Archer vs. Phalanx battle to the death!

RedTalon · 04-15-2008, 07:32 PM

So I just had a 1 on 1 battle, that lasted 5 round...which I thought was odd. Anyways it gave a good opportunity to look at numbers and maybe get an some idea of how battle works. Because in large battles all the numbers are averaged between troops. Some things I noticed are that in the first report it shows my workshop upgrades for my archer, but after round 1 they go away...I don't think this is due to endurance effects either. Also through out the whole battle his defense was higher than my attack. Anyways the archer ended up winning.

Code:


Battle for Verdant Night
Battle Formation
Attacker: RedTalonTPF
													
	                Archer     1
			Attack     60.0
			Defense    50.0
			Endurance  12.0

Defender: Luthorne
													
	     Phalanx    1										
			30.0										
			67.6										
			14.0										
The town wall (Level 2) of the town Verdant Night 
(Level 10) strengthens the defending units by 4%

======================================
1. Round
Attacker: RedTalonTPF
													
									1
									40.0
									40.0
									10.0
Defender: Luthorne
													
			1										
			24.0										
			54.1										
			12.0										
Summary for the round: 1
1. Round: 1 units are attacking the town Verdant Night in
 RedTalonTPF�xB4;s name
Attacking power: 40.
1. Round: 1 Units are defending the town Verdant Night for 
Luthorne: Defence power 54.08.
1. Round: Round finished

======================================

2. Round
Attacker: RedTalonTPF
													
									1
									40.0
									40.0
									8.0
Defender: Luthorne
													
			1										
			24.0										
			54.1										
			10.0										
Summary for the round: 2
2. Round: 1 units are attacking the town Verdant Night in 
RedTalonTPF�xB4;s name
Attacking power: 40.
2. Round: 1 Units are defending the town Verdant Night 
for Luthorne: Defence power 54.08.
2. Round: Round finished

======================================

3. Round
Attacker: RedTalonTPF
													
									1
									32.0
									32.0
									6.0
Defender: Luthorne
													
			1										
			19.2										
			43.3										
			8.0										
Summary for the round: 3
3. Round: 1 units are attacking the town Verdant Night in 
RedTalonTPF�xB4;s name
Attacking power: 32.
3. Round: 1 Units are defending the town Verdant Night for 
Luthorne: Defence power 43.264.
3. Round: Round finished

======================================

4. Round
Attacker: RedTalonTPF
													
									1
									32.0
									32.0
									4.0
Defender: Luthorne
													
			1										
			19.2										
			43.3										
			6.0										
Summary for the round: 4
4. Round: 1 units are attacking the town Verdant Night in
 RedTalonTPF�xB4;s name
Attacking power: 32.
4. Round: 1 Units are defending the town Verdant Night for 
Luthorne: Defence power 43.264.
4. Round: Round finished

======================================

5. Round
Attacker: RedTalonTPF
													
									1
									24.0
									24.0
									2.0
Defender: Luthorne
No units available
Summary for the round: 5
5. Round: 1 units are attacking the town Verdant Night in 
RedTalonTPF�xB4;s name
Attacking power: 24.
5. Round: 0 Units are defending the town Verdant Night for
 Luthorne: Defence power 0.
5. Round: Round finished
Victors: RedTalonTPF
RedTalonTPF from Talos has won the battle and pillages Verdant Night.

**Tarenth** · 04-16-2008, 12:40 AM

The battle was won probably due to stamina.

Your archer had 40 attack against their 54 defense (40*1.3*1.04) while their phalanx had 24 attack against your 40 defense. As such neither side has enough offensive power to penetrate the defense and cause casualties. However since the difference between the Archer's offense and the Phalanx's defense is only 14 while the difference between the Phalanx's offense and the Archer's defense is 16 it means that, theoretically, the phalanx is taking more stamina damage than the archer.

Looking at the end of the battle we see that your troops are under 50% stamina (24 of 40 is 60% of attack/defense) so we can assume the phalanx is around the same point as well dropping attack and defense to 60% and losing the 'resistance' bonus that gave it 30% extra defensive value and making it a unit worth 14.4 offense and 24.96. At this point the phalanx is clearly outclassed since the difference between its offense and the archer's defense is 9.6 points while the difference in its defense and your archer's offense is only 0.96. With accumulated damage the result is either significant enough stamina loss from damage to cause it to drop below 25% stamina and flee or a casualty wiping out the phalanx.

RedTalon · 04-16-2008, 02:04 AM

Ya that makes sense, although both troops show a loss of 2 stamina each round...so they are losing stamina at the same rate. So if damage dealt is not enough to kill a unit (based of it's defense), it goes to stamina instead. So based on this I would imagine the phalanx to be losing stamina quicker, due to the archers high attack. But it is not, which means either that the high defense of the phalanx is effecting stamina loss...or stamina loss is a standard rate that is not dependent on the enemies attack.

Also from this I have pretty much gathered what a good defense could be. All Phalanx defense is actually not that strong, it can hold out but not kill enemies. What I am going to try to stick to is 2/3 phalanx 1/3 attack class. Damage is randomly assigned, so 2/3 phalanx should get hit more often, which leaves the 1/3 attack getting hit less. 1/3 is that extra attack power, to kill off troops. Also walls are probably most important just to restate, they will give the phalax that extra attack power to actually kill off enemies, not to mention boosting it's already high defense.

**Tarenth** · 04-16-2008, 05:05 AM

Bang for buck the phalanx is still the best defensive unit and the best unit to have defending your town. One of the key factors that's neglected in that little skirmish is the benefits of an effective wall. If you were to attack me and my level 14 city with level 14 walls (yes, I do build my walls to city specs) then the humble 24/40 phalanx becomes a 42/72.8 juggernaut. That means not only will I be able to kill off archers at a rate of 1:1 but you'll need 2:1 archers just to inflict casualties upon me. The next unit down would be the swordsman who has specs of 18/14. That means not only will he do less damage in battle, but as a whole they will take more casualties as well. I always laugh when I see swordsmen on defense.

You could go up and get archers with their rate of 40/40 and its true they are a formidable unit since with the same defensive bonuses I give my phalanx they'd have specs of 82/56. That means I'd cause casualties at a rate of 1:2 but take casualties at a rate of 1:1.5.

If you want to go cheap then all phalanx is a dependable defensive option. If you want to increase the meatgrinder affect your wills will have then the only option you have would be to add archers to your phalanx. Adding swordsmen or slingers to your defense is actually detrimental because they will sustain high casualties and cause your defense to drop. Once your defense drops lower than 1/3 of their offense you lose the battle.

**birdie_in_Texas** · 04-17-2008, 06:01 PM

hey fellas..i got a stupid question..where did all the above info come from..? I pillage all the time and I never see anything like that..

Is it a greasemonkey script or something..? Or am I just too much of a pee-on level-wise to get that much info..?

RedTalon · 04-17-2008, 06:37 PM

If your pillage lasts for more than 2 rounds (meaning there was a battle and not a slaughter) then you can go to combat reports advisor thingy, click the battle in question, then go down to the bottom and there it should say Detailed battle report.

Hrvat01 · 03-20-2009, 06:24 PM

Rigth. Its cool. In almost every game, the archer is stronger than the phalanax. You need to actualy WORK to deserve the archer.