Re: The Great Scar Debate

**Mixa** · 07-21-2009, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by HellHarry

Kelvin I have a little over 29 hour played with the SCAR11 and yes there is no debate about it... In the right hand it can be seen as really good but thing is the guy using it would be better off using something else like the voss or the baur.

This is correct

Its like Baur with no hip shot at all, lower damage, and slightly better stability for first shot. All weapons can't be equally good unless they're exactly the same, unfortunately DICE didn't spend enough time comparing the weapons (or testing).

Though you can use weapon well no matter how bad it is, but I'll be happy every time I see some1 on enemy team using Scar, also I get stunned every time I get killed by it

**SharinganTH1422** · 07-21-2009, 04:22 PM

Although the Krylov is probably better, you can't use the Krylov when EU Lyra, so this is more of a SCAR/Voss/Baur debate.

I like it TBH, its vertical kick (like the Baur) means that its kick is more predictable than Voss making it more accurate than its already heightened accuracy. However it has less kick than the Baur but packs more of a punch than the Voss. When I was innocent and new to the game and didn't know what other people thought on the ARs (i.e. Krylov best thing since pr0n and SCAR is what killed JFK) I far preferred the SCAR to the Krylov but when my friends kept telling me to use the Krylov I eventually preferred it, and then moved on to Voss/baur because I didn't want to move back to default ARs due to rocket/defib button switch. However, whenever I pick it up on Level 2 Unlock night or any other time it's still pretty fun to use because of the satisfying sound when you shoot it (probably my fave thing about the gun TBH) and the sweet reload animation.

P.S Since when did something that is all-round good become a bad thing? Outmaches the Baur up-close and the Voss at range. It gives every gun a good match at all ranges anyway and if the player is good enough then they'll do well enough...

**Zoraster** · 07-21-2009, 04:49 PM

See, here's the thing kelvin: I was serious. I was not and am not aware of any serious debate over the scar.

The scar is an adequate weapon that I would choose over other kit's weapons like the ganz, but there is literally no situation that I can think of that I would not prefer any of the other three assault rifles. Perhaps I'd prefer the scar number 3 for long distance single shot over the voss, but that hardly seems a reason to propel it to number one.

The baur debate is a debate because there are legitimate points of dispute: higher rate of fire vs. Higher damage at distance. I think I'm right when I say that the voss is clearly superior, but I understand and respect that there are things about the baur that some people prefer. It also has some seriously skilled users who are advocates for it, like frozen and sidious.

This type of thing doesn't occur with the scar because it neither excells the other rifles in any given category nor is it better all around than the other three.

This doesn't come from "hate." If I get revived with a scar, I can still be plenty deadly. I just won't be as deadly as if I used the baur, krylov or voss.

To me the "scar debate" seems awfully close to the "clarkrdx debate." It involves a desire to "discover" an underused device, but really the reason two and a half years of 2142 has not favored these devices is that players have found the alternatives more compelling.

**SharinganTH1422** · 07-21-2009, 05:06 PM

Forgot to answer OP's question...

Best used as a more versatile Baur, as in situations you might avoid with the Baur (more than 2 enemies, CQ engagements) are more do-able with the SCAR.

**SIDIOUS** · 07-21-2009, 05:48 PM

if i get med saved and end up with the scar im not totally disappointed it just doesn't fit the bill to do the kind of damage im used to delivering so i usually end up with a critically wounded enemy shooting at me when i stop firing thinking he should be dead and looking for the next threat

**Deterhek** · 07-21-2009, 06:08 PM

So the Scar is a good all-around gun then right? This is my interpretation:
Long Range
1. Baur
2. Krylov
3. Scar
4. Voss

Medium Range
1. Baur
2. Scar
3. Voss
4. Krylov
Short Range
1. Voss
2. Baur
3. Scar
4. Krylov
So really, the Scar isn't the best in any of the categories, comes in 2nd and 3rd for every one of them, ALTHOUGH, on a map with both long, medium, and short range combat (such as Gibi), the Scar would be a great asset, as you wouldn't have to change guns and reacquire a feel for them when the action moved from, say Harbor to (if a buggy got past) Ruins/Central, Ruins/EU Base, or Central/Toll.
To me the Scar feels like the best example of a "true" AR than the other weapons. The Baur has HUGE recoil and not many bullets per clip, the Voss is a piece of junk at long range and shoots like a garden hose set to "shower", and the Krylov...well I just don't like it for some reason :P (I know lots of people absolutely love it so I'm going to get jumped on for that). The Scar has more damage per bullet than the Voss, more bullets than the Baur and can do more damage per bullet than the Krylov.It has great hip-shooting powers, so you can actually move around when firing rather than just crouching and staying still. It may have lower RPM than the other guns, but if you are smart then that won't matter. You never want to get into a straight-up, wild western sort of gunfight with anyone EVER. personally I see myself killing people much more and more quickly with the Scar than any other weapons there is. For example: I played one round on 32p Verdun with the Scar (came in 1/3 of the way through, and EU was getting HAMMERED), 2 deaths 14 kills. With the Krylov the next round, 10 deaths 4 kills. People say that the Krylov is easier to get used to than the Baur/Scar, but I cannot seem to hit anything with it. Whenever I end up being PAC, from now on I'm going to use the Baur, just because I've had so many bad times with it the Krylov.
/End ranting session.
Sidious: that's just because you play almost entirely with the Baur, although the Scar is probably the closest thing you can get to Baur-power.

**Zoraster** · 07-21-2009, 06:35 PM

I don't think your ratings are grounded in reality. Krylov number 4 at close range? Voss and krylov 3 and 4 at medium?

You're more than welcome to keep using the SCAR, but some time take a look at those high on the leaderboard consistently and see if their scar kills equal even 20% of their total assault gun kills.

With that, I'll leave this thread alone.

**Lyramion** · 07-21-2009, 06:37 PM

And this is the truth:

Long Range
1-3. Not Scar
4. Scar

Medium Range
1. Krylov
2. & 3. Baur or Voss
4. Scar

Short Range
1. Krylov
2. Voss
3. Baur
4. Scar

Because you CAN kill people doesn´t mean it´s a good gun. The potential to kill more people than the other guns makes a gun good.

You can kill 20 people with a SCAR - GREAT! But you could have killed 30 with another gun.

**Greyed** · 07-21-2009, 06:50 PM

Originally Posted by Zoraster

See, here's the thing kelvin: I was serious. I was not and am not aware of any serious debate over the scar.

Hyperbole is lost on you, isn't it?

**FLIPmode** · 07-21-2009, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by Greyed

Hyperbole is lost on you, isn't it?

Or it is quite possible he simply misinterpreted Kelvin's post

But Deterhek, just because you hate, doesn't make the Krylov worse.

**Zoraster** · 07-21-2009, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by Greyed

Hyperbole is lost on you, isn't it?

Perhaps. But misguided condescension isn't.

**Greyed** · 07-21-2009, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by Zoraster

Perhaps. But misguided condescension isn't.

That's clear enough since you use it often enough. But my message wasn't a case of it. If you were, as you said, quite honest then it is clear you missed the fact that his title was hyperbole. However if you were using hyperbole in your "honesty" then it was lost on me.

**Deterhek** · 07-21-2009, 08:02 PM

I'm not trying to critisize the Krylov, I'm just saying that I can do things with the Scar that I just can't seem to handle with the Krylov. I'm mostly curious as to how people think that the Scar is so much worse than the Krylov. The Scar is more accurate at range at full auto, but less accurate on single-shot, and somehow people think that the Scar comes in 4th in the long-range competition. It has VERY little recoil, so using it on full auto (bursts of 4-5) is better than the single shot of the Krylov in my opinion. I have dropped targets as far as 150m with the Scar with burst fire, rather than single-shot. I know I couldn't do that with the Krylov. Another reason the Krylov isn't as capable at range is that it does far less damage than the Scar. By the time you fired your second shot the target could have healed himself, whereas the Scar doesn't give them that luxury: it fires multiple more damaging rounds with the same accuracy I find.

**Zoraster** · 07-21-2009, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by Greyed

That's clear enough since you use it often enough. But my message wasn't a case of it. If you were, as you said, quite honest then it is clear you missed the fact that his title was hyperbole. However if you were using hyperbole in your "honesty" then it was lost on me.

I see. I am glue to your rubber, I suppose.

If you really want to get into this: I actually assumed that his hyperbole was in the word "great" and not "great debate," so when I asked whether there really was any debate at all, I was being honest.

Yes, I knew he was being tongue in cheek about it -- implying that it was a small debate -- but my point remained, which I tried to do with a (perhaps less than successful) brief reply: unlike other disagreements over this vs. that here, this disagreement never gets off the ground because it's not really an open question.

**black_Mirror** · 07-21-2009, 08:37 PM

This Thread kinda makes me a sad panda...
I mean why hating a weapon or the people using it and why hating those who hate it in response?
It´s a freaking weapon in a freaking game and no reason to go deeper in this topic than necessary.
If you like it, use it. If you don´t like it, don´t use it. It is in fact that simple Ladies and Gentleman. There is no invisible force putting a gun to your head and screaming " USE THE SCAR NOW! " i assume so just don´t do it if it makes you feel uncomfortable on your critical days

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