Arf

If 2 players came around a corner one with a Herzog and one with a rifle and both aimed for the head they'd kill each other. Even though the guy with the rifle is dead first the Herzog isn't going to kill fast enough to keep that second shot from firing a split second after the first.


Rocket grenades move slowly, are highly visible, and kill slower then rifles. Around medium ranges you have a pretty good chance of dodging incoming rockets or at least keeping on the edges of the splash damage enough to survive. The biggest mistakes players make is that they sprint everywhere and rarely displace. If you don't have sprint you wont be able to dodge rockets. You displace so people can't range you in. A good example of displacement is corners, most players pop out behind a corner to fire a few shots and then hide again. While they're hiding they can't see if anyone fired rockets at them so at the very least stay well clear of any corner you just fired around. Try to find a new place because even if nobody fired rockets at you that doesn't mean they didn't range the corner in and are waiting for you to jump back out.

One final thought; if you see your squad mate go down on a balcony to rocket grenades don't think, "that probably wont happen to me" and go for the revive. It probably will, I get most of my rocket kills by bouncing splash damage off of a wall or balcony someone has their back too close to or cleaning up the Medic (2 more kills, yay) who goes for a revive.

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Muhnk

The Herzog has its uses. It's great for rushing flag defenders. It also saves you from having to draw your pistol when you run out of ammo in a firefight. Pretty deadly combined with the Baur, but I honestly don't have too much of a problem using the Baur in CQC as it is.

But if I had to pick between a shotgun attachment or an attachment that lets me take out people hiding behind cover (whether they poke their head out or not), I'll take the Rockets. Rockets do what bullets cannot. That's more useful to me than a couple of shells...

At least the Herzog is more useful than the smoke grenade, though.

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jonan_

Why would you rush flag defenders? Use rockets and grenades to clear them out and then go for the flag. If you rush the flag when there are a bunch of people there you will either get killed by them or team mates that are throwing grenades or firing rockets.

SVD_Sniper

Sometimes you have to. Its really that simple. If you are bleeding tickets, just nading/rocketing the defenders (who will end up revived anyway) ont really help.

the is especially true as PAC - you are often forced to play very agressively. For example, on Gib, 9 times out of 10 will start by going up the middle, getting a few nades on the right rooftop and then rockets ont he left. Then you can move behind the big boxes near the flag, and assault rifle your way to the flag. the longer you sit back prenading, the more tickets you bleed.

Then again, this depends very much on your playstyle - I play in a clan that is always on the offensive. Even if we have them ticket bleeding - always go for the whiteout (full cap, prevent spawns win)

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I use the 3 call rule: If I ask you for ammo/health/repairs 3 times and you just stand there and look at me, im TK'ing you and taking what I need.

jonan_

I think most people around here would agree that the 7th plays very agressive but we still nade and rocket a flag before we rush in. It would be very stupid to rush a flag with say 10 defenders on it when you could take out half of them before you get there (with rockets and nades). Often you will then catch a few more while they are trying to get a revive instead of trying to take you out first. With this tactic you will get the flag almost everytime.

If I made it sound like sitting back to pick up kills and not cap a flag was a good way to go then I apologize.

Also sorry about hijacking the thread. Back to discussing rockets vs shotgun.

Muhnk

That's basically what I was getting it. There are times when rushing in is better than nading, but that's another topic on its own... The Herzog plays a good role when you do rush in to cap the flag/take out the remaining defenders. I like to sweep around the nade/rocket area to flank the dispersing survivors before they can reposition themselves. The Herzog gets the job done quick in that area. Assault class being able to switch their role to that of a Clark Shotgunner and back is not too shabby, IMO.

With that said, I should make it a habit to equip the Herzog when I'm on point.

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HBrutusH

If I'm in cover, I get jittery, the slightest *ptoont* sound of rockets being fired makes me run around like a headless chicken...even if they aren't aimed at me.

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<<<<Magic!!




-F- Concr3te: "Brutus, goddammit, shut up!"

Incurable

The only time I used a Herzog was when I didn't have rockets unlocked. Using a shotgun on a server where your ping is 130+ is just not going to work unless your target is not moving or running straight at you. Also I'm not a big fan of shotguns due to the fact you have to be so close to the enemy that you can see the whites of their eyes. By which point I'm dead because I'm so damn terrible at this game. Rockets are just perfect at doing so many things: want to clear out a squad from behind a wall?; no problem!, want to shoot a sniper out of a tower?; no problem!, want to obliterate a checkpoint?; no problem! They just do everything your main weapon can't do, with style.

As for rocket tactics, I only fire 2 if I'm sure they will kill the target i.e. a sniper looking the other way. I used to do this far too often and end up getting frustrated as my targets ran off with about 3hp. After watching Bomm's movie I changed my rocketing style which makes rocketing so much easier if you have the Support dude to help you. It was an easy change to do aswell which was fire off all 4 rockets even if there is a slight chance that they will not die. This makes sure you get the kill and you sometimes get the nice suprise of getting an extra kill of someone running into your last 2 rockets.

So all in all....

Rockets > {insert any other assault unlock except defib here}

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DeimosManifest

Bomm doesn't know any other tactic than fire all 4 rockets at any head sticking up, so it's kind of a moot point :P

Edit: My new avatar represents what happens when people see rockets coming.

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Tearing structurally-superfluous new behinds with high caliber weapons since 2006.

HBrutusH

hm. that's what I do, maybe we should meet up.

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<<<<Magic!!




-F- Concr3te: "Brutus, goddammit, shut up!"

Zoraster

perhaps it's just because I've never really gotten the hang of the shotgun, but i kill a lot faster and have better survivability with my voss or krylov even at close distances. But again, whether it's the herzog or the clark, I haven't ever really gotten used to killing with the shotgun.

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|TG| Zoraster | Tactical Soccer Managing

draeh

Yeah... bullet wounds are so much easier to clean up after than a shotgun blast.

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Ikariam (Alpha)
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Razcsak

Agreed, we have far too many rockets as it is, reducing that number greatly would help gameplay, at least in my opinion. Oh, and yet, I use rockets and the Voss extensively.

Guardianx11x

I have fired the Herzog maybe three times ever. This is because I only ever use it on a kit swap...and my squadmates could probably reccount the times I picked this weapon up because it was followed by a 4min rant about noobs after I switched to "rockets" and fired a shotgun blast at a target 70m away. Don't use this weapon. If I run out of ammo and pick your kit up after killing you and find a herzog I will A) know why you are on the ground dead and B) be very sad and will probably get myself killed looking for a new kit.

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Anospa

Oh the rants of all the 3rd on our hatred of certain weapons and things. I still "love," getting revived into a Best Buy gun and shotgun. Or how about a Zeller with no nades or anything else in the middle of power station on Tunis. Or maybe an engineer kit with the vehicle scanner and defuser on Camp G, thats always useful.

Anywho, ranting done.

I'd say my rocket tatics rely on 2-3 rockets to a target(s). If I know that 2 will do the job, thats what I use. If not, fire off 3 or 4. After playing ProMod, I've come to realize how much you rely on that 4th rocket, so been trying to ween myself off that to not need it as often.

As for shotgun, does anyone know the draw time on it? One thing that kills me sometimes is the draw time on the pistol if I'm not moving to cover quickly enough. If the draw time on the shotgun was instanteous (which it should be, its on the actual AR), then I could see it being perfectly useful. I still trust the pistol more because its what I'm used to, cleared Toll Station for the most part with a mostly full Krylov and PAC pistol last night, friggin friendly nades raped me though.

I'm toying with trying the shotgun out a bit, but not sure on that draw time, I'll have to look into this...

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"Brittle?! Dude you just took a localized tactical warhead to the face." -Eroak