New Pitboss Game Discussion (Jun 30/09)

**Bernout** · 07-01-2009, 02:04 AM

With TTT wrapping up, it's time to start thinking about the next game. I'm going to be gone for the next 11 days here but I figured I'd create this discussion topic to get things started.

One of the ideas I was pondering was to host a game that is geared more towards beginners. While I understand this would likely rule out most of the regulars (who are veteran players), I think it's worthwhile thinking about just to try to get more people playing the game. Along a related line of thinking we could perhaps pair people up with the veterans if someone was willing and wanted to learn. Obviously this whole concept depends on getting enough beginning to intermediate skill level players to make a go of it. We'd also have to come up with some better guidelines to help people determine where their skill level is at.

In addition to discussing the above, feel free of course to toss around whatever other ideas you like.

Bernout

oyzar · 07-01-2009, 02:54 PM

It is hard to find a lot of beging level players, however people are of varying skill level. I am sure something can be worked ot to pair the weaker players with the stronger players even if there aren't that many "new" players (civ is starting to get a bit old after all). One important thing you pointed out in TTT though is that it is important that one of the players doesn't end up playing one civ alone. Best would be if people had good communication between them, as such setting people up with similar timezones (or similar schedules, I am sure that Niklas could go just fine with a new yorker for example) would be preferable. What level people play at in SP can give a bit of indication, however some people play far more MP than SP (for example I have hardly played SP since warlords, though I am fairly certain I can at least beat immortal consistently). Together with this people can post how much they have played SP and how they feel their SP level correlate to their MP level. Given that most people are more than likely going to be known quantities, it is likely that setting up proper teams is not going to be too difficult imo.

da_Vinci · 07-01-2009, 05:13 PM

A game geared toward beginners ...

Beginners at Civ, or beginners at PitBoss?

And I would assume not defined by time since first game, but by level of accomplishment. So assuming you mean a particular Civ skill level ...

You might exclude anyone who has ever beaten monarch in SP, for example (or pick you level).

Or exclude anyone who wins more than half the time at monarch in SP (or again, pick a level).

Now, since war is so crucial in PitBoss, maybe need some sense of military skills? Harder to assess.

Who is the target population for such a game? Are you trying to entice other TG members to try Civ? Or are you trying to entice SP Civ players to try PitBoss?

For the latter, the CFC GOTM forum (game of the month) has a lot of players reading it who might meet your "developing player" category ... so that might be a place to market something of that sort.

Bernout, when you say pair people up, do you mean have a team game (civs in teams)? Or are you thinking of combining pitboss with the succession game concept?

The latter would have appeal to me, as one limitation I am finding with PitBoss is turn order issues during war, intersecting with my rather fixed play windows in a weekday. Having two people playing one civ, with an honor code that each plays half the turns on average over say one months time, would make keeping to turn order easier, provide automatic coverage for vacations etc, and be a great way to have a training camp for beginners while still letting the wise old veterans be involved.

We could call the concept PitSuc ...

dV

oyzar · 07-01-2009, 07:25 PM

Such a format already exist in the multi team diplo games, though having teams of 2 players would be a very specific case of this...

Morgan · 07-03-2009, 01:39 PM

I'd be interested.

blibblob · 07-03-2009, 04:05 PM

As would I actually. I've been playing Civ games since the first but never played any multiplayer and never really put forth the time to get really good at the game either. Though do you guys play with just Civ IV or with the expansions as well since I might have to pick those up if you do it with those.

ChrisFromLux · 07-03-2009, 05:40 PM

Well, the last games have all been played with the BTS-expansion!

I guess/hope the next game will also be played in BTS ... I would certainly not play Vanilla or Warlords!

Ronnie1 · 07-03-2009, 09:28 PM

I'll play anything of course!!!

A couple ideas....

Either run 2 games, 1 for beginners and 1 for the more experienced.

Another possibility is a game with larger teams. 3-4 players per team with the beginners scattered in. This might allow for more flexibility when 1 of the players is absent for what ever reason. Time zone consistent teams would be preferable.

If we could find a map maker that could ensure the map is at least a bit balanced, that would be preferable to me. This is just my opinion, but the TTT game was flawed from the beginning because some teams got totally hosed with the split starts, and some of the starting areas were just far superior to others.

Morgan · 07-05-2009, 07:06 AM

How about mixed ability & same timezone teams on a Hemispheres map? Or is that too much of a team based setup?

Raskolnikov · 07-06-2009, 12:12 PM

Hi guys, I am new to pitboss gaming and would be interested in playing in a team as the rookie... I've talked with Rusten, and we'd like to play together if it's the format used (veteran/rookie)...

PS: I am RRRaskolnikov on cfc if you didn't guessed

oyzar · 07-06-2009, 03:11 PM

You a rookie? O_o Sure you haven't played much mp but i am sure that you can handle yourself as well if not better than other players

.

Niklas · 07-06-2009, 05:38 PM

Hahahahaha, that's too funny Ras!

I'm unlikely to sign up for another game at this time, as I anticipate some rough times ahead RL-time-wise, so I'll have to use what time I have on the games I already play in.

Ebenezer · 07-07-2009, 01:53 AM

Think I'm going to sit one out as well. I'm in 9 pitboss games already.

Hoplosternum · 07-07-2009, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie1

If we could find a map maker that could ensure the map is at least a bit balanced, that would be preferable to me. This is just my opinion, but the TTT game was flawed from the beginning because some teams got totally hosed with the split starts, and some of the starting areas were just far superior to others.

Yes! The map shapes the game

One of the problems with this game is that by the time many of us could actually reach Oyzar (i.e. had Astronomy) it was far too late.

I know largely land based games have problems. Early rushing and such like. But at least the other players can gang up a little to stop the early leader(s).

Both this game and the one before have been hugely influenced by the map shape, and not in a good way.

While I don't especially like the tech trading. Tech alliances are so strong and the game pace too fast with it on. But I wish some thing could be done by the falling behind issues. When you combine unequal starts and unequal playing skill like here you get many players who are quickly reduced to 'playing the game' but not 'in the game' status.

It is a shame there is no way to stop tech trading of new advances for a certain number of turns. So that the advanced players can still get tech leads but weaker nations do not fall through the tech trap door like in this game.

Niklas · 07-07-2009, 01:43 PM

One thing that might be done to increase the rubberband effect is to increase the "knownciv" modifier on research. Currently this modifier is pretty small, capped at +30% if everyone you know has it. If that could be increased to e.g. 100% instead, it would be a lot harder to run away in tech. That might even be doable in the XML only, I'm not sure.