de_view sniper

measley · 02-21-2006, 05:29 PM

The bomb has been planted at A. There is a sniper in the pillbox taking out anyone who attempts to diffuse. Do you take out the sniper before defusing.

I say yes.

poe · 02-21-2006, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by measley

The bomb has been planted at A. There is a sniper in the pillbox taking out anyone who attempts to diffuse. Do you take out the sniper before defusing.

I say yes.

Before this discussion gets started, let's fill up more of this hypothetical round!

The CTs were trying to defensively protect the A site, but they were murdered as the Ts on the ground advanced and planted. The other CTs (at bombsite B) are now in this situation.

It is near impossible to defuse at A with a sniper in the nest. He has to be either A) distracted, or B) smoked out, and pray he's not good at predicting.

Root · 02-21-2006, 05:46 PM

Absolutely. Depending on where you are, you may have to counter-snipe.

That said, if there are a lot of CT's and the sniper is the only T, or there are far fewer T's than CT's. I would be expecting the sniper to think twice as to the tacical value of being there. If the CT's smoke his LOF, he hasn't got time to reposition, and he's going to let the CT's defuse.

radicaldreamer · 02-21-2006, 05:47 PM

not if you're the only one left, that's when you use a smoke grenade to cover yourself

if you have more than one, communicate that you will try to take him out, while the other defuses the bomb

**Wyzcrak** · 02-21-2006, 05:54 PM

You can't treat this like a black/white yes/no question. I'm reminded of sixth grade. "Have you told your parents you're gay yet?" No matter how you answer, you're screwed.

No. Much more information is required to responsibly submit this question.

Have you smoke? How many of your team has? How many of your team is alive? How many of the sniper's team is alive? What is your distance to the sniper? Have you a teammate who you can count on to hit him from a distance? If not kill him, can your teammate remove the sniper's rifle from play, with some sort of cover/distract fire, long enough to defuse? Does the smoke help in that effort? What's the health and armor situation of the guy diffusing the bomb? Have you considered waiting the sniper out for a moment to see if he moves (people get nervous/impatient)?

Darwin solved this problem nicely with smoke and speed. I forget if we ever used it in a match, but I recall it working well enough in team practices.

**Wyzcrak** · 02-21-2006, 05:56 PM

Bahhhh.

Three posts in the time it takes me to compose mine, but they all reinforce my point: Lots of options.

measley · 02-21-2006, 06:06 PM

I guess my point is this:

While your first objective is never to Kill a T, sometimes, in RARE instances such as this, its neccasary to "kill hunt"

**Wyzcrak** · 02-21-2006, 06:25 PM

You waste our time by asking a question, and getting feedback, when you've made up your mind before you even created the thread?

That's icky. With a mild odor.

If you've got a point to make, and you needn't input to decide what that is, please just say it and save everyone the game of charades.

Regardless, I think this thread demonstrates nicely, that, while "killhunting" might be ONE solution to a problem ("gotta kill that sniper, guys!"), other solutions readily available ("you--SMOKE on ME; you and you -- supressive fire on the next, on my mark.") prevent "killhunting" as justifying itself as "the best tactical decision," much less the only one.

Hell, I'd rather go the smoke/coordination route and lose than the "killhunting" route and win.

Root · 02-22-2006, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyzcrak

Hell, I'd rather go the smoke/coordination route and lose than the "killhunting" route and win.

Exactly. Winning is important (essential if you're me), but it needs to be done using PCS. Losing by PCS is better than winning by other methods.

**GhostintheShell** · 02-22-2006, 06:30 PM

My vote is for a meat shield of everyone remaining, they lay down surpressing fire on the sniper nest while one guy is dedicated to either defusing or die while trying.

Spyder · 02-22-2006, 06:54 PM

assuming the sniper to be the last remaining T, I'd combine smoke the bomb and combine with a meatshield. Get the smoke out so the sniper can't see the bomb and has to fire semi-blindly, then get the defuser crouched on the bomb with the rest of the CT's standing between him and the sniper. Assuming you don't get picked off while running to the bomb, it'll take the sniper a few bullets to cut through the meatshield to the defuser, and with kit that should be enough time. if you get 2-3 smokes out, the sniper really won't have much chance at all.

**Vulcan** · 02-22-2006, 08:48 PM

I've been in this position when you've thrown smoke yet the CT is still sniping your team. Why and how? Because he has a fixed position regardless of smoke. He can guess in the smoke and nail the head. Suppressive fire helps prevent this.

However the point being missed here isn't that you want to kill the sniper, it's that you want to disrupt him, get him out of the comfort zone. This can be accomplished by shooting up at the pillbox which might you get you laid flat while he still takes out the defuser or you can send 1 guy to the pillbox and have him harass the sniper which IMO is much more effective.

Manboob's · 05-06-2006, 11:23 PM

In this particular situation, I, being an idiot, would find cover behind the northernmost entry to a (For t's that is), camp behind that wall, slowly taking away an advantage for the t's (in that they have more players, killing them would take the advantage away from the sniper, after killing them, wait, throw a flash in, disguised as a smoke, go to the westernmost entrance from there, throw your smoke, run in whilst you THINK he is distracted, and try to defuse the bomb. Granted this situation doesn't always work, but none do. You really just have to hope he can't see you, if he does, you just lose a round, it's better than kill hunting, because if you go into the pillbox, your likely to get murdered as well.

02-21-2006, 05:29 PM	#1 (permalink)
measley Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Houston Age: 27 Posts: 120	de_view sniper The bomb has been planted at A. There is a sniper in the pillbox taking out anyone who attempts to diffuse. Do you take out the sniper before defusing. I say yes.

02-21-2006, 05:46 PM	#3 (permalink)
Root Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: South east england Posts: 8,839	Re: de_view sniper Absolutely. Depending on where you are, you may have to counter-snipe. That said, if there are a lot of CT's and the sniper is the only T, or there are far fewer T's than CT's. I would be expecting the sniper to think twice as to the tacical value of being there. If the CT's smoke his LOF, he hasn't got time to reposition, and he's going to let the CT's defuse. __________________ BFCL TF2 league admin

02-21-2006, 05:47 PM	#4 (permalink)
radicaldreamer Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Milton, Ontario, Canada Age: 20 Posts: 301	Re: de_view sniper not if you're the only one left, that's when you use a smoke grenade to cover yourself if you have more than one, communicate that you will try to take him out, while the other defuses the bomb __________________

02-21-2006, 05:54 PM	#5 (permalink)
Wyzcrak Join Date: May 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 14,148	Re: de_view sniper You can't treat this like a black/white yes/no question. I'm reminded of sixth grade. "Have you told your parents you're gay yet?" No matter how you answer, you're screwed. No. Much more information is required to responsibly submit this question. Have you smoke? How many of your team has? How many of your team is alive? How many of the sniper's team is alive? What is your distance to the sniper? Have you a teammate who you can count on to hit him from a distance? If not kill him, can your teammate remove the sniper's rifle from play, with some sort of cover/distract fire, long enough to defuse? Does the smoke help in that effort? What's the health and armor situation of the guy diffusing the bomb? Have you considered waiting the sniper out for a moment to see if he moves (people get nervous/impatient)? Darwin solved this problem nicely with smoke and speed. I forget if we ever used it in a match, but I recall it working well enough in team practices. __________________ Steam Community? Add me. \| Join #tacticalgamer \| Search Results Legend \| New Posts Forum Filter \| Postbox Toggle \| Live Thread Review \| One Line Results \| Free Remote, Encrypted Backup Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Root: Welcome to TG. Feel free to punctuate your sentences correctly. Monkerz: Its gonna take all my skills to beat those boys off in the future.

02-21-2006, 05:56 PM	#6 (permalink)
Wyzcrak Join Date: May 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 14,148	Re: de_view sniper Bahhhh. Three posts in the time it takes me to compose mine, but they all reinforce my point: Lots of options. __________________ Steam Community? Add me. \| Join #tacticalgamer \| Search Results Legend \| New Posts Forum Filter \| Postbox Toggle \| Live Thread Review \| One Line Results \| Free Remote, Encrypted Backup Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Root: Welcome to TG. Feel free to punctuate your sentences correctly. Monkerz: Its gonna take all my skills to beat those boys off in the future.

02-21-2006, 06:06 PM	#7 (permalink)
measley Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Houston Age: 27 Posts: 120	Re: de_view sniper I guess my point is this: While your first objective is never to Kill a T, sometimes, in RARE instances such as this, its neccasary to "kill hunt"

02-21-2006, 06:25 PM	#8 (permalink)
Wyzcrak Join Date: May 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 14,148	Re: de_view sniper You waste our time by asking a question, and getting feedback, when you've made up your mind before you even created the thread? That's icky. With a mild odor. If you've got a point to make, and you needn't input to decide what that is, please just say it and save everyone the game of charades. Regardless, I think this thread demonstrates nicely, that, while "killhunting" might be ONE solution to a problem ("gotta kill that sniper, guys!"), other solutions readily available ("you--SMOKE on ME; you and you -- supressive fire on the next, on my mark.") prevent "killhunting" as justifying itself as "the best tactical decision," much less the only one. Hell, I'd rather go the smoke/coordination route and lose than the "killhunting" route and win. __________________ Steam Community? Add me. \| Join #tacticalgamer \| Search Results Legend \| New Posts Forum Filter \| Postbox Toggle \| Live Thread Review \| One Line Results \| Free Remote, Encrypted Backup Darkilla: In short, NS is pretty much really fast chess. With guns. Apophis: I haven't seen anyone say that SM's are better than non-SMs. Nordbomber: This is THE first server I've seen where either side can comeback from out of seemingly nowhere with the right teamwork. en4rcment: I have NEVER experienced the type of gameplay that I have found here. Nightly I am amazed at the personalities and gaming talent. Root: Welcome to TG. Feel free to punctuate your sentences correctly. Monkerz: Its gonna take all my skills to beat those boys off in the future.

02-22-2006, 06:30 PM	#10 (permalink)
GhostintheShell Join Date: May 2003 Location: Guelph, Ontario Age: 37 Posts: 963	Re: de_view sniper My vote is for a meat shield of everyone remaining, they lay down surpressing fire on the sniper nest while one guy is dedicated to either defusing or die while trying. __________________ Certainly there is no hunting like the hunting of man and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never really care for anything else thereafter. Ernest Hemingway, "On the Blue Water," Esquire, April 1936

02-22-2006, 06:54 PM	#11 (permalink)
Spyder Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: MN (Middle of Nowhere, MN) Age: 25 Posts: 1,049	Re: de_view sniper assuming the sniper to be the last remaining T, I'd combine smoke the bomb and combine with a meatshield. Get the smoke out so the sniper can't see the bomb and has to fire semi-blindly, then get the defuser crouched on the bomb with the rest of the CT's standing between him and the sniper. Assuming you don't get picked off while running to the bomb, it'll take the sniper a few bullets to cut through the meatshield to the defuser, and with kit that should be enough time. if you get 2-3 smokes out, the sniper really won't have much chance at all. __________________ a.k.a. NinjaPirateAssassin Celibacy is not Hereditary. Everybody should believe in something - I believe I'll have another drink. Happiness is like wetting your pants, everyone can see it but only you can feel the warmth. Flying is easy, Just throw yourself at the ground and miss!

02-22-2006, 08:48 PM	#12 (permalink)
Vulcan Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Montreal Age: 30 Posts: 7,560	Re: de_view sniper I've been in this position when you've thrown smoke yet the CT is still sniping your team. Why and how? Because he has a fixed position regardless of smoke. He can guess in the smoke and nail the head. Suppressive fire helps prevent this. However the point being missed here isn't that you want to kill the sniper, it's that you want to disrupt him, get him out of the comfort zone. This can be accomplished by shooting up at the pillbox which might you get you laid flat while he still takes out the defuser or you can send 1 guy to the pillbox and have him harass the sniper which IMO is much more effective. __________________ TG Primer - CSS SOP's - INS SOP's

05-06-2006, 11:23 PM	#13 (permalink)
Manboob's Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Louisville,ky Posts: 25	Re: de_view sniper In this particular situation, I, being an idiot, would find cover behind the northernmost entry to a (For t's that is), camp behind that wall, slowly taking away an advantage for the t's (in that they have more players, killing them would take the advantage away from the sniper, after killing them, wait, throw a flash in, disguised as a smoke, go to the westernmost entrance from there, throw your smoke, run in whilst you THINK he is distracted, and try to defuse the bomb. Granted this situation doesn't always work, but none do. You really just have to hope he can't see you, if he does, you just lose a round, it's better than kill hunting, because if you go into the pillbox, your likely to get murdered as well.

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