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01-07-2009, 03:02 AM #1
Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Ever see a friendly squad do things that really rubbed you the wrong way? Post it in detail here.
Don't use names if you don't need to -- humiliation is not the object. The point is to learn what not to do. Things you yourself may consider absolutely brilliant could be absolute trash to someone else. If nothing, this thread ought to let you get a different perspective.
The object is to be better, pride be damned.
So, spill it out. Bonus points go out to people who explain why the friendly squad's action was improper in terms of the map situation, not the local situation.
Points are taken away for common failings such as "I spawned at Harbor but the other squad didn't cover Toll Station" or "This whole squad of medics just ran by me."Fight!
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01-07-2009, 03:59 AM #2
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Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Every time EU is holed up at Camp Gib's Toll Station and someone is trying to push out the west gate low. There is possibly a reason for trying to force a breakout (though they are rare) but if you're going to do it, the place is not the most rocketed, grenaded, walkered, orbitaled, shot, EMP'd, and sentried corner ever to grace 2142.
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01-07-2009, 04:08 AM #3
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
I've always noticed a problem with "end-game" tactics when people play maps like camp or cerebere or even Fall of Berlin. In maps like these....it's sometimes very hard to gauge if a squad's actions are helping the team or actually hurting the ticket deficit when ticket bleed is off and it's just a matter of fighting.
First, let me define "end-game" This is the moment in the game when an additional flag capture becomes impossible and neither team is able to capture such a flag without an enormous inter-squad assault. In Camp, it's usually when the EU retreats into Ruins and holds out. In Cerebere, it's when the EU retreats into Command Center. In Fall of Berlin, it becomes Outpost.
What happens is that a team (either one) throws itself unnecessarily into the fray only to lose lives trying to capture their respective flags. HOWEVER, I have also seen this win games as well!
Just today (I had 6 squad members [PAC] in Cerebere assaulting Command Center), I would think that some of the squads would have hated my squad since I threw my squad continuously into Command Center hoping to serve as a distraction while trying to capture the flag. If I were the commander of the PAC team and somebody else was SLing, I would have thrown a fit and told everyone to fall back and set up safe defensive positions. I would not have tolerated the ridiculous efforts of a single squad throwing themselves behind enemy lines. Oh btw: we did win by a margin of 2-0. <--that kinda of a score says that I got lucky and we could have lost due to my recklessness.
The problem in the end is that every battle is different and there is no way of telling how to proceed since every team has its own strengths and weaknesses. From game to game, these strengths and weaknesses change dramatically and adaptation can be tough.
Here are a few guidelines that work almost always....
1. If there are two remaining enemy flags left, try to take the one further away.
Tactically speaking, 50%-85% of the enemy is still concentrated on the flag closest to you. By successfully taking the one further away from you, you will have a tactically better flanking maneuver from two sides squeezing the enemy into a dead end.
2. If your team is winning by a significant amount 20-30 tickets and only one enemy flag remains keep putting pressure on the flag and do not relent. A single flag makes a great comeback and that ability to completely cap the enemy diminishes once a squad slips through your offensive line.
3. If your team is within 10 points or less (especially negative) hold back and start spawning assault kits.
In the end, I know why some squads push themselves into impossible situations. Heck it's only a game, and winning is not always the most important objective at times. Sometimes you just want to run behind enemy lines and feel the adrenaline pumping through your veins.
Let's be honest everyone, would you rather safely lob grenades over a hill/wall reviving teammates left and right or would you rather cloak behind enemy lines and cause all sorts of mayhem with the entire enemy team yelling "Hey! Somebody got through!".

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01-07-2009, 08:09 AM #4
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Other than what's stated above, which are excellent posts, my pet peeves for friendly squads would also include squads that waste vehicle assets, for instance, say a 2-3 man squad grabbing a jeep at the very beginning of Camp G...it's hard enough to actually break through, at least have the manpower to do something about it if you do. Another example is at the beginning of Carebear and taking the jeep and just driving it to office or into the back of church and then bailing...take the extra 30 seconds to just run there and leave the jeep for pushes on further flags. On Fall of Berlin if you do the APC rush and pod over the fence make sure somebody stays behind, the last thing the PAC team needs is two EU APC's.
I also always cringe when I see a full squad of snipers (full as in 4+ snipers and no medics)...I'm not one to tell people how to play their game, but I've never once seen this be effective.
On Suez squads that continue to throw themselves again and again and again onto inner bridge if it's well defended...don't get me wrong I like to try for this flag at the start, sometimes it's lightly defended and makes a big differences for your team if you can cap it quick, I'd probably even try for the flag twice if I thought the first time was almost successful...but if you can't take it on two consecutive tries, take the squad someplace else, odds are it'll be an easy cap and more productive to your team.
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01-07-2009, 09:36 AM #5
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
In one short sentence: "why is the whole team standing around here at our flag?"
If you have to ask that one then one or more SL's are doing it wrong!
If you have only one flag you should be pushing out from it. (usually, exceptions noted above)
If you have more than one flag you should defend more than one flag.
Grrrr!

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01-07-2009, 01:39 PM #6
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Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Similar to what bacon said, what frustrates me to no end is when I lead a squad to take a flag on Tunis or Verdun. What tends to happen is that as we're moving out to the next flag, every other squad decides to stay back and defend that one flag.
If we have less flags than the other team, on a double assault map (maps with 2 or 0 UCBs), then you NEED to at the very least even out the flag count. If you want to win on defense and death counts, then you have to make sure we are not under bleed.
Another thing that frustrates me, and I know I am a victim of this myself, is when other squads decide to do exactly what I'm doing for the entire round. I've noticed this happens when there's less experienced SLs on my team, so I usually don't let it get to me, but for anyone who does this, think before you follow a more experienced SL. Do they need your help? Often I'll notice an undefended flag and send my squad in for a quick capture, only to look around after our flag's up and see 2-3 other squads with me, leaving our original flag undefended and in the process of flipping over to the enemy's hands, putting us right back where we started.
I understand tactical situational awareness isn't something that's easily learned, or even taught for that matter. But it's obviously frustrating when a simple understanding of how ticket bleed works, and the ability to recall this information in the chaos of a battle, means the difference between a team losing and winning.
For other SLs out there, please make a concerted effort to learn how bleed works, and train yourself to realize the situation with ticket bleed. If we have 2 out of 3 capturable flags, switch to defense. Which is another thing that frustrates me to no end, but DocGuo covered that one already.
Finally, to go back to my first point, I realize that some squads follow others around because they feel they're incapable of doing anything on their own. By sticking to a bigger squad with a better SL, you're helping that squad out, but also hurting your own learning process for SLing, along with lowering the amount of squads available to the team by 1. Have faith in yourself! If the situation calls for it, help the other squad, but otherwise try to do your own stuff, pincer attacks work better then shooting right up the middle!
For the tl;dr people out there here's some advice for our young SLs who are still learning the ropes:
- Learn ticket bleed.
- Learn when to switch from offense to defense.
- Learn to trust yourself, and your ability to command the squad.
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01-07-2009, 02:01 PM #7
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
One of my biggest pet peeves in the game is seeing a squad dispersed over the entire map with one person here, another over there and a few others running somewhere. Clearly that squad has no purpose, no tangible objective and little or no leadership. Each individual is acting as that, an individual, putting themselves above the team. I often feel they are simply going for kills to increase they're KDR with little regard for what the rest of the team is doing. This irks me even more when my team is under bleed, we have no CO and the team doesn't appear to care instead continuing playing as individuals and not squad mates or teammates. That is probably the #1 thing that is sure to set me off.
Second to that would be when the team shadows one squad for whatever reason, whether intentional or not. It shows that people aren't using the map and aren't thinking tactically, they're just running from flag to flag. Mob mentality if you will...




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01-07-2009, 02:23 PM #8
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
When you heroically take v.difficult crucial flag, and for one reason or another, no one spawns there.
I know there are a lot of reasons people can't, but it's the most frustrating thing in the world when say, you're at Hill on Minsk having just broken out, and the enemy is sending everything they've got at you. 5 minutes later it's still just your squad, and you're shouting in futility "where the hell is the rest of the team?!".In Order to Dance



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01-07-2009, 03:50 PM #9
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
For me it is when:
1. As a CO, sometimes my blood boils when the squads do not listen to commands, especially when one squad is ordered to stay back to cover the rear or give covering fire. Example of that is at Camp G's Central flag and Ruins' flag. EU tends to all bunch up at Central and not keep an eye out for the easy breakthroughs into the back bases. To kill the breakthrough, keep one squad back at the choke point near the dual walled area and the road. You do need patrols, yes, even in BF2142.
2. I hate the "unable to hold a flag" moments in some rounds. It sometimes comes down to not to having a CO, but when they have a CO and it still happens, then the squad leaders are all at fault. When SLs don't anticipate the actions of their equals, the whole thing falls apart, this also ties into squad cohesiveness, CO to SL relations, and to the things DocGou and pred mentioned.
3. It seems like most COs do not utilize the squad leaders' abilities. Even though we know what some of the 3rd's squad members lead like, not many TG'ers seem to utilize the squad leaders properly. I know it takes time, but the only way to get to know the style of a SL is to squad up with the person enough times to get a view of his style.
4. When you are SL'ing, and you find yourself defending alone because the members feel like they are not getting enough action. I was just leading one today. Only the elder TG'ers and IHS members give enough patience to SLs taking orders from the CO.
5. When you are trying to go somewhere quietly on the map and another squad goes by alarming the enemy. Berlin is nasty about that, and so is Verdun. For example, an SL drives a buggy, stops, and leaves the thing near you. If the guy leaves the buggy there, it can be seen by all. If the enemy sees it and investigates, you will probably be discovered and killed. So, if you are in that situation, either make the car explode like an accident happened or get out of there ASAP.
6. In Op. Shingle, PAC can have a problem with losing everything but command. If the PAC is left with only Command, it must start by getting the high ground back. So, the biggest problem begins when you order two squads to take columns back, but instead the squads reject the order. Often times though, if columns is recaptured, the one of the squads there will sit around and not take initiative by requesting orders...Last edited by BeSiege82; 01-07-2009 at 04:52 PM.



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01-07-2009, 04:22 PM #10
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
1. Getting TK'd by a medic and they don't revive you.
2. CO's who order all squads to attack same point. I understand on the linear maps like Camp Gib or when the opportunity for a cap out is there, but what peeves me is on maps like Shingle where the CO has all squads attacking Dunes, leaving the rest of the map open and giving the other side the advantage of all of our forces gathered in one spot.
3. Why does everyone who gets in a transport's gunner seats feel they have to fire at everything....especially the enemy's gunship?
4. People who jump out of armor when the enemy is around.
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01-07-2009, 05:51 PM #11
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Squad Leaders who don't lead, don't communicate with squad or commander and don't work as a team overall
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01-07-2009, 05:59 PM #12
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Not exactly a "friendly squad" issue, but a friendly CO one:
I absolutely detest getting a CO order to attack a flag only to get with the flags radius and have that same CO drop on orbital on us. Either drop it before we get there or use it somewhere else, do not drop it ON us. And those orbitals have a rather large radius, wish CO's would keep that in mind as well sometimes...




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01-07-2009, 07:41 PM #13
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Well, besides being out of beer........
I hate when you are trying to go somewhere and be stealthy, someone either in your squad or not, feels they must hear the blast of the guns in the transport or buggy. You are doing nothing but giving our position away!
Another is when you manage to take a rear flag, fight off 3/4 of the other team, finally get killed, and notice that your team has not capped ONE FLAG! UGH! I NEED A BEER!
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01-07-2009, 08:00 PM #14
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Oh i sooo know what your about.. I remember a case where i managed to bring my squad up to roadblock and command.. we capped roadblock ( no one spawnt in there ) and neutralized command.. most of there team was falling back to kick our butts.. needless to say we didn´t stand a chance and after roadblock was lost again and command recapped i noticed that the team didn´t even got church or south-town.

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01-07-2009, 08:10 PM #15
Re: Most Frustrating "Friendly Squad" actions?
Heh, I can't tell you how many times I had a squad break through in Cerbere, take Roadblock, then Statue and eventually Command only to look at the map and notice the rest of the team is still fighting over Cross Roads as Statue and Roadblock return to EU.




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