Uranium - 235

You've got it, mostly.

The thing is, in the middle of a fight, an Assault reviving a teammate is likely going to have a more profound impact than him simply continuing the fight. Therefore it's easier to say it's far more important to have them go for the revive. Barring extremely exception circumstances, the Support going to go throw ammo is going to have a profoundly NEGATIVE impact on the fight in your favor, as it's a significant time investment and loss of firepower.

Being "ammo bitch" is rather low on the priority list, behind EMPing vehicles.

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Revolusinov

you can emp a vehicle with emp.... but if you want to emp lock it indefinatly.... you kind of need that ammo box. As matter of fact, I'm pretty sure theirs enough time to drop an ammo box between emp grenades in most cases. Yes I'd prefer to emp the apc bombarding me with uber hax bombs, but I would like ammo too and you DO have time for that MOST of the time.

But yeah regarding the baur, unless your like to snipe with it, you can burn through all 6 clips within a minute. I full auto targets with the baur and in total I only have 120 bullets, and thats like 1 mg clip. And rocket spam. Takes a few seconds to burn through those. Grenades are great to spam on attempted capure flags or to toss on any dead body to prevent revive, so i burn through those quickly as well (when i remember i have granades, i tend to forget). I don't always shoot with an intent to kill. I shoot to suppress an area to prevent revives as well, which equals lots burnt ammo.

I understand the point your making is you have other things to do then cater to other people with ammo boxes, but you post basically sounds like trying to make it out like support is too good to bother wasting time to drop ammo boxes for measly other classes.

I don't think anyone would argue if you laying covering fire or shooting at people to drop boxes but the fact is most people including assault spend less than 10% of the round actually pulling the trigger finger. The problem I have so many times is people, no matter what, if they are staring at a wall or picking thier nose, if you approach them and jump up and down if front of them screaming ammo over voip, text, comma rose, in real life to the guy sitting in the LAN chair next to you, they still don't drop you ammo most of the time. There are a few good players out there that will fart it out their ass just for telepathecally thinking it, but the overwhemling majority of support players completly neglect their ammo box. It would be easier, safer, more effieciant, and faster to kill the support unit then drop his ammo box and swith kits and revive then to ask for ammo. Its not that hard, as soon as you reach the front line of any fight or the position or if you plan to hang back, you drop an ammo box. Assualt does this all day with med boxes. Right before they approach an enemy you can usually count on several boxes hitting the ground. To say there is not time to drop an ammo box in a fire fight is ok. But thats not the problem and thats such an insignificantly small percentage of the gameplay that it's a pointless statement. We should be encouring when and where to drop boxes, not making remarks that discourage the use of support boxes.

And to claim that support is primarily focussed on killing more than assualt because they are deadlier. I disagree. Voss/rocket and Baur/Rockets obliterate support IMO in terms of deadliness. Support has it's time and places where its deadlier than assualt, but in general, not the case. Perhaps someone with experience can describe where assualt shines. But to say, support teh roxor, all other kits the nubxor, my gun goes pew pew faster than yours doesn't help. When and why is is better?

sidenote: don't forget the fastest way to get ammo is actually just stealing an enemies kit. If your assualt, most people are assualt, and most kits lying around are usually assault. If not, o well, it still shoots.

Gang>Baur at mid range. Well yeah, baur is close and long range only IMO and I'm getting off topic.


"If Support isn't the best anti-infantry class, what do you consider *IS*?"
Assault. It's the primary reason in game balance they have no anti armor capabilities.

Zhohar

The mistake is not in the priorities themselves, but in making a pre-determined list of priorities. The way you word it Uranium, you make it seem that the support's over-reaching focus, the primary goal in any situation, should be lethality.

Now whether that was your intent or not, that's how it came off to a lot of people here. I tried to show you another aspect of the support -- supplies -- but you narrowly continued with the lethality business.

That just doesn't reflect the reality of the battlefield. A support has about 20 different priorities during any given minute and placing sole focus on lethality deprives the squad and the team of a lot of useful abilities, one of them being supplies.

Case in point: EMPing a vehicle should be a support's first priority when faced with a walker that's supressing the squad -- not shooting a hail of bullets at infantry around the walker, hoping a magical engineer will appear out of nowhere.

Situational awareness and responding to the situation is the key here -- not a pre-written list of priorities. Knowing the situation and responding to it in the best possible manner with the kit you're carrying should be the first priority of any player -- not "lethality", "revives", or "supplies" or any other pre-determined priority.

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MDFubar

Just a note, it takes less than 2 seconds to drop a supply crate and tell the SM's it is there. Medics do the same things, drop a medic pack so people can regain health at a certain spot.

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"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
- General George Patton Jr

sights

I'd say recon. Because he can deny an area fairly good + has the best range of all the classes.Yeah rockets are fine and dandy, yep the Ganz IS awesome (sorry E1st), but at the end of the day it's the headshot that puts that guy at long range behind cover out of commission the fastest...
But I won't turn this into a " Which class is best " post...

IMO:

Support should provide ammo often enough, not always, but often. That's why SUPPORT has the ammo hub.
Assault should provide health and revives more often than support has to lay down ammo hubs.
Recon should provide intel ALWAYS, and hold areas for a LONG period of time, but it can't do it WITHOUT ammo and health - hence the hubs were made, so the good providers of ammo/hp DON'T have to stand next to me always. Just drop it , and go do what you do very well - kill.
Engineer is our savior against everything mechanical ... We praise him for that

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It is art when you kill one person... and terrorize a hundred.

Razcsak

I don't think that anyone is saying that you should drop a box while you've got someone in your sights. Dropping just after a firefight, however, should be very high on your list of priorities. Dropping just before a firefight is also likewise high on your list of priorities.

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Uranium - 235

I've never got this 'Recon = intel' thing. It's not like they can see through walls.

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sights

Nope , we can't thats the job of NetBat recon helmets ... I saw that most people aren't sure what it does. It says : " Increases duration " and most people say " And... That's it? "

Yep. But it can be valuable 80% of the time. You chase your target, he runs around the corner, you see EXACTLY where he is (thanks to the longer duration) ...
Or if you are sniping, and your target goes behind cover, you can see him longer, so when he pops up again, you will be waiting.

And in case you forgot, recon has the 4x zoom, so yeah, I can see pretty far for intel purposes... (Sometimes when I spot a vehicle at looong range, it just says " We got company"= it's THAT far ) ...
Glad I could help

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It is art when you kill one person... and terrorize a hundred.

Lorax74

Reminder: This thread is about the support kit, not the recon kit.

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TG-9th Lorax74

sights

Well he DID ask

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It is art when you kill one person... and terrorize a hundred.

Thesleeper01

Personally for me and what I have seen I rarely see the EMP grenade be effective enough to warrant it being brought along always. I have seen a few EMP locks that killed the armor but for the most part there’s not more than 1-2 EMP locks per map and often not even that many most times 1-2 EMP’s gets thrown and then the EMPer is dead or the armor escapes. I usually find that an IDS for intel and a sentry gun for suppression is the best combo It can be used as a slow down device or as a warning because either it is shooting or it explodes, either lets you know the enemy is near and does not give away your location. An often over looked weapon is the support glow balls they give an advantage when attacking a flag that has explosives on it or a corridor that is prepped with RDX. Not the best weapon but it has it’s utility.

I would like to know the people that use an EMP grenade every time they use support, how often do you get an EMP lock that results in the vehicle being destroyed when it would not have been other wise?

Also the support really has 2 unique tasks that no other kit takes care of, intel (IDS) and resupply.

MDFubar

Emp locking a something like a walker also saves lives, which is very important. Not every support should carry it in a squad, hopefully if there is more than one support they are carrying different load-outs. It would also depend on you squad's objective.

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"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
- General George Patton Jr

sights

/Disagree

Resupply sure, I just love that extra ammo.
Intel, nah, all classes can do that. IDS is IMO some kind of area-denial tool, it is only useful where you put it (duh) , while on the other hand, if you bring a DysTek scanner, it can ALWAYS be used, it sees height (like on which floor is the enemy) and sees beacons.
Every class has intel options:
recon - big zoom + APM (when it is blown, you know where the enemy is)
support - IDS, DysTek
engineer - PDS
assault - radar grenade...

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It is art when you kill one person... and terrorize a hundred.

Thesleeper01

You can put an IDS anywhere’s you use a DysTek scanner but I think that the advantages of the IDS well out weight the scanner, where most pack it I would think most agree with that. AMP's don't not tell you infantry is there it tells you infantry was there and it does not let all squads know where there is, sure you can tell your SL and then he can tell the COM so the COM can then tell all SL but that’s a long process. Plus they may just crouch past it, no crouching past an IDS. Zoom does not show you the guy hiding behind the wall or cloaking etc plus you can provide the same intel with from an IDS while up agound your squad if your a support instead of a sniper and also have the ability to resupply and get on flaggs. PDS only detects armor not infantry. Radar grenade well you got me here they do detect the enemy infantry but they are very limited, its not practical to detect for the enemy constantly with them like constant detection at the front line when the UAV goes down.

Only support can provide that level of information about infantry movements.

Miråge

Right, I'm new,(to BF2142 as well) and I doubt I'll ever be Support, but I'd like to know how the packs you drop work,
do you walk over it and you get full ammo/health or do you hold a button over it?
and also does it work a certain amount of times?
what about for your enemy does it work for them?
does it only work once?

I think simple questions for someone that plays.

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