Community Poll: Second Server with Strongly-enforced Teamwork

**Zhohar** · 07-02-2009, 01:25 AM

The main server remains as-is -- enjoy quality TG gameplay and get the benefit of the admins who administer it.

Second server is ranked, but with a much more strict set of rules. Its core audience is experienced players looking for team-based challenges.

The aim is to please the very competitive segment of TG, and allow them to take teamwork to the very next level. There would be active encouragement of players scrutinizing team-mates and asking them to change their playstyle, actions, and tactics if they are being detrimental to the team.

Would you want to play on this server?

MrJengles · 07-02-2009, 02:29 AM

Ok, so...a lot more constructive criticism going on. But more strict rules? Ha thought TG already was strict XD lol. Not sure what you meant by that Zho. Other than that, certainly a good idea. Although if it's for experienced players would it be passworded or do we kick new people left, right and centre? No warnings? Otherwise it's like the other server...

**Zoraster** · 07-02-2009, 02:38 AM

I do not like this idea. I think no matter how you approach it, people will gravitate toward one server or the other. If the second becomes very popular at a critical mass, the first will die. If it doesn't, the second will still be dead. This is, generally speaking, why it's nearly impossible to maintain two active servers for very long. If at all hours we had many more SMs than spots available, then it might work. Otherwise, it will remain a location for special events or backup.

Additionally, more monitoring comes with a lot of hardship. I assume you want most of the pressure for competitive teamwork to come from the player level and not the admin, but it still is tough to enforce what is often subjective.

Most importantly, it also serves to further fracture the community. As those who have been in IHS, etc. with me know, I lean pretty far toward competitive gaming. But TG does so well because it has a diverse community. This has its own problems, but I prefer those problems to trying to split the "just have fun-ers" and the "I want to win-ers"

I do think we should already encourage people to scrutinize teammates. Sometimes when this happens, it's as a result of some failure on the teammate and it's said in a less than respectful manner. But if you don't make things personal, many people (though not all) will take heart.

But no. I do not think this is an idea that would (a) work or (b) be good for the TG community as a whole.

**PM07SNV** · 07-02-2009, 04:59 AM

The only way to fill the 2nd server up, is to run a scheduled scrim on it.. I can't see both servers naturally populating, but I wish it was so!

**Zhohar** · 07-02-2009, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoraster

Most importantly, it also serves to further fracture the community. As those who have been in IHS, etc. with me know, I lean pretty far toward competitive gaming. But TG does so well because it has a diverse community. This has its own problems, but I prefer those problems to trying to split the "just have fun-ers" and the "I want to win-ers"

You are right.

However, the current status quo is generating a lot of frustration among the very experienced and competitive players.

I suppose, it always has. I don't see a solution to it, but when that frustration reaches critical mass ... unfortunate things happen. The lesson, most likely, is patience and tolerance.

**black_Mirror** · 07-02-2009, 07:10 AM

I am with you there Zho. I think it´s a good idea ( even through it will be hard as usual to seed that server ) but what are we losing while trying it out? As posted out already i said things like " we are a family... lets act as one " i can´t lean or just support one side of that TG community. Remember guys we all have different things we enjoy while playing and we can´t just say " no i don´t like what you guys are doing ! " but can´t help them out if they need some help. The competitive and very experienced players are TG as well and if they are willing to let the " just wanna have fun " player their space to well yeah just have fun we should in exchange go and help them out on their own project now!
If you need any kinda help let me know Zho.

**Lyramion** · 07-02-2009, 07:14 AM

Yes you should let your first baby die and make another instead of trying to cure the first

**black_Mirror** · 07-02-2009, 07:18 AM

I see it more like some kinda Siamese twins Mr. Lyra. You try in a risky surgery to save both of them instead of killing one part.
If we can make this "Chilly" and "Killy" the two twins can life their own life. They can meet each other and play together if they want to but from now on they are not longer forced to share everything.

HenkeTheMonkey · 07-02-2009, 07:27 AM

Good idea..
I think it would worth a try anyway..

Think about this..

As a commander, all your your SLs are following your orders.
and as an SL, all your SMs are following order.
(of course you got these 'idiotic' orders, but then it'll open up a dialog)

I don't say this don't happen on our regular server..
but on this new server with more strongly enforced rules.. it would be a must..

As described above, there will always be these 'problems' with populating and seeding the server.

But if we don't try.. we'll never know.

// Henke

SharinganTH1422 · 07-02-2009, 08:56 AM

Don't mean to offend anyone, but this is a terrible idea.

If this were to occur, we would see many more TGers on the Second Server, so where would that leave the first? I can see all of the pubbies on it with a small smattering of TGers, and it's already difficult to keep up the high standard of play in the server with loads of quality TGers on. All I see happening is a shift over to the Second Server, because believe it or not those who join TG and are labeled as TGers who just want to have fun also enjoy teamwork. They wouldn't be TG if they didn't, and I doubt they would happily sit in a server with worse teamwork than another TG server which is just a few mouse clicks away. I know I would never even think about the First Server again if I knew the Second Server had superior teamwork and real-time criticisms, even if it did mean I'd have to get barked at by the SL for missing a revive.

I personally don't know where I stand. I like to win while having fun, and I have fun when I'm winning, but that's the same with every TGer (I think), so these 2 groups that have apparently materialised at TG aren't as clear cut as it seems to be made out. We need to get it out of our heads that we are all very different, when in fact our aims are mostly the same - Striving for good gameplay while having an enjoyable time with awesome people.

As an alternative I suggest we make your proposal for the Second Server into the policy of the First Server. BF2142 has been out for almost 3 years, and I think we can now start saying "people know what our server is about, if they don't follow the rules, then they can find somewhere else to play." Almost 3 years we've been pub friendly and recruiting new blood, and maybe it's time to start being a little more selfish with our main server and having a steeper learning curve for the new guys. I'm not saying PW the server, stop Learn TG squads and kick anyone that doesn't use VoIP, but maybe we need to tolerate a little less and push boundaries a little more. We'll still be able to get new TGers, it's just they'll be stepping into a harder teamwork environment, but wouldn't that just further invite those interested in teamwork?

This has turned into a silly, long-winded post with me just spewing out my random thoughts, but I hope you can appreciate where I'm coming from. Although I firmly disagree with this solution, I think we can all see that there is a problem which needs to be tackled. It's good that we're coming out with ideas, and I just hope it continues and leads to something that will improve TG.

**LogicalHarm** · 07-02-2009, 09:49 AM

Zho: How likely is it, do you think, that this will fracture the community?

There should be an option in the poll of 'I don't know'.

SilentSunshine · 07-02-2009, 11:23 AM

Would a trial run of this "terrible idea" have any negative effect on the main server in the long term? I think not. I'd like to see it given a go.

**WhiskeySix** · 07-02-2009, 11:30 AM

I'd like to see TG have an UNRANKED server - where we can tweak it to be more to our liking - change ticket counts, vehicle counts, spawn times, unlocks available, even CP count and location.

**Zoraster** · 07-02-2009, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zhohar

You are right.

However, the current status quo is generating a lot of frustration among the very experienced and competitive players.

I suppose, it always has. I don't see a solution to it, but when that frustration reaches critical mass ... unfortunate things happen. The lesson, most likely, is patience and tolerance.

It has absolutely always happened. TG-7th probably stopped playing TG due to this very thing... first, many in the 7th had little time or patience for educating new players how to play. second, it was silly how easy the server had become compared to the "professional" TGL.*

In any case, I think the idea that you can make a server, say it's L337 players only, and it'll happen is wishful thinking. Let's say that this plan works and half the TG players stay at Server 1 and half go to Server 2.** The rest have to be filled in by public players. What do you actually achieve? Lots of public players in both servers, watering it down further. You can try and institute "rules" that people have to be good or something. But you haven't laid out a method for actually enforcing these rules on public players.

Don't get me wrong. I sympathize with you. But this is not the solution you or anyone else is looking for.

*I say professional with more than a hint of irony. I think the top prize was $1500.
** Though I'll reiterate that this will not happen.

HenkeTheMonkey · 07-02-2009, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhiskeySix

I'd like to see TG have an UNRANKED server - where we can tweak it to be more to our liking - change ticket counts, vehicle counts, spawn times, unlocks available, even CP count and location.

Hey.. that's not an half bad idea...