our part and were very happy with how it went.
For me, when I am on the losing side of what seemed to be a one sided fight I look at the next round as another chance to step up, work better as a team, and kick some butt! This stops the negative thought pattern of "man, these teams are so uneven, we don't even have a chance". If you are convinced you are going to lose from the beginning of the round then you are going to lose, but if you step up to the challenge and give it all you have, who knows? You might win, you might not, but at the very least you will have a much more fun round then if you are continually complaining on how one-sided the teams were.
I'm not saying that when one team is getting smashed over and over again that there shouldn't be some balancing done, but like it was said before do not overcompensate for it, this just creates the same problem over again just with opposite teams.
Just my thoughts
Proud to have been an Irregular!






|TG| S.Kyle23
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06-30-2009, 10:44 PM #11
Re: Remember, Remember ...
This, on the surface, seems quite reasonable. If such a scenario happens for a round or two, it would indicate that the winning side used better tactics and managed to catch team B with their pants down. If it happens 5 rounds in a row, it starts to show that perhaps team A has a significant advantage over Team B in terms of skill and experience. Is this bad? Well, no, not necessarily, it really does depend on what you want to achieve as a player.
If the objective is to win above all else then Team A has it right. However, if the objective is to show that you are a public server that wants to encourage new people to join and to demonstrate mature, respectful, and fair teamplay then no, Team A is just flexing their muscles and showing Team B how amazingly good they are. Will it impress Team B? Possibly. Will it make them want to join the community and learn from them? Probably not, they most likely have better things to do than get stomped on as a learning process. And bare this in mind - they are getting stomped on in spite of doing the best they can with the skill level they have. So the question you have to ask yourself is this - what do you want TG to stand for? If you are a TG tagged member and especially if you represent an in-house-squad, it's an important thing to keep in mind whenever you put those tags on and play on our servers.



TG-E1st TacticalGamer European Division - Staying healthy with two portions of AWESOME CAKE per day.
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06-30-2009, 10:53 PM #12
Re: Remember, Remember ...
ugh...here we go again...
I got yer Dancing With the F**&ing Stars right here!!
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06-30-2009, 10:57 PM #13
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06-30-2009, 10:57 PM #14
Re: Remember, Remember ...
The number of times such domination actually occurs 5 times in a row is far fewer than the number of times people argue teams are unbalanced. That's not to say it doesn't happen, but in my experience, it's pretty rare.
My argument is that once the round starts, Team A's goal should be to ruthlessly pursue victory (within the bounds of TG's rules and primer, obviously). Before the round starts, it's perfectly fine to do things like decide to join the team that lost the last round badly. In fact, I encourage it, and I think more of players who actively seek to do this.
Perhaps we're misunderstanding each other though. I said "once the round starts." I have a hard time believing you object to that or suggest that Team A should "go easy" on Team B in the middle of a round.
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06-30-2009, 11:04 PM #15
Re: Remember, Remember ...
the final quote that WhiskeySix used to close this discussion last time was:
"OK so to summarize:
switching teams for win = bad
switching teams to even player counts = ok
evening the playing field if other team is bugged - good
good then "
__________________I got yer Dancing With the F**&ing Stars right here!!
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