The Way of the Hunter

Transcendant · 12-09-2008, 03:57 PM

Original post by hax4543 on l4d411 forums. None of this is my work. Starts off common sense then gets into more detail. Don't give up reading after the first paragraph.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hax4543

I. Introduction:
The Hunter in my opinion is the best infected class to play if played by a decent player. I have seen way to many people play this special infected class poorly. The abilities of the hunter are not limited just to it's pounce. Hunters also have the ability to pounce from wall to wall which can confuse the survivors and/or scare the players.
His pounce is also able to deal a hefty 25 initial damage. With aim and patience you will be able to fly through the air and slam the survivor to the ground.

II. Pouncing:
Pouncing is both the main way of transportation for the hunter and its primary attack. Even though pouncing to get places sounds good, it really isn't if you are trying to be stealthy. You emit a high pitched screech when you unleash your pounce, alerting survivors of your presence. To get into detail, the hunters initial pounce damage can be determined by the height and distance traveled which basically means airtime. This damage is capped at 25 which is a fourth of a survivors health. When the hunter lands on an unfortunate player it causes his buddies around him to be pushed back for about 1.5 seconds. In this time you will be able to get a couple good hits in. With the push back and the initial damage the hunter will be able to deal out 30+ damage per pounce. Over pouncing is always better than under-pouncing because if you are going to far you are able to hold down "s" which slows your speed. Under-pouncing a target often leads to landing infront of the survivor and getting a shotgun blast to the mouth. If you are lucky enough to be bunted off the survivor then leap for your ****ing life. Survival is key for infected because the 20 seconds that you are not in the action can lead to the team progressing through a large part of the map. Getting a stock to the face blinds you but if they forget about you then get back in position and attack again. Running away in a straight line makes you extremely vulnerable to a good shot which leads me to the next section, wall jumping.

Video:

Long Range Pouncing

Higher Quality Stream

This is a video I made that combines some of the concepts I have described. There is also a tad of wall jumping in the video.

III. Whether Or Not To Pounce:
The answer to this question is effected by many factors. The main factor is communication, if you have a retarded team that attacks 1 at a time then I would either try to save the game yourself or get them to work as a team. Any special infected is **** without the other backing it up. The same goes with the hunter, if you just pounce at the guy, infront of all his little friends, then your not very helpful to the team. Coordination and cooperation of the team results in successful pounces/ incapacitation. The second factor that contributes whether or not to pounce is your location. If you think you have a really low chance of hitting them then you should relocate to a better location. There are plenty of spots on the map to change to, remember if you mess up the pounce you have a high chance of getting killed. The third and final factor that contributes to pouncing is the distance they are from the majority of the group. If they are huddled very closely together then you should rally up your team and attack them as a unit. If there is a straggler going away from the group then quickly strike. This greatly slows the survivors progress, they will have to decide whether or not to come back for their downed buddy or move on.

IV. Flaming Hunter:
As a hunter you do a substantial amount of damage normally, just imagine if you were on fire. Your damage output greatly increases from the original. There are many sources of fire, from burning cars to trash cans. It is not all good though.... You can be easily seen by survivors because you are flaming ball hopping around in circles and you also lose your ability to wall jump. Losing the ability to wall jump decreases your chances of escaping so it will probably be a suicide mission. Lighting yourself on fire is very useful when someone is in the reds and you need to down them very quickly.

V. Wall Jumping:
This by far the best way to elude survivors after being discovered. It can also be used to get to a higher elevation very quickly. Wall jumping is performed by jumping at a wall, turning 180, then pouncing again by pressing mouse1. Jumping side to side down a narrow alley way can scare the **** out of survivors and also does a good amount of initial damage to them if performed correctly. In a closed space wall jumping can also be used to confuse the survivors because you are bouncing around the room which. While bouncing around indoors it is easy to be disorientated because you will be turning around alot. Wall jumping also reduces the chances of you getting shot in the face.

Video:

How to Walljump

General WallJumping

Trick Jumping is basically wall jumping on steroids, it uses the basic concept of wall jumping and applies them to more complex settings.

VI. Melee:
Meleeing (secondary attack) is useful in some cases but sticking around too long smacking them will ensure your death. If you are knocked off of a tackled survivor and want to get a couple hits in, then this method is for you. It is usually effective when they are engulfed in a mob of zombies. Getting a couple good hits will reduce their health quite drastically. But once everything is quiet and they have regained control of the situation your best choice would be to run for your life. A bunt stuns you for 2 or so seconds and gives them time to either shoot you or keep smacking you until you're a lifeless corpse. While an incapacitated player is being picked up you could give them a good punch which results in the player being dropped. This will buy your team some time, but if the rescuer turns around and decides to unload a spray of lead into you, your done. If you think the positive outweighs the negative then by all means, stick around for a few seconds and get some extra damage in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fire_cube

When you are being shoved/stunned, you can use melee even if you are not in first-person.
I don't know if it's intended or not, but it's pretty cool inflicting some damage while they keep shoving you thinking you are being a complete sitting duck.
Also, you can't strafe while using melee. You have to literally use your mouse to navigate.

VII. Relocating the Witch:
Have you ever had a witch spawn in a useless place that the survivors can just walk pass? Then this technique is for you. Smacking the witch with your claws does not piss her off but if you pounce at her, she rages. The witch will chase your ass down so you better run to the place that you want her to be. After you have gotten to the location, sit there and let her kill you. Soon after you have died she will sit down and begin to cry again.

Video:

Relocating the Witch

VIII. Pouncing Spots:

Key: Red is where you stand.
Green is an area of high success rate.
Blue is of lower success rate.

These 3 screenshots are from the 3 outdoor maps of No Mercy. They are parts 1,3 and 5.

On the last one you will stand ontop of the satellite dish and pounce toward the ladder. It does not do 25 damage but does a good 10-15.

**peardog** · 12-09-2008, 05:41 PM

good stuff.. thx

**Avs** · 12-09-2008, 05:48 PM

A few additions that his great walkthrough missed:

1. Pounce Damage only by airtime, which can be factored with wall jumps. For example, if you jump straight up and back down you will deal damage, as opposed to a fast pounce from a short height with more velocity (sorry gravity). This means you can combine multiple wall jumps which add to airtime to deliver a heavy pounce. This is most important since normal damage is weaksauce.
2. Higher difficulty has higher pounce damage caps. Normal difficult is capped at 25.
3. You can move players if you hit them with a lateral pounce that has airtime. This will cause a player to slide (rare but so awesome if done right). Of course moving them while hitting them doesn't do much. Just looks cool. However, if you do it while they are on a ledge, it will cause them to fall down below.
4. The Flaming hunter trick is cool, but not practical in my opinion. It makes you stand out and since almost all zombies die to fire in less than a second, it reveals you when you try to blend for some swipes, plus its better to work together with other infected unless you are really forced to deal damage or slow the team down w/o pouncing.
5. I think the most important thing about wall jumping is not entirely escaping or distracting the other team, but more emphasized about landing the pounce while jumping around. There are plenty of ways to distract using just hunter sounds than revealing yourself to get shot. Good players can hit you and cause damage whenever you are visibly shootable.
6. Relocating the witch, this is an exploit I believe since it wasnt intended to be moved. That being said, since the witch can be owned easily and isnt a problem with a group of witch hunters, I suggest this not be used in TG games. Also, there IS a second way to disturb the witch without using this method that doesnt move her but makes her pissed.

Lazz · 12-12-2008, 04:19 PM

Hi

This is going to sound like a stupid question but how do you do multiple pounces? When I press ctrl, it takes like 2 seconds to load and then I press mouse 1 and pounce. Yet I see people seemingly able to jump all over the place with no cooldown time.

Also - is there any way to play as infected offline just to practice? (particularly with the hunter)?

**Razcsak** · 12-12-2008, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lazz

Hi

This is going to sound like a stupid question but how do you do multiple pounces? When I press ctrl, it takes like 2 seconds to load and then I press mouse 1 and pounce. Yet I see people seemingly able to jump all over the place with no cooldown time.

Hold control while you're airborne. As long as you still have it held, you'll be able to jump constantly.

Avs: Can we get testing on whether wallbounces add to airtime? I've heard the exact opposite. I'm not great at it, or I'd try, but I didn't think it did.

**Eternaly_Lost** · 12-12-2008, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razcsak

Hold control while you're airborne. As long as you still have it held, you'll be able to jump constantly.

Avs: Can we get testing on whether wallbounces add to airtime? I've heard the exact opposite. I'm not great at it, or I'd try, but I didn't think it did.

I have seen wallbounces add more damage to pounce. I was a hunter in a building and got pound damage by bouncing off a wall before hitting someone.

As for moving the witch, I think it should be allowed because some games the witch spawn in a place that no team would ever sanely go normally, and with a witch there... Lets just say that they must really want to go in every room in some cases. Activating the witch is just too much of an exploit, but moving her is a tactical move by the infected.

MaDNess · 12-13-2008, 05:55 PM

Awesome

**Sir-Nerd** · 12-13-2008, 06:08 PM

Is there anyway to practise the hunter without being in a match.

Transcendant · 12-13-2008, 07:21 PM

Here you are Sir-Nerd. I changed grammar and format in his post to be easier to understand. Credit to Nunx of l4d411 forums.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nunx

This map is for training your skills on wall jumping it has different things what you can do. ORANGE MAPS FTW!

Download
----------------------------------------
Click Here

Video
---------------------------------------
Click Here

Instructions
---------------------------------------
1. First open a new TEXT DOCUMENT and copy paste this in there:

Code:

echo "custom mode activated!"
sv_cheats 1
director_no_human_zombies 0
sb_all_bot_team 1
unbind "F1"
unbind "F2"
unbind "F3"
unbind "F4"
unbind "F5"
unbind "F6"
bind "F1" "z_spawn boomer"
bind "F2" "z_spawn smoker"
bind "F3" "z_spawn hunter"
bind "F4" "z_spawn tank"
bind "F5" "z_spawn witch"
bind "F6" "noclip"
wait
sb_stop 1

2. Save in C:\Program Files\Steam\steamapps\common\left 4 dead\left4dead\cfg as infectedmode.cfg

3. Then place the maps folder into C:\Program Files\Steam\steamapps\common\left 4 dead\left4dead\. It won't overwrite anything.

4. Open up L4D and in console type:

map l4d_huntersplayhouse1
and
exec infectedmode

5. Then press M and switch to infected team. Spawn yourself in using F3 (for Hunter).

6.Press F6 to enter and exit noclip mode to travel around the huge map faster. In the main chamber there are plenty of wall-jumping challenges and stuff to toy around with.

Sonic · 12-14-2008, 02:55 AM

usefull post, enjoyed it.

**Avs** · 12-19-2008, 03:38 PM

I'll try to get a screenshot of a 0 height hunter pounce damage.

What this is, is where you bounce off walls in a enclosed hallway without touching the ground and then hit someone. Since it takes a really long hall to match the same distance traveled compared to jumping off a high area, its hard to do and usually not worth it when compared to swiping someone once or twice (20 damage versus a 15 damage pounce + ??).

It appears the pounce damage is weighted more on distance than height.

**Avs** · 01-30-2009, 03:48 PM

Should have been added to this a long time ago:

http://forums.steampowered.com/forum...d.php?t=770952

Quote:

Hunter techs
I decided to create a compendium of my Hunter knowledge, so that it can be discussed, corrected, and improved for hunters everywhere. I'll start off by stating the properties of hunter jumps and wall jumps, these are the building block mechanics hunters have to "jump" off of.

Pounce:

Fairly simple, the hunter's best friend. Causing up to 25 damage maximum (yes, even while on fire) depending *solely* on the distance from point a (jumping off point) to b (victim). It can be hard to quantify how much distance will net you a 25, so get out there and find your favorite spots. I find new 25's every day, and soon me and a friend will try to release a tutorial to show hunters just where they all are. If you are on fire, it will *not* up the damage the pounce does. It will, however, up your claw on ground damage greatly. I also want to add that you do not need to hit crouch again to wall jump at any time. If you know you're going to hit the floor though, you'll want to tap or hold crouch just before you hit the floor to immediately jump again.

*Patched Mechanic*
The hunter initial damage from pounce has been altered, and needs to be tested to see if it has an impact on the hunter meta-game.
*Needs testing*

In addition to everything above, if you pounce someone close to his teammates, said teammates will be stunned and shoved away seven or eight feet. They are always pushed away in relation to where the teammate is that got pounced, and while slightly useful in most scenarios, there are some maps that give this mechanic potential. If you mange to stun someone off a ledge, it will incapacitate them in the hanging state, functioning exactly like as if a smoker pulled them off.

*New mechanic*

It's been elusive to nail down, but the "push" mechanic of pounces is indeed a consistent and intended mechanic. For anyone who doesn't know, you can "push" people off surfaces for extra damage in pounces, while it has a minimum drop distance of about 35 feet to do damage, it scales up VERY quickly, getting up to 75+ damage at 45+ feet for a fall. To do this, pounce someone on a ladder (no mercy map 3, final ladder is a great place), you may not see it, but when you pin them to the ground below the game will make a "ding" noise confirming the push damage, if you're in the air long enough or don't do initial pounce damage, you will see "player pushed other player for xx damage". This is extremely deadly, and I would like to see if there are other ways this mechanic can be implimented into the hunter game.
*Needs testing*

Pounce Sliding:

Something I'm sure everyone has accidentally done, you can actually slide your jump if you know what you're looking for. If you hit *any* edge of a surface at the end of a pounce, you will slide off the edge with the velocity and angle you hit it at. The angle and speed of approach is irrelevant for the success of this mechanic, the sweet spot for sliding is *very* hard to hit, so if you're going to try it, prepare for a lot of practice, or a little luck. The most important part of this mechanic is that it DOES NOT re-set your jump distance like wall jumping does, thus, elongating your jump for more damage and range. The places you can do this tech and hit someone are very few, but if mastered, can really take people by surprise and do a lot of damage.
*Needs testing*

Wall jump:

A hunter's best *best* friend. The true virtue of the wall jump itself, is it's ability to get a hunter out of bad situations quickly. If you miss a jump, bounce off the floor, get out of there, and re-set. The wall jump can also be used as a wonderful distraction, if you can wall jump quickly and accurately, you can distract a group of survivors long enough for a boomer or smoker to make his move. The actual mechanics of the wall jump are generally known, but haven't been specifically discussed much. Left click to jump off wall when you hit it, right? Well, there's much more to it. First off, wall jumping has minimum angle requierments. These numbers aren't quite concrete, but they are very close to accurate for in game purposes. You must be looking roughly ten degrees away from the wall, and at least 10 degrees up or down, to initiate a wall jump. This creates a conical "jump zone" while you are touching or gliding on a surface you can leap off of. Also, you do *not* have to hold crouch the entire time, and it's actually better if you don't. I'll explain why next...

Jump curving:

Many people know you can slow or even stop your jump mid-air by using the "s" key, but for those of use who have "surfed" in CS or TF2, we know that "a" and "d" are even more useful. Using your mouse look, and "a" and "d" you can curve your jump to an extent. Obviously this has great utility for correcting your aim mid air, but it also has some more technical uses involving wall jumping. First, I'll explain how to curve specifically. To curve left, gradually look to the left and hold "a" mid air, it's the opposite for right. If you are holding crouch, stop it! You're losing a lot of air control if you do, so stand up mid air to better your curving. Now for wall jumping, knowing the minimum wall jump degree "cone" helps here, as you can curve yourself into a wall you would have otherwise missed, and jump off of it. Curving also helps you attack from places survivors can't see. Now, curving leads to an even more advanced tech...

Strafe Jumping, A.K.A, Kai Jumping

This tech comes in two versions, diagonal, and vertical. I'll explain diagonal first, since it's the easier of the two. To attempt this, it would bee a good idea to have wall jumping, and curve jumping mastered first.

Diagonal: To do this, first you must find a relevant place to practice it. No Mercy 1, off of the spawn to the right there is a really tall building with some stairs on it, that's where I suggest to practice both of these. Once there, remind yourself of the jump degree cone, because it's going to be really important. Jump and curve into the wall you want to do this on at a 45 degree angle upward (diagonal is focusing on both horizontal and vertical distance). When you curve into the wall to jump, look 10 degrees away, and jump again, holding your strafe button to curve the entire time, curve *back* into the wall, and do it again. Doing this, you can jump up a single wall diagonally. You can, of course, adjust your angle for what is appropriate, but much under 30 and you start to lost altitude. This is best suited for long flat walls close to areas the survivors pass by, and can easily get 25's in places you can't usually jump from. For vertical distance without much space to work with, try vertical...

Vertical: Much more difficult than diagonal vertical requiers that you have the following mastered: Wall jumping, curve jumping, diagonal jumping, jump cone.

To perform this, begin your jump just as you would for a diagonal, only instead of around a 45 degree angle up, you will need to use something much closer to 75/80. Do your first jump, but instead of holding your strafe key, and looking away from the wall again, turn all the way around towards the wall, going from your beginning strafe key, to "w", to the opposite strafe key.
The goal of this is to keep yourself sliding on the wall the entire time you're turning around, once turned around, proceed just you would with a diagonal jump with an angle of 75-80 still. If you can repeat this, congratulations, you've learned the hardest hunter tech I know of. This is useful for 25's in mostly unknown and unexpected places, much faster setups for jumps, awkward escape angles, and very high angled attacks.

*new* 100% vertical method of vertical oriented hunter jumping. You can climb straight up any mostly flat surface, no matter how thin it is. To do this, simply put your back to the surface you want to climb, hold "s", jump straight up, and wall jump by looking 10 degrees down. While holding "s" you will continually go back to the wall. While this tech gains no horizontal distance, and gains it's vertical the same speed as the strafing method, it is much easier, and just as applicable in many scenarios.

^credit: Foxdie^

This is what I know, and I wanted to share this with the community in hopes of upping everyone's hunter game. If you have anything to add, questions, or corrections, please let me know. Hopefully soon there will be video tutorials to go with this, but until then, send me a PM to add me in steam to practice with me in-game.

Uchiha Obito · 01-31-2009, 01:39 PM

correction for the original guide, height doesn't add to damage, I've watched test videos on this. If you're standing next to a survivor and jump straight up and down, you get 0 additional damage. The wall pounce damage is probably cumulative from distance traveled horizontally between walls. Height only gives you the advantage of additional horizontal distance traveled to add to pounce damage.

DugLess · 02-02-2009, 11:59 AM

I am almost 100% certain that wall pounces reset the distance traveled when calculating damage for a pounce. I've wall jumped down entire corridors and finally hit a survivor for no pounce damage. That said, wall pounces can be used to quickly and dramatically raise the height from which you pounce, without requiring a horizontal surface. You can, if you're a far distance from survivors, and if terrain permits, use a series of wall jumps to both close with the survivors and gain height. I'm pretty sure a wall pounce acts exacly like a regular pounce, so you can really get some good pounce damage with wall jumps.

I think one of the most useful applications of wall jumping is that you can pounce at the survivors from a completely different spot and angle from where you start from. You can essentiallly sit in cover, and pounce, then wall jump from a spot you pick, exposing yourself to less fire, and potentially send you in above their melee. Often, a wall jump can make it much easier to hit a specific surivor (very useful in many situations, especially when trying not to hit the incap). A great example of this type of jump would be upstairs at the begining of map 2 of No Mercy. Facing the hole in the floor, you pounce toward the opposite wall, below the hole, and walljump back towards the saferoom. Often you catch the last one on that floor. This can work to great affect if the rest of the team is doing their job.

That all said, it takes a LOOOT of practice to do consistently hit long series of consecutive wall jumps, especially in tight quarters. Practice wall jumps, they are one of the most useful apects of all of the infected.

**Avs** · 02-02-2009, 03:23 PM

To add to Dugless, after the new pounce damage changes, I believe wall jumping + pouncing is moot. In fact, most of the time when I play, I rarely go for distance jumping unless the opportunity is actually realistic (ie. Survivors are walking into that area + I just spawned in the right area to pounce from or can access that spot quickly). Otherwise, since attacks from hunters activate quickly and 8-10+ pounce damage can be done from a horizontal jump (ie. 0 starting height jump or low height jump), it is far more appropriate as a hunter to attack at the right moment when an opportunity presents (as an alternative to dealing massive damage vs initial high pounce damage).

Oh yeah, and light yourself on fire as a hunter whenever you can. I still see a lot of hunters ignore fire or don't use it even when its right around the vicinity.