poe

That right there would make this a magnificently better map. Or perhaps extending the house, making all of it a double-story (not just the front wing).

Terrorist Aspect
I cannot stand Terrorist on this map. One, I am far too restless to stand still for too long. Two, I'm a sniper-whore, and the terrorists are basically surrounded on every side by snipers. Three, there is NO cover for terrorists.

A house where you can be seen from -some- angle unless you are crouching is not cover. As it stands, there are two places of complete cover for the terrorist. One is that little brown HE-hungry shack, which is only for the stupid or the daring, and that tiny section behind the house, along the inside of the "L". But neither are close to significant.

The house needs to be more like cs_escape, with room to move and places to safely hide. And more sneaky ways for the Counter-Terrorists to extract the hostages (I have seen this done twice successfully... and failed more times because hostages apparently DON'T want to be rescued).

My suggestion for the map is to take the current house, and stretch it. Keep the same "L" shape, but add a couple more rooms, and not surround them with wall-wide windows. I could do some possible sketches if there was somebody willing to modify it, and somebody capable of doing a fluent, seamless job.

Don't get me wrong, though. I've played where terrorists have been fun... it's all in teamwork and communication.

Counter-Terrorist Aspect
On the Counter-Terrorist side, I love the map. With proper teamwork and coordination, this map is amazing. Smokes and flashbangs do wonders, and with sniper cover a successful rush to the house can be terribly satisfying. Of course, I'm a major sniper, so it's obvious I enjoy the counter-terrorist side. There are many places to snipe from (albeit with too little cover), and you can be an amazing part of the team by relaying valuable information such as terrorist locations, open areas, and protecting your allies to properly execute plans.

As I said, I've seen hostages rescued only twice successfully. There are two reasons for this. One, hostages are morons that get stuck left and right. The second reason is because it's only worked when the LAST terrorist (or in one instance, two), were off dallying around the shed or some such place. I think it was me who distracted them both times, hurling smokes and flashbangs, while cutting off their movements with sniper/pistol fire. But really, it was luck. The terrorists need but stay at/around the house, and the hostages will never be rescued.

Conclusion
Great map! The house just needs to be updated some, and the terrorists will be able to enjoy it more, too.


On a last thought... maybe something of a "cellar" to the house, with a pair of hostages moved down there. There could be a door leading down at the back of the house, at the inside that corner of the "L". There could be either one semi-large room, or an entrance-room with the hostage room deeper inside. This could give another hopefully pleasant aspect to the map, with possibly a rally point for the counter-terrorists. It would also allow the terrorists a place to safely reside, and retreat to. It would also further encourage the safe rescue of at least one pair of hostages. Thoughts?

radicaldreamer

Very true, I'm always on the T side on harvest, and i occasionally hear complaints from my side. The odd time I'm a CT on harvest, i hear no complaints what-so-ever.

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SkidMark

Umm.. Radical is your sig bigger than 468x100?

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Ferret

I don't mind being a Terrorist on this map. I don't have a problem with sitting in the house in one spot the whole time. It doesn't bother me. I just don't feel the need to constantly be moving.

With that said, I prefer being a CT - on every map. It's just a weird preference for me I guess. When I think of being a Terrorist, I feel like Al Qaeda or something, and I'm not a fan of them. :/

AzzMan

I almost always prefer CT. It's more fun to defuse and grab the hosties than to plant and make sure no one grabs the hosties, in my opinion.

SuperSteve

I am the same Azz, that and I prefer all CT weaponry.

Acid

as i can see this is your first post here at tg, let me be the first to officially welcome you to this great community. Please read the CS:S Rules, Announcments and SOP's in my sig. it seems ive taken up the job of welcoming our newbies to tg and telling them to read the Rules, Ann.......... (and so on).


for the topic (cs_harvest) i really dont like it. i think it is way too big and most of it never gets used. it needs more barriers and defensive points like a wall you have to climb over on the right side or a bunker or more cars and houses. its just way too wide open. what i REALLY hate is when we camp the hostie house, someone always, ALWAYS picks up their auto gun and just bullet spamms the house. they shoot through the entire house killing or injuring everyone in it. the hosties are protected somehow from all of this mayham. just my thoughts .

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Karkianman101

The next time someone shoots a bullet through a wall into a room with a hostie, find out who it is and report them. That is against the rules, and I will slay for it if it seems to be on purpose and doesnt stop.

Ferret

Well, to be fair, there is a difference between blindly firing into a hostage rescue area (in this case the two windows) and shooting through the windows or walls when you absolutely know you have a target in sights - a target that is not in front of or behind a hostage.

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Vulcan

If you have a safe target to hit, like a T model poking out of the wall then kill them. But to be honest i'd love to see this map removed, It allows for to much complaining about problems that are based on the map rather than the actions of the player.

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Root

Yes the map has faults with it, but I can't understand why there are so many complaints.

Tell you what, if someone wants to remake the map (pcs_harvest), I'll consider replacing the existing version. Vulcan is too busy, so don't look to him.

If anyone is brave enough to take up my challenge, PM me to discuss what needs changing. <waits for someone to post here instead of PM'ing me>

Root

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SkidMark

I also dont understand what the complaints are all about. Personally I like it and I know the T side can be a bit boring, but you know what? Deal with it....

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9 v

There's only one thing more i hate than harvest, and that's compound. Actually, two; compound, and having my teeth taken out by a drug-crazed horse dentist.

i'm with p3lvi5 on this one. Too open and yet still too linear. i don't like maps where the emphasis is on sniping so much. i rarely play as T, as short of going off into the hayfield (certain death) or right to the shed/garage (certain death), there's not much more to do than sit in the house (eventual certain death).

i'm not saying it's a bad map in itself, although i agree the house from retreat would improve it a lot, i'm just saying that i, as an incompetent scoper, find it dreadfully boring and unimaginative, and wish it to be taken from this place and be hanged until quite dead.

AzzMan

So many mixed opinions at this point! I'm suprised.

R_Yell

I'm surprised too

Hi everybody, I'm the guy who made this map. Very interisting discussion, I admit the map isn't perfect, and I'd like to make an improved version some day. But you should know my thoughts first:

About the house: I did it very weak and small intentionally. The map is not meant to be a "defend the house style map" because it would be a wasted map. Ts need to rush and fight CTs at some point, or flank them using one of the "linear" routes. IMO, this map would not be better with a large house to be filled by Ts, no point to CTs other than cross a large map to siege a house.

Someone uses "alternative" way to second house floor?

About Ts, they should try to control barn, this is their objective. Forget the house and forget hostages, take the barn. If you play with bots that's they do, and it works.

I did some betatesting with people and bots before release, but cannot play it online because all servers kick me (because ping, where I live there is no other thing than 56k ). Is really so hard for Ts do some kind of rush?

Well, in the near time I'll can't work in a cs_harvest 2 because I'm involved in other proyects. But I would like to betatest my next map with people like you. It's a map located in a big cargo ship, objective will be hostage rescue too, has nothing more in common with harvest. There won't be much sniping, this will be a close combat map:




Some large corridors can be seen, but that's because is an early WIP. Lateral deck corridors will contain several objects for cover.