Tie-breaker

**Balfa** · 04-08-2009, 02:08 AM

I feel like all too many times, the defense holds tight each round for the whole map, and the match goes to whichever team gets randomly assigned defense on the tie-breaker.

I'm happy with maps and bombsites being defender-friendly. That's realistic. But if there was something we could do with the format to make it fairer than the toss of a coin, that would be cool.

I don't know what sort of power openwarfare gives you, but if we could require a team to win by two points, that'd be a lot fairer. Then an attacking team that breaks the defense one round will have the advantage, like breaking a serve in tennis.

Or if that's not possible, is there some other way to change the game format to make it fairer?

Also, re-adding TKing clays will soften some of the favour towards the defenders

**Bubba** · 04-08-2009, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Balfa

I don't know what sort of power openwarfare gives you, but if we could require a team to win by two points, that'd be a lot fairer. Then an attacking team that breaks the defense one round will have the advantage, like breaking a serve in tennis.

That would be a good idea if it can be worked in. I'll look at the config.

Originally Posted by Balfa

Also, re-adding TKing clays will soften some of the favour towards the defenders

Man I love friendly clay killing. Keeps you on your toes.

**P.Drona** · 04-08-2009, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by Balfa

but if we could require a team to win by two points, that'd be a lot fairer.

That could take all night, if you think about it. Some of the maps already take forever to finish. I'd worry about the tie breaker more if I wasn't seeing 4-0, 4-1 and 4-2 rounds frequently.

This is a skill/teamwork issue not a setting issue, IMO. The coin toss is inherently fair by it's nature.

Does Defense have a distinct advantage? Yes and no. They typically get set up and in place before an assault begins but that also fixes them into a relatively small area of operations with limited routes of movement whilke the attackers have freedom to roam and probe. The defensive force is also typically split between the two objectives while the attackers can maintain full strength and present it where they choose.

**BlindGamer** · 04-08-2009, 07:03 PM

If we do have friendly clays, then there should be the clay icon worked back in. Because then even if you have bomb squad you wouldnt know where the clays are at unless eveyone says exactly where they put it, which can be like 10 clays per team.

**Jack Bauer** · 04-08-2009, 08:52 PM

Originally Posted by BlindGamer

If we do have friendly clays, then there should be the clay icon worked back in. Because then even if you have bomb squad you wouldnt know where the clays are at unless eveyone says exactly where they put it, which can be like 10 clays per team.

would that not take away from the realitsc stand point?? i dont understand how hard it is to say... "im claying bombsite A"

as a defender that means i should be placing clays as close to the chokepoints in the bombsite as i can, or even on the bomb site itself, this enables not only a warning system but a last ditch effort to delay the planting of the bomb while renforcements arrive. It also allows me to enalrge my defensive piremiter to an extint also that can aid in the heavier defense of a bomb site. IT ALSO means STAY OUT OF THE BOMB SITE. i thought the reason for taking clases through TGU is to learn to set up shop and defend a posistion, not romaing all over the map. if you stayed in one spot you wouldnt have to worry running into clays, maybe it is the way i play but i dont seem to have a problem with friendly clays unless someone does use coms.

the truning on of friendly clays will help in the placement of clays too, no more majical placement then walking infront of the clay with no consequences

**BlindGamer** · 04-09-2009, 10:02 AM

No snake, what im saying is that say 5 people with clays all want to plant theirs, they all have to wait till everyone else has planted theirs so they know that no one late will randomly run up behind them not knowing it was their. Also, 5 messages saying, "I'm claying A, and 5 messages "I'm claying B", isnt exactly going to help you.

Lets say for example you're at B, all the guys at A are dead, you need to go over to reinforce, you know that there are 5 clays on B that you need to get around. Even if you have bombsquad, then your friendly clays wont show up with a sign, and so your just gonna have to jump out a window or something to get to A, which makes a noise and you're comprimised.

Lets say your attacking, you have the bomb planted, your watching one of the exits, the other person goes down on the opposite exit but you have clays on the bomb, you dont know they're there and caboom.

Or, in the classic scenario, someone gets to a bombsite first, clays up and then a late runner gets blown to smitherins.

**Balfa** · 04-09-2009, 12:42 PM

Is it possible with OpenWarfare to have bombsquad show friendly clays as well?

**P.Drona** · 04-09-2009, 01:02 PM

Let's assume for the sake of argument that the claymores in the game have an IFF capability that's tied into the same tech that allows you to see your team mates on the ESC map. Let's also assume that they can't project a 3d image above themselves that only friendlies can see.

In the defuse scenario, the defenders won't know which clays on the site are friend or foe and have to pop them all, just like if the clays were FF on. They could also choose to risk it, I suppose, and just walk in.

I think it ends up being a decent compromise between hardcore realism and keeping the game moving and accessible to less experienced players.

**Cap** · 04-09-2009, 01:34 PM

I think clays should kill everyone, thats how they would work, also it really promotes team comms IMO, with big penalties for not communicating

I dug having them, even when I was killed by friendly clays...

my .2 cents

**Mediator** · 04-09-2009, 03:08 PM

Claymores should kill everyone IMO.

As for the intent of Balfa's original statement/question - I think it's fine the way it is. I too have seen the rounds go 4-2 or 4-0 or 4-1. We have a long timer on our server and as such we just need to take our time.

**Balfa** · 04-09-2009, 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by P.Drona

I think it ends up being a decent compromise between hardcore realism and keeping the game moving and accessible to less experienced players.

I understand your thinking, but when I was a "less experienced" player, and first hopped on server 2 last summer with the TRM mod, and couldn't see silly red lines sticking out of claymores and got killed by friendly ones, I absolutely loved it. That's a huge part of what made me come back and become a part of the community.

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