Welcome to Tactical Gamer

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 19
Discussion: Call of Duty Archives / Call of Duty 4 - General Discussion - Random Dudes - Its kind of nice to see the old random dude that might be a little
  1. #1


    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    50

    Random Dudes

    Its kind of nice to see the old random dude that might be a little to far up on the maps now a days. It keeps things interesting. Sure I get mad when it happens but it keeps you on your toes.

    When I first started playing I was always on my toes from the moment I spawned till the end of the round. Since the beginning of the boundary situation I've began to create the cozy notion that I was safe up to a certain point, Then when i crossed this imaginary line I began the battle, but with the removal of those imaginary lines per say I am back on my toes, making sure every move counts. It is quite entertaining, but that brings up another point.

    It seems to me our idea of a tactical defense is skewed by our idea of the cozy notion that since we think one place is to far we can't be killed till we get to a certain point.

    So in light of that, Please explain to me why, in ambush the B site, sniper position is "to far up"? I understand from that position, like the "A" snipers position, you can see a lot but you can also defend both movement to "A" and more importantly, movement to B. And being a SCOUT class, able to spot enemy movement to relay back to your teammates. It can be a vital position, and also a very dangerous position. pretty much all sniper positions are a double egded sword. So if someone can please explain this to me it would be most helpful...

  2.  
  3. #2


    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Age
    41
    Posts
    74

    Re: Random Dudes

    LOL, Moses. I like the premise of your post. My only concern on any map, not just Ambush, is that EVERYONE plays by the same rules --> some might say guidelines <-- and that no unfair advantage is given to either the offense or defense. If everyone is playing by the same expectations, then there shouldn't be any complaining.

    I agree with your main idea though... If you don't have official "boundaries" then really we should be able to do whatever we need to protect the objectives. This doesn't need to turn into another one of those debate posts at all. I think most people just want consistency in enforcement and a knowledge that no one playing will try to exploit the rules to get an unfair advantage.

    My point here is I don't think we are ever going to reach a neutral point where it is very easy to determine what is wrong or right. Unfortunately, I think what we are playing by now is about the best we can hope for. An argument can always be made that the best defense is an agressive, rush style which catches the other team off guard; but this goes against the spirit of the game.

    At the end of the day, the game is what it is. I think the Admins have done the best job possible with the tools at their disposal. More tactical in CoD4 I don't think is attainable than what we have now. This will always result in these gray areas which basically lead up to your "Random Dudes" premise.

    For my part, I must admit I get completely pissed off when I have a job to do knowing the SOP of a particular map and then I get blindsided by someone either outright hunting or leastwise shooting from a predetermined OOB blindspot. I don't apologize for my attitude at all. As long as these are the server rules, I will for sure continue to play by them. This is the premise of the game mode and server rules put out by the community. Asking for anything else from players, within this rule set, isn't fair and leads to people getting upset.

    Rant over.

    Bomber

  4.  
  5. #3



    P.Drona's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Boston USA
    Posts
    3,494

    Re: Random Dudes

    Good posts.

    Please read this post:

    http://www.tacticalgamer.com/call-du...se-review.html

    The B sniper position would more technically be "off objective" rather than "too far".

    Here's the reasoning. Defense is not tasked with the aggressive elimination of the enemy. They are tasked with defending the bombsites and their immediate chokepoints. While a defender could watch the B site from that position, they can also turn around and shoot folks that are nowhere near any objective or choke thus they are now no longer defending, they are attempting to aggressively eliminate the enemy. They are also positioning themselves in a vulnerable, hard to defend position that can be sniped from several locations or 'naded/smoked from cover. Bad for the team. The fatal funnels on Ambush are so clear, the defense is better off hunkering down and keeping their (hopefully) assigned lanes clear.

    The same reasoning has recently been applied to the attic on Creek. Both positions, B sniper on Ambush and attic on Creek do provide overwatch of an objective or choke but they also provide the defenders with a potential FOV into the enemies spawn or close to it as well as other areas of the map that are outside their marching orders. Someone will inevitably decide to start poppin' folks heads off from those spots as the attackers come out of spawn after a longer than expected planning session. It's just plain easier to deny the locations to defense than to have to constantly remind folks they shouldn't look out the other side.

    This is pretty much why Crash is no longer in the rotation. The defenders will have to live without visuals on some of the battle space and adapt their positioning accordingly.

  6.  

     
  7. #4


    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Age
    41
    Posts
    74

    Re: Random Dudes

    *BUMP*

    I think this is a great topic... It must be the title that is confusing people. I can't believe more aren't posting to comment on it. We'll try one more time, I guess. hehe

    Bomber

  8.  
  9. #5

    |SOG| Vir2L's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Lake Tahoe, CA.
    Age
    35
    Posts
    833

    Re: Random Dudes

    so boundaries are still a factor.
    my interpretation of Drona's post...................
    Vir-Chew-All!!

    "I'm blind to you.... haters! Can't touch me, war instigators!" - Collie Buddz
    "I really was about to call a whaaaaambulance! Less whining, more winning!" - Vir2L

  10.  
  11. #6


    birdie_in_Texas's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    TEXAS..!
    Age
    42
    Posts
    4,783
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Random Dudes

    Quote Originally Posted by |SOG| Vir2L View Post
    so boundaries are still a factor.
    my interpretation of Drona's post...................

    OMG..here we go again...

  12.  

     
  13. #7

    Jack Bauer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Fort Myers, Florida
    Age
    30
    Posts
    3,647

    Re: Random Dudes

    there are no boundaries people..... there is only the objective to guard against. now if you feel that your to far away from the objective...that means you probably are!!!!

    you guys have to start changing your mindset.....OBJECTIVE is your task, yes the more forward you are the more your going to get kills but that isnt the objective....the objective is to guard the bomb sites.....if you would like i can meet with people on TS to have a town hall meeting to explain for those who, for some reason still do not get it






    Arma Irregular Platoon Information
    ArmA Platoon Code Irregular Applications
    TacticalGamer Arma Pathfinder - Callsign Spartan 14
    "...The scab is a traitor to his IHS, his fellow gamers, and his community....." ~ Jack London, Amended by ME!
    "TG was created to cater to a VERY specific type of gamer rather than trying to appeal to the greater gaming population....Tactical Gamer is not mainstream. We are not trying to attract mainstream gamers" ~ Apophis

  14.  
  15. #8

    Pistolfied's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Milky Way Galaxy
    Posts
    939

    Re: Random Dudes

    Personally I believe there is still boundary lines and I'll explain why.

    I've been told by admins (not sure who) that on broadcast I am not allowed to defend A (the bombsite in the house) from the red crates looking at the exit door from the main building. I don't see how you can say there isn't boundaries when I'm defending a specific objective and aren't allowed in that spot. The door is an immediate choke point from the bombsite as well so I can't see whats wrong with it. I've seen my fair share of admin corruption regarding being too far up as well although I don't have screenshots of it since I typically let is slide as I know if I report it nothing will be done about it.

    I also don't understand why flanking maneuvers aren't allowed by the defence. They are for eliminating hostile threats to the bombsite, not for getting a bunch of kills. A flank through an enemy spawn however is just absurd, a flank from the nearest route is more of how it should be executed. Ambush is probably the only map I've seen where flanking is allowed and it's the easiest as well as the flanking paths are quite obvious.

    I'll still follow the servers rules and "non-existent" boundary lines but I feel this is something which needed to be brought up again. It really ticks me off when an admin says boundaries don't exist but later says something along the lines of a position being too far up. In some cases I don't mind them saying a spot is too far up because it blatantly is too far up to be defending any bombsite. If you can see a bombsite or an entrance to it the spot should be fine imo (as long as you are actually watching those points at least half of the time).

    Damnit Blizzard, fix ZvT already >.<
    In Soviet Russian, Arma admins are nice to you!

  16.  
  17. #9

    Hawk201's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Charleston SC
    Posts
    176

    Re: Random Dudes

    There are no more boundaries. The lines that were drawn on the maps were references that said you can't go past this because you are now not defending the bombsites or chokepoints. Then when the boundaries were dropped you still couldn't move past these "lines."

    The reason those lines don't exist anymore is because the bombsites have been moved because of the mod that is in place. Many maps are reversed (defense spawns on old offensive side etc....). So if you follow the old lines that were drawn you will be surely confused. So lines don't exist. And as far as the hunting thing goes I am always being alert whenever I play now and never expect a "safe zone."

    So boundaries are gone lets drop that subject now.
    "Semper paratus, Semper fidelis, Semper validus, Insquequo mortalitas."

    "Incoming fire has the right of way."

    "Don't die......it's not healthy."

    *Ss*Hawk


  18.  

     
  19. #10

    |SOG| Vir2L's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Lake Tahoe, CA.
    Age
    35
    Posts
    833

    Re: Random Dudes

    You guys sure do make it seem like I'm purposely trying to be a pain in the ass.

    I just want a clear picture of what some of you are saying.

    THAT IS ALL!

    carry on...... see you ingame soon........... headless (esp birdie).
    Vir-Chew-All!!

    "I'm blind to you.... haters! Can't touch me, war instigators!" - Collie Buddz
    "I really was about to call a whaaaaambulance! Less whining, more winning!" - Vir2L

  20.  
  21. #11


    birdie_in_Texas's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    TEXAS..!
    Age
    42
    Posts
    4,783
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Random Dudes

    Quote Originally Posted by Snake_Doc View Post
    if you would like i can meet with people on TS to have a town hall meeting to explain for those who, for some reason still do not get it
    You are a good man Jack..but there are those that "cannot" get it, because they do not "WANT" to get it, hence this never ending thread.

  22.  
  23. #12


    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    50

    Re: Random Dudes

    I guess my main concern/confusion is the way in which spots are considered dangerous and not following the rules of protecting the bombsite. I am a sniper....... And NO i'm not a soldier carrying a sniper rifle. Everything I do, act upon and otherwise think about is the angle and approach from a snipers perspective. The spots and places I snipe from are generally more dangerous and obvious to the enemy team because of the game we are playing, hence the reason of a higher location.

    I'm not great at explaining this but I believe some of the spots should be re-thought from this perspective. I know you panzies with overkill are going to screw this up cause you can't play without your automatic rifle, but for us, true snipers we can be very deadly from a higher position, but to defend ourselves is another story. Cramping us in a tight spot right next to the bombsite doesn't exactly play to any of our strengths for most maps and the term counter sniper becomes null and void in most defensive positions.

    If we eliminated overkill that would help, but since that won't happen i hope we can come to some kind of even ground on the issue.

  24.  

     
  25. #13


    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Age
    41
    Posts
    74

    Re: Random Dudes

    Moses, used to play the "true sniper" role on server 1, but it seemed like all I was hurting was myself. Most everybody else who runs a sniper kit uses Overkill, so why should I limit myself. You can make comments like "noob" and "true" but at the end of the day, as long as the rules and server load out is uniform, everybody has the same advantages/disadvantages. Whether you choose to use them or not is purely a personal decision, but criticizing or making fun of others who don't play your way I think won't get the point across any better. I understand what you are saying but unless the server rules/load outs changed to limit everybody, I don't think this part of Server 1 is going to change.

    This is what, at least I think, Server 2 is for; but I am just guessing.

    Bomber

  26.  
  27. #14

    Balfa's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Texas, Ireland
    Age
    31
    Posts
    1,273

    Re: Random Dudes

    Quote Originally Posted by 82ndID-Bomber View Post
    This is what, at least I think, Server 2 is for; but I am just guessing.
    Good point. Anyone up for a game on 2?

    I just thought I'd give my point of view, even though I'm a noob and my comments don't carry any weight.

    If you say the defenders have to defend a bombsite and its immediate chokepoints, and can get kicked for repeatedly being somewhere other than inside the immediate chokepoints, then the immediate chokepoints are the boundaries of the defending team. There may not be any green lines drawn on maps anywhere, but if you think that's not boundaries, you're fooling yourself.

    Now, as for whether the existence of boundaries or current location of particular boundaries is a good or bad thing, I don't currently feel the need to comment on. I enjoy playing on server 1 more than most servers out there, so if you continue doing what you're doing, that's good for me. If lots of people speak out about the way things are and if change is implemented, I may end up appreciating or disliking that change, but I'll probably still enjoy playing here more than elsewhere. It's the slow pace, communication and teamwork that draw me, and I don't think that will ever significantly change here, so keep up the good work and let's play.

    ...preferably on server 2

  28.  
  29. #15


    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    50

    Re: Random Dudes

    maybe i should reorganize my paragraph, cause usually the most important point is displayed at the top of an article and the supporting arguments on the bottom, but all anyone takes away from my posts are the overkill statement.

    I'm just poking at the dead horse on the over kill, argument. I know it won't change and i believe i state that, but it was a supporting fact to the train of thought of how I perceive things and how people who just use overkill with a sniper kit for the guille suit or for a way to see long range. Maybe i'll stop with the overkill stuff because you just see it as a rant, but then again, i have a really dry sense of humor and it makes me laugh but whatever. Re read my post without the over kill comment and you might get what i'm saying.

  30.  

     

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts


  
 

Back to top