Re: Support weap unlock Ganz HMG - was it all worth it?

**SharinganTH1422** · 08-23-2009, 07:20 AM

Originally Posted by Math_Magician

I think this is like the Baur vs. Voss, Zeller vs. default ind of thing. I think that it's really the person's playing style that dictates which gun he likes.

It's hardly the same as Voss Vs. Baur, since Baur has upsides of accuracy and power, and downsides of RoF, recoil and small clip size.

Ganz has power, but bad recoil, bad accuracy, small clip and worse RoF...

**Math_Magician** · 08-23-2009, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by SharinganTH1422

It's hardly the same as Voss Vs. Baur, since Baur has upsides of accuracy and power, and downsides of RoF, recoil and small clip size.

Ganz has power, but bad recoil, bad accuracy, small clip and worse RoF...

You know what I mean. It's your opinion on which gun is "better."

**Deterhek** · 08-23-2009, 04:14 PM

Be careful on how you word things Math, someone could take that offensively.
But really it isn't like that at all. I'll disregard the Zeller VS Default here because thats not really an argument.
In the Voss VS Baur, both sides of the argument have evidence that makes their guns better than another in some way, and nobody can argue with that argument because they are facts. Whats ends up happening is people argue about what traits are better for a gun. So that really depends on playstyle. In the Ganz VS Defaults though, thre is no need to argue about playstyle, because the Default is better than the Ganz, seen through the game stats, whcih we know we can trust. The Ganz has more power when it hits a target, the Defaults are better in every other way. So it isn't just someone's opinion on the gun.

**SharinganTH1422** · 08-23-2009, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Deterhek

In the Voss VS Baur, both sides of the argument have evidence that makes their guns better than another in some way, and nobody can argue with that argument because they are facts. Whats ends up happening is people argue about what traits are better for a gun. So that really depends on playstyle. In the Ganz VS Defaults though, thre is no need to argue about playstyle, because the Default is better than the Ganz, seen through the game stats, whcih we know we can trust. The Ganz has more power when it hits a target, the Defaults are better in every other way. So it isn't just someone's opinion on the gun.

Because I couldn't be bothered to type it myself

**Math_Magician** · 08-23-2009, 07:03 PM

Ok fine...but still, some people will like the Ganz better than the defaults, you can't change their minds-some people will like the Baur over the Voss, you can't change their minds-some people will like the Zeller over the defaults, you can't change their minds.

It's not about which gun is "better" as it's your opinion. Just because you like the defaults, even with evidence to prove why they're better, some people will still like the Ganz. You can't change that.

**Deterhek** · 08-23-2009, 07:25 PM

But just because they like it doesn't meant it is better. It means they have gotten used to it, but really if they got used to the LMGs they could do more damage.

some people will like the Zeller over the defaults

I.e. you, which may be the reason you don't snipe as well as you can.

**Nine.Thousand** · 08-23-2009, 07:51 PM

ahaha this thread is just painful to read

**Math_Magician** · 08-23-2009, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by Deterhek

But just because they like it doesn't meant it is better. It means they have gotten used to it, but really if they got used to the LMGs they could do more damage.

I.e. you, which may be the reason you don't snipe as well as you can.

Again you are in the way of accepting other people's choices. You need to accept that other people will like other guns than you. I prefer the defaults over the Ganz, but that is just my opinion, some people will like other guns, so instead of making smart remarks at me why don't you just accept that?

EDIT: I won't be posting here anymore as I think the thread has gone dreadfully off-topic.

**Deterhek** · 08-23-2009, 08:16 PM

I already said I accept that , its just that those people could also be using the defaults to better extent. I understand that people like using certain guns because they think it fits their playstyle, but I also know that other guns work better if you give them a chance too. There is no difference in the abilities to play the same style between the Defaults and the Ganz, the defaults are just better in certain areas, they don't require you to play differently

**Math_Magician** · 08-23-2009, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Deterhek

I already said I accept that , its just that those people could also be using the defaults to better extent. I understand that people like using certain guns because they think it fits their playstyle, but I also know that other guns work better if you give them a chance too. There is no difference in the abilities to play the same style between the Defaults and the Ganz, the defaults are just better in certain areas, they don't require you to play differently

Really?? Because in your last 4 posts you seem to be making fun of either:
A: me
or B: the gun I like using

**Deterhek** · 08-23-2009, 08:25 PM

*Facepalm*
I think you need to read my last post again.
BTW It isn't off topic...yet

**SharinganTH1422** · 08-23-2009, 09:21 PM

@Math Magican, I'm not here to change anyone's opinion on the Ganz, if you like the Ganz, that's your choice, but I was challenging the statement that the Ganz is better than the LMGs in ever conceivable way.

I'm not a big participator in Baur Vs. Voss thread because I don't believe either gun is "inferior", but I do think the Ganz is inferior to the LMGs. I put out my opinion because I'm curious to see why someone thinks the Ganz is as good as they claim, and to see if there is any foundation to the claim.

This is also a tactics sub-forum and thread, where the effectiveness of weapons are naturally discussed and debated, and so I doubt we're going to close the book on all of them and say "it's all personal opinion guys." This stuff is for everyone to see, read, and make their own minds up about, and these debates help improve the TG community by getting to the bottom of questions such as these, so we may improve our gameplay..unless they turn into the tamest flame wars on the internet that people like to blow out of proportion.

**Math_Magician** · 08-23-2009, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by SharinganTH1422

@Math Magican, I'm not here to change anyone's opinion on the Ganz, if you like the Ganz, that's your choice, but I was challenging the statement that the Ganz is better than the LMGs in ever conceivable way.

I'm not a big participator in Baur Vs. Voss thread because I don't believe either gun is "inferior", but I do think the Ganz is inferior to the LMGs. I put out my opinion because I'm curious to see why someone thinks the Ganz is as good as they claim, and to see if there is any foundation to the claim.

This is also a tactics sub-forum and thread, where the effectiveness of weapons are naturally discussed and debated, and so I doubt we're going to close the book on all of them and say "it's all personal opinion guys." This stuff is for everyone to see, read, and make their own minds up about, and these debates help improve the TG community by getting to the bottom of questions such as these, so we may improve our gameplay..unless they turn into the tamest flame wars on the internet that people like to blow out of proportion.

I do apologize, you are right, this is to improve TG and I didn't see that until now.
However I don't like the Ganz at all, it is my least favourite gun, and IMO the defaults are way better.
So, like I said...apologies.

**Nine.Thousand** · 08-24-2009, 12:29 AM

Do you honestly think this thread is improving TG? If anything this thread and the threads like it should be deleted, they are all repeats and have contributed nothing. Did anybody's mind change in any of these threads? No. "which gun is better" and "how do you recommend i use <gun>" are two VERY different threads and the former is what typically gets posted and devolves into pointless squabbling.

**Deterhek** · 08-24-2009, 12:52 AM

It isn't pointless to have debates about <gun> VS <gun>, and it most certainly isn't "pointless squabbling." This particular thread hasn't changed anyone's mind, yes, but sometimes they do. Say some pub player who joins TG sees one of these, maybe he learns how to use each weapon in a way that benefits him and his squad the most. More often than not the "how do I use this gun" threads are not nearly as useful as the <gun> VS <gun> threads. Take this one for example, it has at least done as much on the subject of getting people to use good weapons rather than bad weapons as a "<gun> tips" one could. There have been tons of facts on both the LMGs and Ganz and it has proved that the Ganz is not as good as the defaults.
Who knows, perhaps this thread will change someone's mind later.

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