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Discussion: Battlefield 2142 / Battlefield 2142 - General Discussion - Mines and FF - Thanks for the info. It's nice to know motion mines don't hurt friendlies.
Maybe the
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11-15-2006, 12:28 PM #16
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Re: Mines and FF
Thanks for the info. It's nice to know motion mines don't hurt friendlies.
Maybe the mines being off wasn't an oversight. It has never been on since the server came online. Maybe we should verify that the 'master' admin did make an oversight or if he intended it to be off.Telorn
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11-15-2006, 12:38 PM #17
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Re: Mines and FF
In my opinion, even when the HUD is fixed, FF fire should still remain off. From playing alot of BF 2 and Poe, players, including many TGer's, do not pay attention to the mines.
The sentry guns do not have FF (though you can be hit if your between a gun and enemy) so why should the mines?
And to reiterate Telron's point, mines 136 years in the future should be able to recognize friend from foe.|TG-9th| TheFatKidDeath
"Born to Party, Forced to Work."
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11-15-2006, 12:40 PM #18
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Re: Mines and FF
Ha! I hadn't thought of that, but you're right.
Originally Posted by jepzilla
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I would think that there's no way to get FF on for mines working on a ranked server. Maybe when/if we set up an unranked server FF on for mines would work. It works well enough in BF2, as we know.
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@FKD:
1) FF on for sentry guns would be a nightmare even if it made sense game-story-wise. But you already know that
2) And why can't tanks 136 years into the future have technologies that deactivate mines as they approach them? There's an argument and counterargument for everything.2142: |TG-Irr| Silverfish
BF2: |TG-Irr| Maus
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11-15-2006, 01:12 PM #19
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Re: Mines and FF
Originally Posted by Telorn
If there is a reason that FF for mines was left off when the server was configured, then it will be turned off again. Otherwise I would plan for this setting to remain for the time being.
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11-15-2006, 01:13 PM #20
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Re: Mines and FF
M, I'd agree with you on both and we can only speculate on weapons of the future. I suppose my main point (trying not to beat this horse) is: Originally Posted by Maus
Ha! I hadn't thought of that, but you're right.
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I would think that there's no way to get FF on for mines working on a ranked server. Maybe when/if we set up an unranked server FF on for mines would work. It works well enough in BF2, as we know.
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@FKD:
1) FF on for sentry guns would be a nightmare even if it made sense game-story-wise. But you already know that
2) And why can't tanks 136 years into the future have technologies that deactivate mines as they approach them? There's an argument and counterargument for everything.
FF on mines causes more problems than they are worth and from my experience and generally speaking, players of all levels do not pay attention to the mine in front of them. It seems to me the best of the bad options is to leave FF off. I think this is much more the case on our ranked public server.
As it stands, I can live with the EMP and APM's being FF. You can't be punished for an EMP, and APM's mines, I don't use and I'm always cautious around mines in general. It's nice to see the motion mines are not FF as they are perhaps the most deadly of the bunch.
It's not a make or break issue for me but my vote is for the FF being off.|TG-9th| TheFatKidDeath
"Born to Party, Forced to Work."
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11-15-2006, 01:16 PM #21
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Re: Mines and FF
Except if the mines of the future were disarmed by being in proximity to an enemy tank there wouldn't be any mines of the future, just like the horse cavalry of the present Originally Posted by Maus
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11-15-2006, 01:16 PM #22
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Re: Mines and FF
Guys, this is Tactical Gamer, not Arcade Gamer. Get used to FF on on all of our servers. We are not going to dumb-down our settings to make it easier for everyone, including pubbies. If there are problem players on the server, report them so we can remove them and get on to other things.
-- Suits are what you wear when doing things you shouldn’t want to do anyway.
FROM THE TACTICAL GAMER PRIMER.
3) Support game play in a near-simulation environment. Where the focus of play would not be solely on doing what it takes to win, but doing so utilizing real-world combat strategy and tactics rather than leveraging exploits provided to players by the design of the game engine.
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11-15-2006, 01:29 PM #23
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Re: Mines and FF
Before "realistic", and I use this term losely because what really is realisitc in the future, tactical gaming, this is a community for its gamers, correct?
Maybe we should vote if FF (On mines ONLY) should be off until DICE fixes the friendly identification HUD. You have to admit it is badly broken.
Personally, I don't really care from the stand point of the one being punished for TKs, since I only really lay down motion mines. But coming from the end of constantly being blown up by friendly mines because my HUD doesn't tell me friendly mines are in the area most of the time, I would vote for it to be off
Telorn
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11-15-2006, 01:36 PM #24
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Re: Mines and FF
But, but ...
But how is it better for the server to essentially blacklist explosive mine use for those who are aware they're going to hurt friendlies? The score loss for team kills and team damage is outrageous. I'm pretty happy with my rank and don't care so much about points any more (but I still care some - there are still useful unlocks outside my main kits), but there will be many people put off the TG server by the FF mines, because like it or not ranked 2142 is all about points.
If I'm going to get (to pick a moderately extreme example) -12 when a packed transporter drives out from the CP I laid mines to defend I might as well not bother, since I'm a bit poop and my average score per round is probably under 20.
It's odd -- I normally agree with pretty much everything the admins do for the servers, but I really can't see this working well. Maybe I'll be proved wrong.
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Complete aside, that my "moderately extreme" example reminded me of:
In my DoD days, long ago, I once got auto-kicked and banned from a server for trying to organize a rush on a crucial flag with the whole team. I was going to hurl a nade in ahead of us, to soften things up a little, but got shot and dropped it right in the middle of my group, killing all seven of them. I never even saw the death messages. ^^
edit: okay, a little too much caffeine this morning, I see, but it's still a good story.2142: |TG-Irr| Silverfish
BF2: |TG-Irr| Maus
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11-15-2006, 01:41 PM #25
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Re: Mines and FF
No one is suggesting we dumb down the game for the sake of an arcade feel. Players have started a thread with their concerns so we can play the game more effectively while minimizing the time spent reporting bad behavior. I think this is a valid issue that needs to be debated. Originally Posted by Tempus
|TG-9th| TheFatKidDeath
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http://www.theonion.com/content/node/55640 - Check me out on The Onion
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11-15-2006, 01:43 PM #26
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Re: Mines and FF
It's no different from claymores in BF2: don't place mines in high-traffic areas, and don't leave your mines untended. You can pick up your own mines by pressing G, so don't leave them lying around, or pick them up if you see a lot of blue dots headed your way. Also, the teamkill issue only impacts Anti-Personel Mines. EMP mines temporarily disable vehicles and motion mines don't attack friendlies. Originally Posted by Maus
Seriously, APMs and claymores are defensive weapons to protect a sniper's flank while he's concentrating downfield. Assaulting a Titan is hard enough without a bunch of defenders spamming APMs everywhere.
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11-15-2006, 01:45 PM #27
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Re: Mines and FF
Apart from the ranked issue, which makes the point loss from teamkills a big issue. Originally Posted by jepzilla
I specified explosive mines to get around that realization Originally Posted by jepzilla
Didn't know the motion mines would only attack friendlies. Why is that? Is it wrong to have some inconsistency in the behavior of anti-personnel and anti-vehicle mines?
edit: I hope this doesn't sound overly confrontational - I'm genuinely curious, while also being opposed to FF on for now.Last edited by Maus; 11-15-2006 at 02:01 PM.
2142: |TG-Irr| Silverfish
BF2: |TG-Irr| Maus
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11-15-2006, 02:08 PM #28
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Re: Mines and FF
Well, that's one you'll have to take up with DICE. I presume the justification is that motion mines are smart enough to identify friendly vehicles. There's very little in 2142 that's actually that futuristic; pretend the game is called Battlefield 2042 and think about the weapons and technology in the game in those terms. Originally Posted by Maus
Apart from the ranked issue, which makes the point loss from teamkills a big issue.
I specified explosive mines to get around that realization Didn't know the motion mines would only attack friendlies. Why is that? Is it wrong to have some inconsistency in the behavior of anti-personnel and anti-vehicle mines?
edit: I hope this doesn't sound overly confrontational - I'm genuinely curious, while also being opposed to FF on for now.
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11-15-2006, 02:15 PM #29
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Re: Mines and FF
It is a little different because Claymores are impassable. APMs can be defused, shelled, shot, and circumvented by crawling over them. I don't see how FF is going to stop people from spamming APMs on the Titan because it's easy to get behind the defenders and follow them up the path they've already cleared the mines of. Originally Posted by jepzilla
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11-15-2006, 02:53 PM #30
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Re: Mines and FF
Originally Posted by Zoopy_T
I agree. It's 2142 so mines that can follow a vehicle should be smart enough to avoid friendlies. Originally Posted by TheFatKidDeath
I was punished 3 times in rapid succession last night so I'm not even planning on using them if FF is on.
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