Re: TGNS Map Making Team

**Xerond** · 09-05-2006, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by xtcmen

I don't know much about map making, but I can help balance rooms and such. If you need me to help playtest and give advice then let me know. I'm also pretty good and finding any exploits and stuff.

Ditto what xtc said, any playtesting help needed let me know.

**Irish Pirate** · 09-05-2006, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by CryForMe

unfortunately i see one problem with your map design: in order for aliens to be able to put up all 3 hives, marines either HAVE to relocate, or aliens have to destroy MS, which means they already won.

The point is for smaller games. 3 hives should not be necessary. I only have to worry about handing the marines an early 2 hive lock.

The map may show a slight alien bias to adjust for the automatic one hive lock down. Keep in mind though, instead of getting a third hive aliens are getting a movement rush to the marine base.

All marines would really have to do to lock down the aliens would be relocate to the empty hive. Beacon = hive rush with no phase gates needed. If the aliens do take that hive after a relocation oc placement would be a nessecity. Once again, small games. If you think small games it makes more sense.

I will have plenty of time for testing/balancing.

**Curlydave** · 09-05-2006, 08:34 PM

A full-sized NS map takes alot of time and effort to make. I'll gladly help out if we do a community map. Someone could make a detailed design, and assign people to do different parts. We could then edit it to make the feel consistent.

I'm ok with trying to do a map with a hive in MS, but is it possible to prevent it from being the starting hive? A good first step would be a drawing of the layout, and atmosphere description.

**blu.knight** · 09-05-2006, 08:49 PM

YES CURLY IT IS POSSIBLE. for the 50th time. It's an *extremely* simple plugin to write. And it would need to be done via a plugin, not in the map, but it is most certainly possible.

**Sirusblk** · 09-05-2006, 09:03 PM

Kudos to Mom for showing all those links, otherwise I'd be lost.

I'm sorry, I'd really love to work by making a map. But I just don't know how to go from setting up my Hammer Editor, coupled in the Source Software Developement Kit, to making it work with NS maps. I'll try to experiment on my own and figure it out, but if there was a strict "How to setup Hammer for NS" with the current Hammer version, it would save me alot of time and grief.

I try my best to be at my geekiest, but this is one technical problem that should be solved all in one tutorial, with all the stupid questions answered for those with the damaged geeky egos.

If this really takes off, I'd be willing to lend some of my bandwidth from my website to host pictures and the map itself when it gets done.

-Sirusblk

**Kerostasis** · 09-05-2006, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by Irish Pirate

The point is for smaller games. 3 hives should not be necessary. I only have to worry about handing the marines an early 2 hive lock.

The map may show a slight alien bias to adjust for the automatic one hive lock down. Keep in mind though, instead of getting a third hive aliens are getting a movement rush to the marine base.

All marines would really have to do to lock down the aliens would be relocate to the empty hive. Beacon = hive rush with no phase gates needed. If the aliens do take that hive after a relocation oc placement would be a nessecity. Once again, small games. If you think small games it makes more sense.

I will have plenty of time for testing/balancing.

You could somewhat alleviate this by placing the Hiveroom a short distance from Marine start. Make it just close enough that seiges can be placed in the marine start room, but with good alien acess to the seige point if they want to try and defend it. For example, let me try a code map.

Code:

             (rest of the map)
	      |   |
	      |   |
	 -----I   I-------
	|                 |
	| Marine          |
	| Start	          I---
	| Here        (seige) |
	|             (range) |
	 ----------------     |
	                 |    |
	                 |    |
	             ----I    I-----
	            |               |
	            | RT       Hive |
	            |               |
	             ---------------

CryForMe · 09-05-2006, 10:29 PM

i like kero's idea, however, make it so that aliens have more than one way in/out of that hive (vents and such) and that the marines cant actually get into the hive, perhaps a weldable off of MS that allows you to get in siege range, but it's a very long weldable so if aliens happened to start off in that hive, they have time to move out and do stuff before they're insta-sieged, or simply make it so that the siege area to that hive doesnt open until like 5:00 or so.

**blu.knight** · 09-05-2006, 11:46 PM

Cry, in these small maps the aliens would not be able to start in the MS hive.

**Irish Pirate** · 09-06-2006, 12:25 AM

I was considering that approach kero. The only problem I see is limiting the usefulness of the movement rush. I figured at any rate the aliens would need easy vent access to the hive just so they could drop it (most gorges have trouble running in to MS).

If I make it in a vent only area where marines require sieges to destroy it then I think it might become a bit too powerful as a base rushing tool. I guess as long as the aliens wait until they have the second hive up I don't mind but the question should never come up "do we drop the second hive or go for the movement rush" unless the aliens are losing and the second hive is already locked down or something.

I might do something like that only where there are some holes in the walls marines can shoot the hive through.

**Kerostasis** · 09-06-2006, 12:36 AM

Well certainly, add some vents, but my ability to draw details was limited by my choice of graphics.

I would have a ceiling-exit vent right next to the hive, with a small room a short ways back to allow an alien to access the room from the vent and go Gorge in safety right there. Make it big enough to drop some chambers in even. Then connect that vent out to the main map somewhere that cant be easily blocked.

While you're at it, add a second smaller vent to connect the Hiveroom to Marine start, for easier skulk access to the backside of the seiges.

**Irish Pirate** · 09-06-2006, 12:38 AM

Word of advice to anyone setting up Hammer, the site mom linked tells you how to set up hammer for compiling. Don't use hammer for compiling. I use a program called 'batch compiler' and recommend it to anyone who compiles maps.

Also, it's a good idea to compile after your first room and get a feel for the size. It's very sad if you create something in hammer and the dimensions are not what you were expecting.

**Yer Mom** · 09-06-2006, 01:25 AM

Wow, interests sure sparked.

I'm currently learning, but I'm probably a bit farther ahead of everyone here. I know the basics, and how to set Hammer up and everything.

I'm going to host a TS session for a beginning tutorial on map making soon.

I need dates and times available. I'm thinking... today is Tuesday. Thursday at 5PM central?

Originally Posted by Irish Pirate

Word of advice to anyone setting up Hammer, the site mom linked tells you how to set up hammer for compiling. Don't use hammer for compiling. I use a program called 'batch compiler' and recommend it to anyone who compiles maps.

Also, it's a good idea to compile after your first room and get a feel for the size. It's very sad if you create something in hammer and the dimensions are not what you were expecting.

Irish is right, but he's also leaving something out. To be able to compile and run the map (as far as I can tell) you have to have several things that are required by the game for the map to be "runnable". I don't think these are required to be in the map for you to be able to actually walk around inside of the map, but you have to atleast have an entity inside of a room that serves as a player start when the map is loaded. (Don't quote me on any of that)

The list of things that are required for the map to run is here:
http://www.unknownworlds.com/portfol...info_join_team

I believe the guidelines listed under required entities have to be in the map before the map will actually be playable. I'm not sure that the map won't run without those entities.

As far as the Teamspeak session goes, you're going to need two files downloaded to be ready for the session. The first file is Hammer which is located here: http://collective.valve-erc.com/index.php?go=hammer
The second file is ZHLT, which is located here: www.zhlt.info (you want the 32 bit file unless you're running the new 64 bit processors).

With those two files downloaded you'll be ready for my beginner's tutorial on Hammer. We'll set everything up, create a room and a few objects, apply textures, and make a few entities. The entire session could last an hour at the most.

Give me feedback.

-Mom

**Sirusblk** · 09-06-2006, 01:33 AM

That would be great mom, would you have how to set up hammer as well? Hopefully I'll be able to attend, can't see a reason why not.

-Sirusblk

**Slayer of Hippies** · 09-06-2006, 02:28 AM

It might be interesting to play a game where rines were defending.

**Wyzcrak** · 09-06-2006, 02:36 AM

Originally Posted by Slayer of Hippies

It might be interesting to play a game where rines were defending.

You and seven of your closest friends join marines. Adj goes lerk. Problem solved.

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