Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! - Page 2

Usarion · 03-08-2005, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grey

As a general rule of thumb people, when there is a new player on here you should assume the posibility they will rush as if it were any other public server. Take precautions against them, and make sure they understand the guidelines of PCS.

Word to the wise, a method I follow until the player has shown they understand what's going on.

There are many interesting "ideas" and points of view in this thread. Most of which I have never really thought about, but find intriguing indeed.

Yer Mom · 03-10-2005, 11:43 AM

Yesterday, I was playing Cbble and I rushed.

I went through b, luckily, the enemy team was not coming that way. If they were, I would've been killed easily, but my team knew were I was so it would've been okay. The enemy team was moving through the courtyard. I moved through the hallways to b and was coming out the door to the courtyard, not towards T spawn. I instantly saw the bomber and half of the rest of the team splitting. I reported to my team that the bomb was going side hall and a distraction team was going through middle. Someone came up behind me headed to b, and killed me, but before he did I relayed the information to my team that a single man distraction was moving towards b....

My team took up positions. I was one of a 7 man team. 2 people were at B and the rest covered side hall. The bomber was killed, the bomb fell along with the escorting team, and my team moved to defend the bomb. The one man distraction to B was killed and my team at b reverted to middle a and crossfired on the rest of the enemy team coming up through middle a.

We dominated... period.

Now, of course, it won't always go this well.

I was playing a little later, different map rotation, same map...

I moved to the sniper post and saw the bomber and the rest of the team moving to hard rush the side hall. Asch was one of the people there. I persued, going down the ladder up the middle ramp and coming up behind them. Asch was turning around, and the rest of his team was following, I suppose we had them held down.

I relayed what information I could to my team, and killed Asch accidentally.

He argued that I was hunting. I was beyond the set boundaries, but I was NOT hunting. I saw the bomb, and I went after it. My team knew where I was, and they knew when I died that the bomb was moving backwards. I do believe that my team moved forward in the side hall after I got their attention in the back and captured the bomb.

This, is tactical play. I think atleast...

Feedback please...

-Mom

**Wyzcrak** · 03-10-2005, 12:21 PM

You weren't hunting.

You were communicating with your team.

You were playing the objective.

The argument against your actions doesn't impress me IF the above (and other similar accolades I'm probably overlooking) are true and the argument's only sticking point is your location on the map.

**Tempus** · 03-10-2005, 12:37 PM

What would be the difference between that and running to the same sniper window, looking out, seeing the bomb coming your way, and then calling the whole team from the other bombsite and having them circle around and flank?

There is no difference, but that would be almost deathmatching. The Ts would have never gotten near the bombsite before being engaged by CTs.

How can we say that we want the offensive team to take its time and do something strategic when all that does is allow the defensive team time to come to them?

I know it's a fine line, but how can it be considered defending if you are moving AWAY from your objective to engage an enemy that is not moving toward you?

On every single map an an argument can be made for the defensive team to run forward to 'flank'. To me, that's just an excuse. Is it effective? Sure, it probably is. Is it tactical? I suppose so. But it's not objective-based. On most maps, the offensive team only has 2 or 3 paths to their objective. If they are not rushing, they can be flanked every time.

This whole argument goes in circles, but if we don't allow the offensive team to play their role and make sure the defensive team plays theirs, then we are just barely a step above a public server.

Yer Mom · 03-10-2005, 01:11 PM

The difference is the single person. If a single person is flanking, then the problem is invalid.

There is no problem. If the entire defensive team leaves their objective to go and flank, there is a problem. I don't play for kills, nor for rushing, nor for deathmatching. I play recon or defense. If one person is doing recon towards the middle of the map, or rushing as some would call it, then I don't see the problem. It gets the team ready to intercept the bomb. I think our biggest problem is on de_ maps... as far as rushing goes.

You can't really recon as defensive team on maps such as office or havana...

I think we need a new play style, or a map change. Better bomb sites, more bomb sites, more paths, more etc etc etc etc....

But, untill we get those, I will recon sparingly...

-Mom

**RandomGuy** · 03-10-2005, 04:06 PM

Quote:

On every single map an an argument can be made for the defensive team to run forward to 'flank'. To me, that's just an excuse. Is it effective? Sure, it probably is.

I don't think flanking up the hallway past site B on cbble is effective at all. Once you leave site B and enter that inside hallway area a hidden T could get you from many different angles. I think its suicidal and doesn't help complete the objective. If it works, like it did for yer mom in this case, sure, it helps complete the objective.

BUT: you have to consider your odds. The risk vs reward of going into that hallway makes it always a bad move by my estimates. The odds of helping your team complete the objective are better if you don't go there (barring rare circumstances).

**asch** · 03-10-2005, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yer Mom

He argued that I was hunting. I was beyond the set boundaries, but I was NOT hunting. I saw the bomb, and I went after it. My team knew where I was, and they knew when I died that the bomb was moving backwards. I do believe that my team moved forward in the side hall after I got their attention in the back and captured the bomb.

After this incident, I did send a @psay to Mom stating that I thought his actions were close to hunting. There was no argument. I asked if he knew the bomb location and communicated with his team. When he confirmed that he had, I had no problem with what had happened. I don't know where he came from, other than he had appeared at the entrance to the long hall (A) from the T spawn side.

If a player is in the sniper/recon position near A and spots the bomb moving into the long hall of A, hopefully he has relayed that information to his team. He now has a couple of options. a) Stay up there and shoot at passer-bys. b) Go down the ladder and back towards A and help bottleneck the Ts in the hall. Or c) Go down the ladder and come up behind the Ts in the hallway.

Does option C constitute rushing / hunting? IMO, in this case it does not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yer Mom

Yesterday, I was playing Cbble and I rushed.

I went through b, luckily, the enemy team was not coming that way. If they were, I would've been killed easily, but my team knew were I was so it would've been okay.

Now, as to the this situation, IMO I don't believe the T should be running through the hall as a recon. If the plan is to head towards the courtyard, he runs right past the T spawn entrance. A little close for my comfort. And just because your team knows where you are at, does not necessarily make it ok. If you were in the B hallway near the entrance to the T spawn & the courtyard and you die, your team knows nothing other than that you just died. The Ts could move in either direction and the rest of the CTs are no better off. In fact, they are a player down.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yer Mom

I saw the bomb, and I went after it.

The objective of the CTs is to protect the bombsite, not chase the bomb. In Mom's particular case with catching me in the long hall (A), it wasn't a problem. But the point I want to make is just because a CT sees the bomb (still being carried that is), does not mean the CT should abandon his objective of protecting the bomb site.

I don't want to get into the argument that killing the bomb holder is protecting the site... and that killing all of the Ts is protecting the site. That will lead us back to being a deathmatch server.

**Tempus** · 03-10-2005, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asch

I don't want to get into the argument that killing the bomb holder is protecting the site... and that killing all of the Ts is protecting the site. That will lead us back to being a deathmatch server.

Asch FTW!!!

Yer Mom · 03-11-2005, 08:39 AM

I was a bit blunt with that, Asch, but I didn't mean to strike at you with my post if you took it that way. I was building an example, and I apologize if I came off as striking at you.

I dunno, I love the way we play, but sometimes I just get antsie. I don't do it much, but every once in a blue moon it's always fun to surprise the enemy team and kill them all

heh

-Mom

octorfunk · 12-08-2006, 01:11 PM

I am new to the server, but I am already fed up with people whining about they got killed by someone crossing the "boundaries." If the boundaries are the only thing keep you alive in CS, then what does that say about your gameplay?

I even tested it one round. On Dust2 (playing as a T), I sat just outside of bombsite B, next to a cart, the entire round. No one bothered me, no one even came out the door. I could hear the CT's shuffling around just around the corner, but they would not cross that invisible boundary line for anything.
It would have been easy for me to simply wait for them to pass and then turn the corner and blow them away.

Personally, I think these so-called "boundaries" are creating a bunch of soft, whiny CS players. I snuck up behind a T sniper in the T spawn on the way to support my team in bombsite A on Dust2, and I knifed him. A) he was relying completely on the boundaries to watch his back, and B) he was using his "out-of-bounds" position to snipe at us from a safe distance. He got so mad when I knifed him from behind, he just wouldn't let it go, accusing me of kill-hunting.

Was I kill-hunting, or was this guys just relying too much on the boundaries to protect him while he sniped from an area that I wasn't supposed to be in?

Who is the better player? The one who understands the spirit of the boundary system and bends it when necessary to complete an objective, or the one who hides behind it and uses the boundaries as an excuse to not maintain any kind of rear security?

Atomic Dog · 12-08-2006, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by octorfunk

I am new to the server, but I am already fed up with people whining about they got killed by someone crossing the "boundaries." If the boundaries are the only thing keep you alive in CS, then what does that say about your gameplay?

I even tested it one round. On Dust2 (playing as a T), I sat just outside of bombsite B, next to a cart, the entire round. No one bothered me, no one even came out the door. I could hear the CT's shuffling around just around the corner, but they would not cross that invisible boundary line for anything.
It would have been easy for me to simply wait for them to pass and then turn the corner and blow them away.

Personally, I think these so-called "boundaries" are creating a bunch of soft, whiny CS players. I snuck up behind a T sniper in the T spawn on the way to support my team in bombsite A on Dust2, and I knifed him. A) he was relying completely on the boundaries to watch his back, and B) he was using his "out-of-bounds" position to snipe at us from a safe distance. He got so mad when I knifed him from behind, he just wouldn't let it go, accusing me of kill-hunting.

Was I kill-hunting, or was this guys just relying too much on the boundaries to protect him while he sniped from an area that I wasn't supposed to be in?

Who is the better player? The one who understands the spirit of the boundary system and bends it when necessary to complete an objective, or the one who hides behind it and uses the boundaries as an excuse to not maintain any kind of rear security?

Remember, you're still new here. Most of us don't recognize the boundaries for anyone but the newbies to TG. A lot of PCS see the boundaries rule as training wheels for those new to TG. Show us you can follow the basics and, trust me, you'll find a lot more tactical freedom.

In the meantime, do your best to refrain from belittling the other players here by calling them whiney or soft. You're already making a bad impression on me.

**CingularDuality** · 12-08-2006, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by octorfunk

I am new to the server, but I am already fed up with people whining about they got killed by someone crossing the "boundaries." If the boundaries are the only thing keep you alive in CS, then what does that say about your gameplay?

I even tested it one round. On Dust2 (playing as a T), I sat just outside of bombsite B, next to a cart, the entire round. No one bothered me, no one even came out the door. I could hear the CT's shuffling around just around the corner, but they would not cross that invisible boundary line for anything.
It would have been easy for me to simply wait for them to pass and then turn the corner and blow them away.

Personally, I think these so-called "boundaries" are creating a bunch of soft, whiny CS players. I snuck up behind a T sniper in the T spawn on the way to support my team in bombsite A on Dust2, and I knifed him. A) he was relying completely on the boundaries to watch his back, and B) he was using his "out-of-bounds" position to snipe at us from a safe distance. He got so mad when I knifed him from behind, he just wouldn't let it go, accusing me of kill-hunting.

Was I kill-hunting, or was this guys just relying too much on the boundaries to protect him while he sniped from an area that I wasn't supposed to be in?

Who is the better player? The one who understands the spirit of the boundary system and bends it when necessary to complete an objective, or the one who hides behind it and uses the boundaries as an excuse to not maintain any kind of rear security?

First off, TacticalGamer and the players that we want to attract don't care about who the better player is...

Other than that, in this specific situation, it certainly seems like you ran across a dumb sniper. Whether or not you were traveling through the T spawn for a good reason isn't clear, but I'll say that there are situations in which your actions would be fine, and situations in which they certainly would not be, according to PCS standards.

I started this thread when I was an admin, and it was not for the purpose of advocating mindless frag hunting. It was to point out that nobody should ever feel that there is a safe place anywhere on any map because of some artificial boundary that most PCS players recognize as the limit between offensive and defensive play.

The bottom line is that if players would just play their role, this whole "boundary" nonsense would go away...

Root · 12-08-2006, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CingularDuality

The bottom line is that if players would just play their role, this whole "boundary" nonsense would go away...

Everyone should read the above, as many times as it takes for them to comprehend it.

Greflin · 12-09-2006, 02:27 AM

There are much faster ways to support your team in A than through T spawn.

I.R. Hogan · 12-09-2006, 03:55 PM

The "boundries" as I percieve them are not for stopping rushers really but to prevent kill hunting. Just my 2 cents.. I could be wrong.. usually am.

03-10-2005, 11:43 AM	#17 (permalink)
Yer Mom Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: TN Age: 22 Posts: 789	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! Yesterday, I was playing Cbble and I rushed. I went through b, luckily, the enemy team was not coming that way. If they were, I would've been killed easily, but my team knew were I was so it would've been okay. The enemy team was moving through the courtyard. I moved through the hallways to b and was coming out the door to the courtyard, not towards T spawn. I instantly saw the bomber and half of the rest of the team splitting. I reported to my team that the bomb was going side hall and a distraction team was going through middle. Someone came up behind me headed to b, and killed me, but before he did I relayed the information to my team that a single man distraction was moving towards b.... My team took up positions. I was one of a 7 man team. 2 people were at B and the rest covered side hall. The bomber was killed, the bomb fell along with the escorting team, and my team moved to defend the bomb. The one man distraction to B was killed and my team at b reverted to middle a and crossfired on the rest of the enemy team coming up through middle a. We dominated... period. Now, of course, it won't always go this well. I was playing a little later, different map rotation, same map... I moved to the sniper post and saw the bomber and the rest of the team moving to hard rush the side hall. Asch was one of the people there. I persued, going down the ladder up the middle ramp and coming up behind them. Asch was turning around, and the rest of his team was following, I suppose we had them held down. I relayed what information I could to my team, and killed Asch accidentally. He argued that I was hunting. I was beyond the set boundaries, but I was NOT hunting. I saw the bomb, and I went after it. My team knew where I was, and they knew when I died that the bomb was moving backwards. I do believe that my team moved forward in the side hall after I got their attention in the back and captured the bomb. This, is tactical play. I think atleast... Feedback please... -Mom __________________ Yer Mom /O> To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

03-10-2005, 12:21 PM	#18 (permalink)
Wyzcrak Join Date: May 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 14,148	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! You weren't hunting. You were communicating with your team. You were playing the objective. The argument against your actions doesn't impress me IF the above (and other similar accolades I'm probably overlooking) are true and the argument's only sticking point is your location on the map. __________________ Steam Community? Add me. \| Join #tacticalgamer \| Search Results Legend \| New Posts Forum Filter \| Postbox Toggle \| Live Thread Review \| One Line Results \| Free Remote, Encrypted Backup Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Root: Welcome to TG. Feel free to punctuate your sentences correctly. Monkerz: Its gonna take all my skills to beat those boys off in the future.

03-10-2005, 12:37 PM	#19 (permalink)
Tempus Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, FL Age: 38 Posts: 8,234	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! What would be the difference between that and running to the same sniper window, looking out, seeing the bomb coming your way, and then calling the whole team from the other bombsite and having them circle around and flank? There is no difference, but that would be almost deathmatching. The Ts would have never gotten near the bombsite before being engaged by CTs. How can we say that we want the offensive team to take its time and do something strategic when all that does is allow the defensive team time to come to them? I know it's a fine line, but how can it be considered defending if you are moving AWAY from your objective to engage an enemy that is not moving toward you? On every single map an an argument can be made for the defensive team to run forward to 'flank'. To me, that's just an excuse. Is it effective? Sure, it probably is. Is it tactical? I suppose so. But it's not objective-based. On most maps, the offensive team only has 2 or 3 paths to their objective. If they are not rushing, they can be flanked every time. This whole argument goes in circles, but if we don't allow the offensive team to play their role and make sure the defensive team plays theirs, then we are just barely a step above a public server.

03-10-2005, 01:11 PM	#20 (permalink)
Yer Mom Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: TN Age: 22 Posts: 789	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! The difference is the single person. If a single person is flanking, then the problem is invalid. There is no problem. If the entire defensive team leaves their objective to go and flank, there is a problem. I don't play for kills, nor for rushing, nor for deathmatching. I play recon or defense. If one person is doing recon towards the middle of the map, or rushing as some would call it, then I don't see the problem. It gets the team ready to intercept the bomb. I think our biggest problem is on de_ maps... as far as rushing goes. You can't really recon as defensive team on maps such as office or havana... I think we need a new play style, or a map change. Better bomb sites, more bomb sites, more paths, more etc etc etc etc.... But, untill we get those, I will recon sparingly... -Mom __________________ Yer Mom /O> To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

03-11-2005, 08:39 AM	#24 (permalink)
Yer Mom Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: TN Age: 22 Posts: 789	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! I was a bit blunt with that, Asch, but I didn't mean to strike at you with my post if you took it that way. I was building an example, and I apologize if I came off as striking at you. I dunno, I love the way we play, but sometimes I just get antsie. I don't do it much, but every once in a blue moon it's always fun to surprise the enemy team and kill them all heh -Mom __________________ Yer Mom /O> To all but me is the look given but never received. My heart sinks faster and faster every time I look into them, yet I do not understand their controling power on my soul. - W11114m W45h1n670n

12-08-2006, 01:11 PM	#25 (permalink)
octorfunk Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 12	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! I am new to the server, but I am already fed up with people whining about they got killed by someone crossing the "boundaries." If the boundaries are the only thing keep you alive in CS, then what does that say about your gameplay? I even tested it one round. On Dust2 (playing as a T), I sat just outside of bombsite B, next to a cart, the entire round. No one bothered me, no one even came out the door. I could hear the CT's shuffling around just around the corner, but they would not cross that invisible boundary line for anything. It would have been easy for me to simply wait for them to pass and then turn the corner and blow them away. Personally, I think these so-called "boundaries" are creating a bunch of soft, whiny CS players. I snuck up behind a T sniper in the T spawn on the way to support my team in bombsite A on Dust2, and I knifed him. A) he was relying completely on the boundaries to watch his back, and B) he was using his "out-of-bounds" position to snipe at us from a safe distance. He got so mad when I knifed him from behind, he just wouldn't let it go, accusing me of kill-hunting. Was I kill-hunting, or was this guys just relying too much on the boundaries to protect him while he sniped from an area that I wasn't supposed to be in? Who is the better player? The one who understands the spirit of the boundary system and bends it when necessary to complete an objective, or the one who hides behind it and uses the boundaries as an excuse to not maintain any kind of rear security?

12-09-2006, 02:27 AM	#29 (permalink)
Greflin Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Wichita KS Age: 27 Posts: 234	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! There are much faster ways to support your team in A than through T spawn.

12-09-2006, 03:55 PM	#30 (permalink)
I.R. Hogan Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Fort Worth, tx Age: 47 Posts: 357	Re: Omgwtfheshouldntbethere!!!!!!! The "boundries" as I percieve them are not for stopping rushers really but to prevent kill hunting. Just my 2 cents.. I could be wrong.. usually am. __________________ I.R. Hogan \|TG\| Discipline is the soul of an army. It makes small numbers formidable procures success to the weak and esteem to all. CSS SOP'S,TACTICAL GAMER FAQ,PCS PLAYER STANDARDS SERVER ADMINS Become a Supporting Member It Pays To Pay !

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