Re: not as busy as it was

**Sean |TG|** · 05-04-2009, 08:14 PM

well size u said The main reason we don't have a whole lot of admins doing work right now is because there's no new people showing up on the servers. Or, very little anyways.

i think when people are scrolling down the server list looking at the servers and they see Tacticalgamer.com with 3-4 people on they think "hmmm tactical huh" i will give that a try ... so they double click on server to join... and all of a sudden they have to download.. i dont think they would want to do that they will problely press control alt delete.. they just want to have a regular tactical game.... thats why i think we should remove the mod from server 1 and use it more regularly.

Be careful what you wish for. im not wishing for anything im speaking my mind... i just want to put that out there i just want to get other peoples thought on this.

**Wookiie** · 05-04-2009, 09:12 PM

Just remember the game is aging a bit now and people are trying new things, new games always lead to less people playing I still love COD4 and always play when I'm not away with work but people move on to the new stuff so I think that is part of the problem.But you've got the hard job here Drona so I'll support whatever you do (you can't please all the people all the time)

**FireStrike** · 05-05-2009, 02:02 AM

i think i've been here long enough to say some thing decent so here it goes. i do agree with Sean on his last comment. when people see a new map listed and the word tactical they think mod and with that comes the thought "different". so now they know that things are set to be tactical so considering that the number of RnG players has increased. they back away. i think that server 1 going back to vanilla maps is there for us to generate more people. but now i remember last summer when i first joined and got kicked to open rood for a paying member. when i finally got on, out of 12 people on a team 5 died and in no time only 7 were left. so with the vanilla, RnG will again come back. right now 9/10 rounds people pick up the bomb and make a plan, back then it was A or B and there goes half the team. As far as i see in TG, RnG is not a goal and is to be avoided as much as possible. overall right now when we get 14 people 7vs7 the game runs very well with coms and all. it was only two days ago that we were actually belly crawling half of "over grown". i personally never thought that this could be possible.

in my last words, if we want more people, then we want vanilla.
if we want TG with more people, we want vanilla and all of the people at TG right now to help set an example for the new ones. THIS WILL TAKE TIME AND WORK.

**Jetheren** · 05-05-2009, 04:30 AM

Well said FireStrike. I'm not a regular on the CoD4 servers, but I play on them occasionally and I like to check in on the forum from time to time.

As a player who played on Server 1 before the mod was added and after, I have to say that personally I preferred the vanilla version. Mainly because 1) I have never been too fond of mods to begin with and 2) the OWM for some reason just didn't sell me.

I think it should be one of Tactical Gamer's objectives to show others how we play. The only way that is going to happen is for people to be playing on our servers. As others have said and I agree 100% when players see a server and realize they have to download a mod to play on it, more often than not they are going to move on to another server. Many of those players would probably make great TG members.

Obviously there is a chance of increased Run and Gun if the server is reverted back to vanilla state, but as FireStrike said it is the job of us TGers to show newcomers how we play (paraphrase). That means we have to pick up the bomb and start laying out the plans. Anyway that is my two cents. I'll go wherever the admins take me.

**Superfast** · 05-05-2009, 04:45 AM

Like wookie said, the game is aging so interest is going down a bit probably. Making one server vanilla s&d to bring in more people seems like something to try. While keeping the other server modded.

In the past we had server 1 populated and someone said "Let's go to server 2" and woosh it was populated too.

So that might work.

Also some theme-nights with certain maps, pre-announced COD4 nights where we start from a certain time, scrims and tournaments even will maybe create more activity. Anyone can start something, it's just making a thread here and say let's get together then and play! We got a pretty big player-base still so it's really all about talking together and getting together sometime at the server.

There are no sure things here, we just have to try stuff out to see what works for us.

**Hawk201** · 05-05-2009, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by Wookiie

Just remember the game is aging a bit now and people are trying new things, new games always lead to less people playing I still love COD4 and always play when I'm not away with work but people move on to the new stuff so I think that is part of the problem.But you've got the hard job here Drona so I'll support whatever you do (you can't please all the people all the time)

good point but i still see many people still playing cod2 and i even went on halo 1 and saw people running around cod4 is a great game and i will continue to play for a while. sure it will get old and outdated. i used to play halo and cod2 all the time i dont much more. lol just look at codwaw i havent played tht in forever. but still good point...

As far as the server 1 goes.....i think we might want to change it back or have another one at least....but if we make a third regular S&D plus the other two then will we ever play on it.... I mean I usually jump to the server that is populated like if server 2 has 8 guys and server 1 has 1 person in it i will jump to server 2. my point is...is that will people get on the regular server if we either make a new one or change server 1......if its populated i will play on it but i just wanna point that out.......the only problem i have we new guys coming in on the server is that they dont like the rules or hate this style of play.....they would rather run around with their rpd martydom...etc....etc... just spraying down everyone. I would have to disagree with that 90% being run and gun more like 98% are run and gun.....my kits dont work on these pub servers cause whats the point of claymores or bombsquad when I am forced to run around killing everyone in my path.

I would love to see new people join TG and im all for it....but two things to consider..... 1) will we have enough admin support to warn kick and ban people who dont follow basic tactical guidelines.....and 2) will the server be populated

**PaintScratcher** · 05-05-2009, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by Superfast

Like wookie said, the game is aging so interest is going down a bit probably. Making one server vanilla s&d to bring in more people seems like something to try. While keeping the other server modded.

In the past we had server 1 populated and someone said "Let's go to server 2" and woosh it was populated too.

So that might work.

Also some theme-nights with certain maps, pre-announced COD4 nights where we start from a certain time, scrims and tournaments even will maybe create more activity. Anyone can start something, it's just making a thread here and say let's get together then and play! We got a pretty big player-base still so it's really all about talking together and getting together sometime at the server.

There are no sure things here, we just have to try stuff out to see what works for us.

That sounds like a good idea. Being able to concentrate all the players into different events could be all we need to seed the servers. If we can get people on the servers in the first place and they like it they will come back.
Project Reality for example, every night we get lots of non-TGers that come and play. The other day when the server went a bit mad and all the TG regulars had migrated to another server there were still some non-TGers still trying to play the TG way through the horrible lag.

If we can kick start the COD4 servers by having regular events on vanilla we can create a stream of regular players who like to play tactically, then we can introduce them to the modded server.

This would mean that we would have to have a TG presence on the servers, with admins or at the very least a kick vote system so anyone can help deal with trouble makers.

**Jack Bauer** · 05-05-2009, 03:33 PM

i understand where everyone is coming from. how they want new blood in the servers and that they want to have a vanilla server. but is that what TG is about?? RnG with no thought process at all?

I'm all in favor of having server 1 a vanilla server to get more people in, but i will tell you one thing, you will not get the teamwork you do with server two nor will you get the respect that you get on server 2. can not people see our server when they search or refresh new servers?

from my short time here in the COD4 forums and playing the game, i find that this community has a bunch of finicky girls that play. you want stuff one way but then you guys bitch and want it a different a way?? Maybe I'm just old school in my thoughts but when i first came to TG it was b/c it was TACTICAL GAMING, not RnG with some coms or Rushing all the time, i came here b/c this community is about using your head before running around like a child shooting crap. i found this place THROUGH a modded server

can someone please explain to me what the fascination is with the stock maps?? is it b/c it requires no thinking to play?? is it b/c you as a player can only handle one way into a site and one way out?? is it b/c with the custom maps you actually have to play TG??

Please someone explain this fascination with vanilla stock maps and game play?? I know that we need to get some new blood in, but why with all the leaps and bounds that we have done with the second server do we want to roll everything up and go back to public play??

**PaintScratcher** · 05-05-2009, 04:14 PM

I can see your point and by no means do we want to return to a RnG style play. As has been mentioned before TG is about education as well as playing tactically.

I think the general gist of what people are saying is that we keep server 2 modded and to revert back to vanilla for server 1. We would still have all the rules in place that stop people playing in a completely non-TG way, but at the same time we would be introducing people to our style on a server that doesn't drive people who don't like downloading mods away.

There's no doubt that there are more people that play the vanilla game than modded. It's not that we don't like the custom maps or that we prefer the stock maps but the whole point of this thread is to try and re-kindle the servers.

If we have the choice of modded or stock then we will bring new players in while still having the option of a more tactical experience for the TG regulars.

**Bloodclot** · 05-05-2009, 04:45 PM

I really believe the reason that people are scared to play on Server 2 is unfamiliarity of the maps. I know it intimidated me at first, especially when I was playing with/against players that already knew the maps well. Instead of thinking of how you're about to get owned because you don't know where anything is, think of all the time you'll get to spectate!

You'll get a feel for the maps and see everyone's favorite spots.
I also would like to thank and give props to the guys who've been showing up in Server 2 and weren't familiar with the maps but stuck with it for a couple hours, that takes some maturity and you guys are very appreciated, at least from me.

**Balfa** · 05-05-2009, 05:53 PM

Well you know I'm all for pushing the realism envelope with my constant requests for TKing clays and lack of map friendlies. I'd find it difficult to go back to stock bombsites on server 1 unless someone strongly reassured me that it's for recruiting purposes for the long-term good of our community.

I've said it before, but when I first played TRM (and didn't even know about the escape map), the sense of being totally lost to the extent of not even knowing where the bomb was when I was the last man left on the team (probably to the annoyance of my dead teammates) was really exhilarating. I had no choice but to stick with the bomb carrier and keep communication open and eyes on him at all times, just in case. That's what I'd ideally like from TG CoD4. As for what I can realistically get, given human nature, I dunno.

I know none of this is really helpful, but one thing I can suggest is to treat new players a bit more like new players. There was a time when someone (can't remember who, but I know it's someone I really highly respect) was suggesting (with a sincere intent to be helpful and friendly) to a newbie who'd be on for just one round that the best thing he could do was to visit these forums and read up on the stickies and stuff. That sounds a bit overwhelming to a newbie. There's nothing wrong with playing here for a week or more before ever visiting the forums. You learn more from doing than from reading.

**Balfa** · 05-05-2009, 06:00 PM

Oh, one other thing I wanted to suggest. We don't necessarily have to recruit people from the RnG domain. Could we plan some events and advertise them on other TG forums? Maybe we can steal some PR players. Their servers are always overloaded anyway, they don't need all those players!

**LpBronco** · 05-05-2009, 06:05 PM

I have to admit when the CM's were going strong that I posted in the IHS forums and it was fun when we had , I think, 5 houses represented at one time.

**P.Drona** · 05-05-2009, 07:04 PM

I really appreciate everyone taking the time to respond. All the answers have been very supportive and I love the solid defense of our basic principles.

At this point, there is zero to lose from putting Server 1 back to stock hardcore S&D. It goes virtually unused and there's no real reason to have 2 modded servers if we can all live with/tolerate the Server 2 setup for the custom maps.

Several folks have mentioned the need for TG folks to step up and set an example if we go vanilla on S1. The need for player vote kick access and admin support will also be key in order to keep things up to our standards. If we need to add a couple of more admins we will - anyone that is interested in specifically supporting the vanilla version as an admin should PM me(SM required). In addition, we won't be able to have the server rules displayed when people join but we can set up a message scroll through our admin tools. I also suggest everyone reread Nice Day's post about being kind to the new guy.

Going the vanilla route on S1 gives us the opportunity to attract larger numbers of players to a TG server. Quantity does not equal quality though. So, as folks have said, it will be a bit of a chore on occasion as new folks are introduced to our tactical, teamwork oriented game play. Once some folks get a taste, it's all they want.

It's been mentioned that this title is aging and it's very true. Come November, we will have Modern Warfare 2 and more likely than not we will be going to one CoD4 server only after that and it will most likely be modded. We could kill S1 entirely right now or we can use it till we lose it and recruit some new blood into the TG fold.

You can probably tell which way I'm leaning here on the S1 settings but let's keep the discussion open for another day or two in case others have thoughts to share. Once again, thanks to everyone for your continued support of our community and your willingness to pitch in.

**Superfast** · 05-06-2009, 05:48 AM

I would also like to say that even though i really enjoy server 2 with you guys with all the new cool maps, a vanilla server is still fun to me too every now. I'm not a COD4 vet so i haven't played vanilla to death like some of you have.

And i also believe others here too can enjoy vanilla play still. We also have people coming over from other TG games and a vanilla server serves as a nice intro to both them and new-comers just randomly hopping on our server discovering amazing TG talking teamwork.

But like you guys say, it will take hard admin work and simple rules like guard your objectives-kind to maybe get vanilla server success.

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