Sir_Brass

While playing on Verdun tonight, I was an engineer defending church against the PAC. While fighting, I got low on ammo and health and when the crate landed directly behind the flag (that little nook area is a perfect anti-vehicle sniping area), I and a good number of other engineers dashed over to it to stock up on health and ammo.

This is where I had this thought: if some snipers were hiding in the towers, this would be the perfect situation for them.

As I understand it, with the zeller, a hit to the body will kill a soldier no matter how healthy he is. Also, the recon kit has the active cammo, and a smart sniper waiting for the perfect shot will remain undetected by the assaults with netbat for quite a while simply due to the fact that they have active threats to kill or avoid.

So, here's my thought: the CO, in conjunction with a good, smart sniper squad, has the squad deploy to an area that has excellent overwatch where they can hide and easily be missed. Then, when the area is flooded, have several other squads approach the area and begin harassment. Then the CO INTENTIONALLY drops a supply crate into the middle of the area, where the snipers have their best view. This will attract all those guys needing resupply and health. If they're low on either (they ought to be by now), they'll be there each at least a good several seconds. Fish in a barrel is what they'll be to the snipers. Fast disorienting, and deadly strike, and the peripheral force rushes in and takes out the enemy. The enemy will be distracted by the snipers that popped out of seemingly nowhere striking them from who-knows-where, and also having to deal with the powerful (and well supplied and healed up) force pushing on them. Focus is lost and the point can be taken.

Something like this could quite possibly be used on points such as Dry Lake, Comm Tower, Oil Field, STATUE, and church (both cerebere and verdun).

Anyway, this was something I thought up on the fly all on the premise of "what if this crate is being dropped here by the enemy CO just so that we'll go to it and be placed right in the sights of his snipers".

Give me your thoughts on this. Shooting this down will not be taken as an offense. I just want to know if this can be really refined into something useable. If so, it could become something of a TG hallmark, simply b/c we're one of the ONLY groups to be so dedicated to team play and coordination.

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|TG-Irr|Hiram_Yorik
Games: GRAW, BF2142, Oblivion, FarCry, Empire At War, R6:RVS, KotOR, KotOR2, MW4: Mercs, FEAR (XP)




*Hiss* "Oh...crap!" *BLAM* "I'm down....MEDIC!!"

DirtyLude: "If we kill him and eat his heart, his magic will be ours."

WarV

The Zeller does not kill in one shot when you have heavy armor. It only kills in one shot with light armor.

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|TG-Irr|WarV

Urit

But if they're standing humping the armory... er, supply crate, then it's free headshot buffet, all you can snipe.

Prophaniti

I find it difficult to get good LOS to the flag area of Church from the upper perches. Seems like no matter where I try, there's building wreckage that obscures enemies. Most especially when facing towards the west side of Church.

Statue, in comparison, is a GREAT place for setting this tactic up. Everyone loves this flag because controlling the walker goes a long way to controlling the map (assuming a savvy pilot of course).
LOS is good, with plenty of good places to set up camp and be able to displace when needed. It's also the most elevated position, so picking off those snipers on the monorail is easier from here than trying it from Ruin.

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|TG-9th| Prophaniti



Admins are Chick Magnets

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Sir_Brass

But how about the do-ability of setting up this kind of tactic. I know this is impossible to do with non-TG-minded pubbies (TG-minded pubbies being those who play our mindset but w/o the TG tag) in the mix, but if they weren't: what think ye?

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|TG-Irr|Hiram_Yorik
Games: GRAW, BF2142, Oblivion, FarCry, Empire At War, R6:RVS, KotOR, KotOR2, MW4: Mercs, FEAR (XP)




*Hiss* "Oh...crap!" *BLAM* "I'm down....MEDIC!!"

DirtyLude: "If we kill him and eat his heart, his magic will be ours."

Prophaniti

It's been done on a smaller scale (meaning one or two snipers) and with 50/50 success rate.

Problems encountered:

-Problems watching your back. Popping heads requires some rather narrowly-focused attention. Sometimes you'll get tunnel vision and not hear the guy behind you whipping out the knife until it's too late.
Having someone around to watch your back would be highly desirable in this scenario.

-Problems zeroing in. Unintentional obstructions seem to benefit the targets. Whether it's a piece of intervening wall or rooftop obstructing LOS, or the FAV parked next to the flag, there are times where being in the right spot to pop the guys in the "huddle" just doesn't work out.

I like the idea, but somehow I'm envisioning it working out better with a squad full of Assault Rocket spamming. This would eliminate the LOS problem and could make better use of damage by hitting everyone in the huddle at once.

__________________
|TG-9th| Prophaniti



Admins are Chick Magnets

Blood and Honor, The Journal of a 9th MID Soldier
Chapter 1: Cold Morning in Minsk
Chapter 2: Parting With The Permafrost
Chapter 3: Out Like A Light

Yes, I have a Blog

Elite_Master

correct..

With the Park 52 --> light armor : 1 shot to the torso at 100 meters or less .. greater than 100 m you need 2 shots
heavy armor : 2 shots to the body at any distance

With the Zellar --> light armor : 1 shot to the body at 300 meters or less
.. greater you need 2 shots
heavy armor : 2 shots to the body at any distance

Note: 1 shot anywhere at the shoulders or above (neck, head) is a kill no matter what the armor,gun type or distance... also a side note --> with heavy armor I've noticed an exception with the park 52 and limb shots ... shots of this kind brings health down to 30 within 100 meters and limb shots over 100 meters bring down health to 50...

Sir_Brass

Maybe an even mix? The reason I say this is because the major advantage of the sniper rifles are that you cannot tell where the shot came from like you can with rockets (the damage direction indicator stays static on your display once it appears, and does not shift direction as you move) where you can see them coming.

Also, assaults cannot use the IT-33 AC like recon can.

Here's something, an even 3 assault w/ voss/krylov+rockets+defib & 3 recon with standard sniper rifle + stabilizer + active cammo. Go in pairs. Assaults watch backs of snipers and stay hidden in shadows until execution of the plan. Fire discipline has to be paramount. The squad cannot afford to have its position compromised beforehand for this to work. The snipers open up on the victims, and that's when the assaults move out into the "open" (visible maybe, but still concealed) w/ their ranges pre-known (so that if what pops up on their scopes is wrong, they know where to dial to) with respect to the supply crate or whatever that is the bait. This allows the snipers to stay unknown, and most people will see and feel the damage from the rocket attack, with the snipers picking off the paniced victims. The coup de grasse (sp?) being the other squad(s) then moving in to seal the coffin.

This could (maybe) have been pulled earlier today when playing Suez when all the PAC had left to take was Outer. Now, they (we) blew it b/c of lack of team coordination and such, and this little trick would NOT have worked AT ALL in this. But that would be the kind of situation in which it would be nice to pull off something like this.

So, among the hunting squad, the assaults will provide distraction and deadly airbursts when the trap is sprung. Them being visible is important (though staying alive is also pretty important).

Another problem I thought of is what if the folks being ambushed have deployed a becon? If its outside the kill zone, another squad can be sent to take care of it, if inside, one can only hope that the snipers have view of it and can blast it when its time to spring the trap. Also, wouldn't Otus drone + a recon with netbat uncover the entire trap, or is the revealing of the enemy within a narrow radius of the recon himself?

Anyway, this would only work under highly coordinated conditions. The main problem being getting the opposing team to do what you want them to. That's why there's the bait. Still, what also has to be done is manipulating the circumstances to force the victims to take the bait. I guess letting the victims jump on the flag is the best option, though getting them to stick there might require a sacraficial lamb kind of thing (one squad sacrificing a third of itself to make the enemy think that the flag is in serious danger).

I guess the more complicated it is, the more it is subject to Murphy's Law.

So, how can this be simplified down without losing its somewhat unique appeal?

__________________
|TG-Irr|Hiram_Yorik
Games: GRAW, BF2142, Oblivion, FarCry, Empire At War, R6:RVS, KotOR, KotOR2, MW4: Mercs, FEAR (XP)




*Hiss* "Oh...crap!" *BLAM* "I'm down....MEDIC!!"

DirtyLude: "If we kill him and eat his heart, his magic will be ours."

Tarenth

The single largest flaw in the plan is that its expecting the other team to not have any situational awareness at all.

When your commander deploys a supply drop everyone in the vicinity hears the "Supply Drop - Your area" from the Commander. Just like when you are in the scan radius of your own UAV you'll hear "UAV deployed" from the commander.

If a quiet supply drop or UAV happens then it is obviously from the other team. Not only did the commander not tell you they dropped the crate, but the map won't show the supply symbol either.

In such a situation 2 things come to my mind.

1) CO saw thier advancing squad right on top of the location with the map and used a supply drop to help them dig in.
2) CO tried to target a supply drop to someone just on the other side and didn't factor in wind for the drop placement.

Either way when I see a silent UAV or supply crate it means the enemy CO is planning something and its time to be on the alert.

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SaladFork

It was a very common tactic in BF2 to drop a supply crate, count to 5, and then drop artillery right on top of it. You were usually guaranteed 3-5 kills on TG, and over 10+ on pubs.

It actually got so bad that if I saw a supply drop box and didn't recall hearing "Supply drop, your area!", I would run as fast as I could in the completely opposite direction.

~Salad

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Boulderdash

This isn't exactly what you're talking about, but I've been using this the past few days and its worked great. The best example is a game at Belgrade where Comm tower was the only flag my team held aside from the one closest to our UCB. I snuck around to Pond, jumped on the flag until it was neutral and ran like hell towards the rear of their assaulting line. I hide against the wall and all of a sudden saw about 13 guys run towards Pond from the buildings. I had my sentry gun out and mowed down about half of them before I died. This took all the pressure off of Com Tower and my team was able to make a push and capture Pond. With several organized squads this isn't as effective, but I know there's almost a universal "someones on the flag" and instinctive rush to capture it back. Only thing is, that's not the intent and it may give the defending team enough time to reorganize and assault. This has to be a flag right behind a line, not one in a random area.