cversion7

I think there are benefits to the Recon kit. I don't play one hardly ever since I suck so I'll stick with the others for now.

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|TG| Noxxium

Guardianx11x

I have the most kills with the Zeller as well....does that make me a bad sniper?

Or just shoot them in the head and kill them...body shots give away your position. Sniping in 2142 is a hit or miss game if you want to do it right


Basically, Loki is right. BF2142 is not a snipers game, the assault kit is overpowered, and the vast community of noobs LOVES to snipe..albeit poorly. But what you must realize Loki is that there are a few decent ones out there who can consistently put a bullet in the head of a moving target. One shot kills from a distance are very effective, if you want to revive, that’s fine. I've shot more than my fair share of people trying to revive (but they often do get revived anyway). Having a sniper in your squad is great because of the otus, intel, and the ability to engage targets that the other kits aren’t equipped to deal with...the problem is finding a good one in the sea of bad.

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SharinganTH1422

Yes well, that's a perfect situation, but even an average sniper can hit the torso to weaken them.

Not my exact words, but with the posts I've made, collectively, I've sent that message, so yes, definitely agree

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Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

Lorax74

Can someone please headshot this thread and the next person who tries to revive it? Leave an APM and some RDX next to the "New Reply" button while you're at it.

I'm sorry, but this topic has been discussed ad nauseam. Personally, I like recons (not snipers) in my squads, but some don't. How about we all agree to disagree.

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Guardianx11x

If you don't like a thread, don't read it. Some guys feel they have somthing to say and should be encouraged to do so. How about you agree not to post lame comments in threads you have no interest in.

At the end of the day it will be best for all of us.

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SVD_Sniper

Okay, first of all - ignore the lambert, forget it exists. If you are playing as close togther as TG say they do, then you dont need it. If you come face to face with someone, you will 99.9% of the time have enough time to land a round in their chest, AT LEAST. Then if a med is near you, he can engage a target that has 10-20% health while he has 100%. Easy win, sniper gets a revive. Cycle continues.


Also, snipers can be invaluable in corridors and other good lanes of fire. In the time it would take an assault player to deal about 100 damage at 60 meters, the target has had the chance to realise the lane is hot and get back into cover. If the first round that hits him takes him down to 20% or less, hes not going to have a second chance.

The advantage of the rifle is not in its range. Its in its massive damage per bullet value. When you can co-ordinate togther it is devastating. Im tlaking about lanes of fire, angles to cover, locking down areas totally and combined arms.

Lets say, we are locking down toll station on gib. The SL is on one of the roofs next to it providing a spawnpoint for people to rush the flag from. If you have the SL as support, (say) and a sniper and a medic with him, he can lock the whole flag area down. Any target will take damage from assault rifles, and HMG and then a sniper round to either finish him off uberfast or to soften him beforehand.

On a final note about the lambert - if you are going to take that, go assault/support instead. Its an abysmal weapon. Sure the netbat advantage is lost, but you gain either another IDS1 or defib. Also, a bit of communication and cordination has the same effect as netbat anyway.

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I use the 3 call rule: If I ask you for ammo/health/repairs 3 times and you just stand there and look at me, im TK'ing you and taking what I need.

MDFubar

I think that the Lambert is good for CQB, but then again I do not use it much. I would have to agree with Gaurdianx11x, if you can find a good sniper then you will havee a good addition to your squad......depending on your objective. I sniped alot in BF2 and somewhat in BF2142, I enjoy it and don't consider myself too shabby......that being said I now find it more effective for ME to be either Assualt or Engineer depening on the map and my objective as an SL.
Defending Cebre Command Center is a good place for a sniper.......a good one. As far as the corridor thing and the description of Toll Station, spot the sniper and launch your rockets.
Sm or Co spots the sniper and you get a fix on the minimap, direct a few rockets over that way and that threat is solved.
Same thing in a corridor, such as on Belgrade. Sniper in the corridor, SL tells an Assault SM on the ground to vary the rocket detonation and fire into the corridor and or toss a few nades.
Please in no way take this as a post against snipers, I for one will welcome a good sniper or recon in my squads depending on the map and the objective.

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Anospa

Gonna have to argue these statements. Like Fubar said, in that position, you're rocket bait for sure, if not, people defending will spawn there, if not that, then you'll get flanked easily. A good spot on Camp Gib for a sniper is the east side, there's a train car to hide behind that gives you solid cover and an amazing fire lane straight down the East side into Central Camp (fog negates your view, but you can hit people there).

As for Otus not being useful because people can communicate, well yeah. If people communicate well, you'll easily be able to see where everyone is, unless they're behind walls. The diamond will give you a direction and elevation, but who knows if they're real close or far away, or how they're set up on the other side of the wall. The mini-map will give you this info.

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SVD_Sniper

I agree with a portion of that (well , most of it). I am also happy to admit that the vast majority of people who snipe would be far more productive in another role (or maybe outside getting fresh air and not even playing :P ). Im simply putting forward how I play when I am a sniper and such. For a start, "lone wolfing" is especially bad. If you stick to the squad you provide direct support in gunfights and can get revived/resupplied/healed etc. If you go off alone, you will quite often become a ticket bleed for the team. Staying near medics is essential as you will not have the ability to heal yourself.


As far as the rockets on the roof example go - A tip that is invaluable for all players. Do NOT stand right at the edge or right behind an object. Seriously. Try to stand about 5-6 meters back - that way you are jsut as well protected from bullet weapons and it makes it considerably harder for someone to range rockets on you. Also, if you are a sniper on that roof situation, the rocketeer (for lack of better term) will have given his position away on firing. He will also be within your LoS (line of sight, and most likely) and scoped. He will either have moved on, in which case you have a low threat target, or he will be scoped in, meaning even a mediocre sniper can hit him in the head (as he will be still/slowly moving). If the **** does hit the fan, there is a medic up there. If the medic goes down, you revive him, then have him TK you pick up his medic kit and revive you- back as a sniper. TK/suicide kit swapping is also a good tip if you have a squad of people who arent particularly versatile/comfortable with a particular kit.

Now for the lambert - it is outclassed by all the assault rifles. At almost any range, the AR's are simply better, in terms of damage per bullet, accurracy and rate of fire. However, you are also sacrificing a defib/another unlock for a RDX/APM/Cammo set. The cammo is usless as you have 5 guys next to you who are not cloaked, you get yourself on netbat HUD's and you have to draw your weapon if you get a contact. RDX is very useful for anti-tank/armour work, and sometimes setting up traps - although as stated before there is a large oppurtunity for TK's. APM's are mostly pointless. They are good for stopping runners (people who break off from a group alone and attempt to take a rear CP without meeting resistance) when you dont want to sacrifice manpower. They should not be used to "watch your back" while you snipe as you shouldnt be scoped for any longer than it takes for you to squeeze off a round.


EDIT: Another post was made while I was typing, so anyhting that isnt adressed alread I will do now.
Elevation and distance are not problems with voicecomms they are with netbat. You say where they are, which is better than simply a dirrection. What has the otus got to do with it?

Also as you mantioned- people will be spawning below you. you have in my example 3 guys holdign back - one is a support. you see them coming (IDS1) and the medics assault rifle deals with it. the support and sniper do the locking down. If the guys spawnign below you are trying to dislodge you, the guys on the flag (other 3 inthe squad) are on the flag with less heat coming their way.

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I use the 3 call rule: If I ask you for ammo/health/repairs 3 times and you just stand there and look at me, im TK'ing you and taking what I need.

Lorax74

Let's look at this point by point:

I'll agree with this, but I also feel that a recon in a squad with an Otis is invaluable. I prefer the recon run with Lambert, RDX, and APMs, but that's just me. And usually when I play recon, I make it a point to stick close to the SL rather than on point.

I would hope, that by this point in the conversation, this is understood as a "given". It has been agreed upon that a lone wolf sniper does not benefit his squad or team at all, then again, the same can be said about any lone wolf.

Regardless of which kit you are playing or if you are on the roof or not, this is sound advice when facing off against anyone slinging rockets at you.

Honestly, when was the last time you saw a solo assault player taking on a sniper? Nine times out of ten (and this is in my experience in squads that I am in), the majority of the squad are packing rockets. One person calls out the location of the sniper and almost every assault player turns and unloads their full compliment of 3 or 4 rockets, most of which will find their mark. True you may take one out, maybe two if you're quick, well hidden and lucky, but the rockets will be or already are on their way. Once you are no longer a threat, the remain assualts will have changed their focus from sniper smackdown duty to cover and revive.

Please do NOT practice or preach TKing or intentional suicide, regards if it is to swap kits. Don't do it, it's not acceptable on our servers. I'm not sure if it is a bannable offense if you are caught doing such a thing, but I believe it should be (after a warning of course).

I stopped reading at point...

-lorax

*Edit*
I glanced at the remainder of your post and caught this:
You can find some information to help answer your question here.

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SVD_Sniper

the point here, is not weather or not you have an otus, its wether or not you have a competent sniper or an incompetent one or a lambert user or a sniper. As the otus does little harm, there is no reason why not to take that too.

Yes - although most people wouldnt ask the sniper to stay amongst the squad. What I mean is that he is the 3rd man into the fray, not the last - as I think would often be assumed.


you are NOT a lone sniper taking on a squad of assault players. you are something along the lines of 4 meds, a sniper and a support vs 5 meds and a support. the sniper will often give the edge in a gun/rocket fight. Also, the main point about the tip above is that the first salvo will not harm you. It is usually only after no damage/kill indication appears from the first salvo that the rocketeers will range it *even* further back - giving you time to drop one of them, or maybe harm a reviver. you have a precision that rifle rockets do not have, and a better ability to hit moving targets.
As far as the team killing thing goes - Does that apply even if both parties involved consent to it, and actually pull out of the heat to do so? Its really ajust a point of interest as I cant play on the TG server due to ping (Im in the UK) but use the forums as it is the best place I have found to discuss 2142 intelligently...well, the next comment doesnt help back me up there , but,
...
This answers nothing, as I was not asking what an otus does.

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I use the 3 call rule: If I ask you for ammo/health/repairs 3 times and you just stand there and look at me, im TK'ing you and taking what I need.

WaffleHousChef

Yes, very much so. The two cornerstones of TG play are The TG primer and the Server rules and guidelines.

The relevant primer section is:

and even the server guidelines address this issue:

Teamkilling for profit, is not acceptable on TG servers regardless if there is consent as it would fall under the Aegis of suicide tactics because one party is willing to submit to suicide in this case. It also breaks the spirit of the primer because no real soldier would let themselves be killed simply to hand their equipment over to another, nor would it ever be asked to occur in the first place.

It is perfectly acceptable to kit swap for revives, as long as you then play the kits as swapped or swap back if there is a third party kit around to make the swap. It is not acceptable to intentionally kill one person to perform a kit swap so that you are back to your original kits.

Also, your sig, while most likely a joke is against the TG server rules for the same reasons. People tend to play their kits so you wouldn't have cause to do that, but it's certainly not in the "TG spirit."

SVD_Sniper

I dont actually operate that "3 call rule" for a multitude of reasons, and its not original either - I guess I should put it in a quote wrapper thing...

Also, Sorry I didnt read the server rules/mentality, but its because I'm only here for the forums , not in any way the game server (is that accpeptable by the way - to use only the forum, and not the game servers?)...Unless anyone knows of a way to lower pings over the atlantic?

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I use the 3 call rule: If I ask you for ammo/health/repairs 3 times and you just stand there and look at me, im TK'ing you and taking what I need.

SharinganTH1422

I have no complaints about what anyone has said since I posted last I basically agree with most of it, except SVD_Sniper saying that the Lambert is useless, along with other pieces of equipment with it, which I will address now.

No way.

No arguments there

Well, The Lambert is one of the most accurate, plus low-recoil, full-auto guns in the game.

WHAT!?!?!?! You're telling me that the recon rifles, that are not even semi-auto. they seem more like bolt-action the way you have to wait a little before each shot, and with clip capacities of 6 or 7 at the highest, have a higher fire rate than the Lambert?????

Well that's like saying, "You shouldn't be an engineer because you won't get a defib, but u cant be assault because you won't get motion mines." You can say that for any kit, you shouldn't be that kit because you'll be missing out on something from another kit, you're always going to, miss out on something.

And it is possible to use the stabilizer, don't know why you missed that out.

Yep, never liked camo unless in special circumstances. But very useful if you are ordered to go behind enemy lines.

And as I said before, only n00bs blow up their own team.

More like one of the most useful pieces of equipment in the game, but, whatever.


Look who's coming round to APMs.

Well they can be used like that, but only really for camping snipers, but being a keen knifer, I never walk up to a prone sniper, and I'm always on the lookout for APMs, in fact, APMs leads the sniper into a false sense of security, because they think they're protected, so they never bother to move and/or look around for dog-tag collectors. Camping snipers are not very much liked here at TG, and no-one here does it, so that's for another time and place.

APMs are so useful, you can defend and attack with them, being chased while running back and out of ammo? just drop an APM and sprint round the corner. If the person can't react fast enough, you've got a kill, but if they can crouch or prone, at least you've slowed them down. Putting them around corners and small chokepoints can get you combat efficiency pins and explosive awards left right and center, even just chucking them randomly in the middle of nowhere can sometimes get you a kill, as n00bs or sloppy players that are off guard don't see the small device. Also good in situations like when taking a flag, e.g. how many times have I put a well-disguised APM somewhere along the pathway to the Command Center at Cerbere, and got kills that would have been much more difficult and life-threatening had I been lying there prone as they came up the steps, maybe even facong the other way, and getting knifed, or at least only standing half a chance.

Overall on the Lambert, it is useful, as you can have a good light assault rifle, with Recon equipment, which I think is awesome, and for some reason, everyone else seems to hate with a passion. Its high fire-rate is immense, and when you can aim at the chest or higher, you can really make their life bar run down fast. At distances, i can easily hit people as close to the head as possible with a few single shots, the n when the person starts to react to getting shot, I switch to full-auto, and mark the person a lot. I don't usually kill, but I do very much soften them up, and I'm used to seeing a kill-damage assist being awarded to me not too long after. But after all, the Lambert is about fighting CQB, with a recon kit, its the only gun you can do it with in the recon kit. I mean how am I going to kill an engineer healing a walker with a sniper up close, and then taking out the walker with RDX.

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Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

WaffleHousChef

No worries, as long as you don't mind people telling you about it over and over. It would be worth reading so that you know where all of the rest of us are coming from. I would recommend taking a peek.

And, certainly your level of participation is not going to be an issue. Enjoy the forums, just keep in mind that the self-imposed rules and mindset that are applied to the servers will influence the discussion and attitudes here on the forums.

We have two seperate in-house squads specifically for Euros. So, I'd say that they've found a way to be effective even across the pond.