SharinganTH1422

Well, I'm frustrated to the core by nVidia's stupidity.

While the GeForce 9000 series was being made didn't anyone realize that they would be better as a paperweight than a GPU? Seriously, didn't they realize that even people who know as little about hardware as me could see through their name-based marketing campaign, and actually making a bunch of chips that were slightly faster than their current ones, at stupid prices, with the GX2 being their high end card that isn't that great, yet costs the equivalent of the budget of a small country? One of my cousins is putting an entire system together for about half the price of a GX2. One of the "big deals" about the GX2 is the Quad SLI, yet buying four of these GPU's, plus the cooling and power, and case to fit all of this alone, would cost much more than double my rig, which most people would call fairly high-end.

No way I'm going nVidia, I'm definitely going to get the 3870X2, 1st suggested by Buckets, but I had always just done research on nVidia cards for some reason and had never considered ATi, but now it's so obvious. Around the same price as a 8800GTX, yet so much better, more like in the league of two GTX's in SLI and the GX2, which cost double. It seems like a no-brainer I should've realized ages ago. I was considering a 8800 GTX, but I wanted slightly more than the graphical power it could dish-out, so I was considering 2 GTX's, but I didn't want to pay that much, and I knew I wouldn't need that much power. The 9800 GTX would in fact be worse than the 8800 GTX, and the GX2 would be ridiculously priced. Then, when I saw the 3870 X2 being compared to the GX2, and performing better in certain areas (albeit with incomplete drivers, we're told), made me think of this GPU. Gamespot really did it for me in their review of the 3870X2, comparing it to 2 GTX's, and in some areas performing better. It was just what I needed, much more powerful than the GTX, yet at a great price, even managing to perform at the same level of 2 8800GTX's and a GX2, and in some cases better. I didn't need so much power, but if I can pay about the same price for some, I'm not complaining.

Edit: Sorry about the rant .

Also, that mobo I have, it's SLI, but can I run 1 ATI card in it? I'm not really planning to get CrossFireX for this in the future, as that would completely defeat the purpose of me buying the card in the first place .

Edit 2: Link to the card. - ATI Radeon HD 3870 X2 1024MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI/HDMI (PCI-Express). Reviews are pretty promising too.

The Gamespot Article.

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Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same...

SharinganTH1422

I thought it was possible to put any PCI-e card on a mobo with PCI-e slots, so I should be able to put this ATi GPU on this mobo which supports SLI, right? But not get another and make it CrossFireX, right...?

__________________
Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same...

Bamboo

You are correct above.

Also, relax man.
Right now, I have a feeling that since you arn't building till summer, maybe late summer, there is going to be so much that changes between now and then you may end up dumping your whole plan and starting over.
For instance, things that are roumers right now may blow us all away (ATI's 4000 series), or who knows, maybe a new 9800GT will come out that kicks as much ass as the 8800GT does.
Wait and see.

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SharinganTH1422

Lol, I know it was a bit of a stupid rant, but I felt like venting...

Also, yh, I know that a lot of things are changing fast in this industry, and I may want to replace quite a lot of my system with newer and more recently released technologies in that time. However, by figuring out what rig I'd buy right now, I think I'm giving myself a decent platform to what I'll end up getting. I now have the knowledge of what I need in my computer, and what features I need and don't need, and what I need to think about when buying the parts for the PC. This also means I won't be asking as many questions (seems like I've asked thousands, and I thank you for your patience and helpfulness with all matters) when it comes to my build next time round.

One last thing...got a link for those ATi 4000 rumours?

__________________
Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same...

SharinganTH1422

__________________
Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same...

Bamboo

Just a quick update to your fan/cabinet idea, I came across this article this morning:

How To: Turn a Lack Shelf into a Fan Cooled Media Cabinet

Thought it might help some. He links to a cheap power supply for the fans.

I found it though this cool site:

http://ikeahacker.blogspot.com/

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Stoop and you'll be stepped on; stand tall and you'll be shot at.

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SharinganTH1422

Bamboo = legend.

Thanks man , and it seems last thing I need to decide now is the GPU, which I think I'm going to decide when June comes around, looking at the prices of everything + the new ATi's that will come out in May...

__________________
Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same...

SharinganTH1422

Thread revival.

OK, well I thought I had my list but some things have changed.

Firstly, the fact I'm getting an ATi GPU = Me Getting an Intel Mobo, so I was looking at this:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showpr...%20Motherboard

Only problem I can really see is no DDR3 for the future, and I want this to last a 5 or 6 years without too many updates (Quick question - a DDR3 Mobo can support DDR3 and DDR2 right? Because I'm seeing DDR2 mobo's, DDR3 mobo's and DDR2&DDR3 mobo's)

But all DDR3 mobo's I've seen are a bit too expensive (other than a few MSI and Gigabyte ones, but I was kinda set on a ASUS (reliability purposes) Question: Are MSI and Gigabyte OK?...) Also pretty set on X48 (Question: what other chipsets support Q9450).

However, if I'm gonna replace in about 5 years, I'm gonna need a new mobo for these new CPU's anyway. I'll just stuff my case with loads of DDR2 I guess...

(Thoughts on rambles above?)

Also I didn't want to complete takeover Switch's thread but Buckets said something about a lapped heatsink. What is that exactly? Also that was the best heatsink at the time, but not anymore looks like, so I'll need a new suggestion.

Case, I think, is going to be the Antec Three Hundred now.

Also for the HDD's I forget. On the Primary HDD you put you're OS and you put everything else on Secondary HDD? Where do games go exactly?

__________________
Anger is a gift - Malcolm X

...If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same...

Bamboo

Real quick answers:
Your games go on the Secondary drive. When you install and it asks you where, you change it to like F:Programfiles/EA Games or something like that, instead of C:Programfiles

Lapping a heatsink makes it as smooth as humanly possible, even smoother than it is when it comes from the factory. And I am talking mirror smooth, not just it feels very smooth to the touch. Just google for a guide. I think one of the links that are down that I just posted in the Fignut thread this morning was a guide to it for the 120 extreme.
One thing about the 120 is it is pretty small compared to some of the other ones, and that will be important considering the smaller case you are looking at. You don't want a monster cooler taking up a ton of room.

For the motherboard, that is an awesome board you linked to, but it is overkill. That is what, like $350 or something US dollars. Like we have said, only go with X48 if you are 95% or better certain you are going to do Crossfire. I thought the other day you were liking the idea of just getting a good gfx. card now and upgrading again in a couple years?
I am thinking for now you would be happy for many years to come with a DDR2 board.

And I think ASUS and Gig are both good boards, but like I posted a couple weeks ago, MSI boards need a little work on their BIOS from what tech reviews have said.

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Buckets

To expand on what Bamboo said about lapping, it not only makes the surface mirror smooth, it also ensures that it is perfectly flat. Many heat sinks aren't milled completely flat in the factory (which is my only beef with the Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme. They are notorious for shipping with not quite flat bases.) The TRUE120 also makes more noise than several other top heat sinks because it has so many fins packed so close together. That is great for cooling but you do need a more powerful and louder fan to push the air through those fins.

Anyhow, I' would really recommend either the OCZ Vendetta 2 or the Xigmatek HDT-1283 for your build as they are both quieter, lighter and cool better than an un-lapped TRUE 120 but I can't seem to find either one on the OCUK website. Too bad you can't order from Newegg because the Xigmatek is on sale right now.

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The artist formerly known as "pecker"

Acreo Aeneas

As for "lapping", you can just use a fine/ultra-fine sandpaper to lap it (essentially grinding away the imperfections). Just make sure you do it away from any computer components and properly clean the heatsink after lapping it.

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Acreo_Aeneas
Former 9th Member

Buckets

In order to lap properly, the sandpaper needs to be stretched out over a perfectly flat surface. Most people use glass from a picture frame. It is a misconception that the only (or even the main) purpose of lapping is to get a better finish on the heat sink or CPU heat spreader. The main purpose is to ensure that the surfaces are perfectly flat.

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The artist formerly known as "pecker"

Bamboo

Ok, the site I mentioned is back up
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1188093

You really need to read the whole thread to learn the most, because there is good info on every page

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Stoop and you'll be stepped on; stand tall and you'll be shot at.

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Buckets

Another great "how to" thread on lapping if anyone is interested.

http://www.overclock.net/faqs/15897-...your-p4-s.html

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The artist formerly known as "pecker"

Long Bow

A DDR3 board only supporst just that. There are combo boards but apparently they aren't so hot. That may have changed though. I would say that a solid DDR2 board will be the way to go. DDR3 doesn't hold much advantage currently but will in the future as FSB goes up. However that will probably be with the Nehalm processors, something your mobo won't use.

Be sure to lap on a flat surface, use wet dry paper and keep adding water as needed (keep things smooth, I had problems where it would catch on the paper causing scuffs if it go to dry). Be sure to rotate the heatsink 90 deg every few strokes. Don't use allot of pressure, let the grit do the work. Be prepared to take some time (its a two to three beer job )

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