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01-12-2006, 05:11 AM #16
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Originally Posted by Card AKA Karrd
The trap is a very effective one, but I must say, I think the situation is exceedingly idealistic. I agree with lazyeye when he said that there are much more useful things to do with mines. HOWEVER, if one finds themselves with mines nowhere near a spot in which they actually need them, then great.. mines definately help. It could be argued, as Kerostatis suggested, that all things being equal, a vanilla marine should own a vanilla skulk in such a hallway when all the marine has to do is WAIT. If he does not, it is a matter of patience or aim. In which case, he woulda blown it anyways w/ mines.
Truth be told, most commanders cannot afford to spend 10 resources on a 'scout' unit on pubs, as most pub players must rely on luck when they go it alone.
However, I think most people could use a reminder about the actual purpose of a mine. It is very, very hard to mine a structure in such a way in which it is completely protected from skulk attack. It is even MORE difficult to place do this against a wall, which is where most buildings like to be. A mine without a marine is not a defense at all. The mine only limits the options of a skulk, but without marine supervision, the skulk should easily find a way to take out your structure.
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01-12-2006, 10:04 PM #17
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
That gives me an idea...
*grins evilly*
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01-13-2006, 03:44 PM #18
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Oh, brother...
btw kero where is your avatar from? I definately recognize it.. maybe final fantasy I or II? :P
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01-13-2006, 08:24 PM #19
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
*ding ding ding*
We have a winner!
Garland...the first, extremely weak boss from FF1. Also show up in the plot again much later in the game.
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01-17-2006, 11:35 AM #20
- Join Date
- May 2004
- Posts
- 370
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
I've done something similar recently, but for much larger aliens. I've been dropping a tf, armory, something similar in the doorway of MS or some other room I know they're going to come into. I then drop at least 3 packs of mines and have the marines spread them around the TF, mostly on the side marines will be on. If you block the other entrance with marines, the aliens always try to go for the "clear" exit, and in there hurry they smack right into the structure, fall down and land on a ridiculous number of mines. I tallied 5 onos, a fade, 3 lerks, and a good number of skulks doing this at least 5 times on servers I played on yesterday. Doesn't break any rules, and it pretty effective res and tactic wise. It'll make them think twice before charging into a room full of marines.
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01-17-2006, 11:38 AM #21
- Join Date
- May 2004
- Posts
- 370
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Originally Posted by aesop rock
I see people do this all the time. When you mine base, the commander needs to be of sufficient aim to be able to get out and hose down skulks pretty easily. Watch my base placement and you'll see I always place structures so that I have maximum time to get out and kill skulks. When large guns appear I always drop myself one because most people do not expect the comm to hop out with a HMG to defend base. The reason this works is mines make it difficult for the alien to manuver. I also place one right in front of where I will appear out of the CC, so if someone does get the jump on me they get a nice surprise when they try to chew on my ankles.
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04-14-2006, 01:24 AM #22
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Hi everyone, I should be coming back some time in the near future so I took a look through the forums and couldn't help but reply here
Aesop rock unintentionally pointed out one of the key reasons why this is a good idea. At the end of his reply he commented that mines only limit the options of a skulk. That's the whole point, to force the skulk into making a choice between options you have given him. Tactically, it's not very useful, strategically though it allows you to get the other team to dance to your beat.
Oh, and hi everyone, it's been awhile."Chance favors the prepared mind" -Sir Isaac Newton
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05-15-2006, 04:38 PM #23
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
During World War two minefields were not placed solely to destroy enemy units like they are used in modern warfare. They were well marked, documented and strategically placed to force enemy formations to go around them, slowing their movements or pushing them into a disadvantageous position.
One of my favourite tactics is the Random Mine. Marines simply place mines in high traffic corridors and vents all over the map to kill skulks who aren't paying attention (which is common since skulks, if they're anything like me, take their getting around-ness for granted and focus on getting to the destination if they don't hear marines around). This can have some aggravating consequences, especially when there's one mine in a vent somewhere and it is not worth bringing in a fade or a gorge to clear it. The skulk can either risk blowing themselves up if they want to proceed, or turn around and find another route. This in turn can slow down skulks that are running around to eat res nodes where marines don't patrol much, and disrupt their movements. Even if the mine doesn't kill them, they may very well waste more time finding an alternate path. If that means a res node survives more ticks, then the mine pays for itself.
I'm not really a fan of complicated placement or coordination tactics, since in pick-up games it's pretty unrealistic to expect your players to be that well coordinated (People blocking their teammates line of sight is a more serious and simpler thing to fix, yet so many still do it.) I'm not a clan quality player and I tend to choose tactics that don't rely on having a skilled, well coordinated marine team.
A nifty mine placement strategy isn't as important in my mind as choosing siege locations that are easy to defend and placing structures so they obstruct alien movements. I've been in a few games where a siege and phase gate is placed around a corner where it makes it easy for aliens to approach to melee range without being shot at. Structure placement has pros and cons, although I think I would prefer having obstacles in the alien's path so there is no clear run at a bunch of marines for a fade, skulk or Onos and they always risk getting caught on something, allowing marines more time to shoot them.
As a standalone defence I don't think the mine thing would work. For one, it is based on the assumption that skulks will choose to charge through and attack the marine, or that they would attack one at a time. Skulks are always more mobile than marines, and it's pretty easy in most cases to use a vent and go around to the rear or avoid such a trap entirely. It will only work if the enemy actually goes through it, and that you can affort to have marines sitting there camping it. Unless of course, the skulks HAVE to go through it, which makes this tactic more useful as a response to a concerted attack. If the marine(s) guarding the trap go, then it becomes useless no matter what. So really you need to put it where skulks have to go through and will continue to go through. If the marines have time to place it I can see its usefulness during sieges or in holding important rooms such as double node rooms, since aliens are forced to try and run a gauntlet to attack. I see its best use as a cheap way to fortify a location that needs to be held and will be constantly guarded.
At least, that's how I see it.
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05-16-2006, 06:47 PM #24
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Who told you its not done that way anymore? Most advanced nations have signed so many land mine treaties by now that thats the only way they CAN use landmines. Random, unmarked mines are generally the hallmark of guerilla warfare.
Originally Posted by Fleeb
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05-17-2006, 03:39 PM #25
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Since I'm pretty sure answering that would derail this thread and take it down a very grim and serious road, I think I'm just going to accept that some people use them differently.
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05-19-2006, 12:42 AM #26
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
- Posts
- 17
Re: Mines: Chariot Trap
Place a mine around a TF/Phase/IP and the aliens will avoid or bile it. Put it on some random wall
and you'll kill that fleeing Fade/Lerk/Onos......The alien fails because it cannot embrace the Emperor.
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