Originally Posted by Morganan

I listened to that before, and a guy who makes his living off the industry certainly isnt going to criticize it to often, will he? Has he criticized EA for doing warmed over sequels for it's sports franchise? Notice this, which has gone unresponded to for over a month now..
http://negativegamer.com/2009/06/21/...s-out-sessler/

I'm sorry, how many games do you see Xplay review? Does he rate every game 5 stars just because it'll make more industries like him more and will release more games to keep him in business? Somebody needed to think out that one a little more... He's complimenting Valve as a gaming company simply due to the fact that they are one of the LEAST suspected company to be screwing people over.

That's not to even mention the fact that the L4D2 boycott group took Sessler's rant as a direct attack against them. He described the whiners as the groups of younger kids/immature players who felt that the game companies OWED them something. He was referring a lot to the early days of the news of L4D2, and the current day maniacs that still feel that way. The L4D2 boycott group-as a group-believes all the necessary things to make them seem alright guys with just a different viewpoint... But I'm overly willing to bet you that there are still people in the group that don't agree with that and still have the belief that they are entitled to things from the game companies.

That's the baseline for me for continued support, notice no caveats about how L$D and TF2 are different types of games, and thus require different types of support? Nope, he said they are taking the same approach with L$D as TF2, does it really feel like that is the case here? Even the biggest apologist not employed by valve cant say that.

The Orange Box was released October 10th, 2007. The first 'DLC' for the game (the medic update) came out April 29th, 2008. That's 7 months before the medic update was released. And that was a set of achievements, new weapons, and a single map (+ the gamemode for it).

L4D was released mid November 2008, and this first DLC is August 2009. It's been 9 months and the first DLC pack is being released (maps, navmesh for AI infected, storyline, achievements for finishing, etc).

It's not too horridly different.

So the rationale for it being smarter isnt needed in L$D1?

For it to become smarter it needs more tools to work with, as it were. They could release L4D2 with these new SI from the beginning so that they ensure that there aren't any heinous unbalancing or glitching caused by these SI, or they could add the SI to L4D1 and have to edit maps to accomodate for any craziness these new gameplay elements cause, whether that be by editting the maps or otherwise. Which would you rather do, make a new campaigns with just the new SI or make the new campaigns and edit ALL of the previous campaigns to accomodate?

If you want the second option, you could be waiting for DLC for even LONGER.

So areas that need improvement in L$D1 will be addressed in L$D2, for another 50 bucks, nicely done!

Not necessarily improvement, but additions. The gameplay in L4D was one of the better of titles released at the time, not only in it's genre either. It was balanced in a lot of ways and was fun to play with just regular guys on the fly or with buddies who know what they're doing.

L4D2 will be taking these original ideas and gameplay mechanics and adding in things such as melee weapons and certain SI, as well as improvements to the AI director to HANDLE these.

$50 bucks to not have to play in the dark! Yay!

Yes, because that is all that the game offers. Playing L4D's original campaign, only during daytime, that's the only difference.


You're silly.

This one is one of my favorites, so they admit there are issues that they want to fix, and from all news released it appears they are fixed! If of course you pay another 50 bucks to play the game where these issues are fixed.

Stacking in the corners being prevented would have needed the charger SI, which would need the improvements to the AI director, which would need a lot changes to accomodate for this and other additions to L4D2.

Look, I dont have any beef with valve wanting to make money, and I have no beef with valve making L$D2. My problem is going back on statements where they promised "TF2-esque" support, and haven't delivered. (one of my main reasons for purchasing the game) My problem is they admit there are gameplay issues they are not going to fix unless you pay them another 50 bucks.

Refer to my comparison of the times for DLC for both L4D and TF2, again.

I dont work for valve, I'm not a professional mapper for any gaming company, but I can say in under 30 minutes I could "fix" NM3 so once that forklift starts and the horde begins, it will never stop until the survivors cross the roof and use a console in the warehouse offices to turn off the alarm. I could fix nm-4's event in 30 seconds by removing the stretcher. I could fix bh-2's event in 15 minutes by making the panic event last "forever" and adjusting the nav to have more infected spawn in front of the survivors and adding a console at the end of the warehouse to turn off the alarm and end the event. I could fix bh3's event by adding a console in the house that must be activated to "power" the train, and have the first console start the event that doesnt end until the map ends instead of the train. That's just a morsel of the issues plaguing their crescendo events and I'm more then willing to go through them all with you if you would like. If an idiot like me can fix them in minutes each, why cant valve address these problems which they admit are problems? It's all about the money.

So please, go find a coder, or take some time to learn mapping and fix these. I assure you that these 'buttons' are not the only things you will have to deal with.

Besides that fact: You know how we always see the flaws in things after it's been done? Yeah, hindsight is 20/20.

If they want to leave problems dangling in their games as hooks to entice people to purchase a sequel where those problems are addressed, that is most defintely within their rights, but is it not within my rights as a consumer to choose not to purchase their product?

So don't buy it. Just doesn't require the ever-vigilant 'Looks like an attempt to quell the mass' conspiracy theories.

So if I take a job to paint your house, and when I'm all done and paid I offer to throw in painting your deck for free, I can do any kind of job I want knowing full well you wont complain because it was free?

If you offered a service (Your Painting/the DLC), that was decent, and I thought it should be done (Having my deck painted/releasing DLC) you'd bet I would have you paint the deck. You know, especially if I didn't have plans to actually do it myself.