Re: Tactical Infantry Squads?

**Fishbone** · 07-14-2008, 03:51 PM

You are quite right, Wickens. As SL you do have the responsibility of entertaining your SMs. They are not just there to be used. Sometimes that is tough as the game reaches a stalemate or constantly driven back without being able to give your squad a (small) victory. And as some of the others wrote, you need to be aware of staying on top and not getting tired of it. Once my leadership starts to drop the squad usually starts to fall apart and people will leave. Still remember when I kept ordering "Follow me." too often and a SM replied with "Following, squad leader" and leaving within the minute.

*

I got one more game going today and that was with |TG|GhostDog as SL and I had a great tactical game. It is just great to see a fellow SM covering a corner when you were crossing a street and when moving in column to see all directions being covered.

*

Tomorrow I will be playing a few games during European daytime. I will name my squad either TRAINING or TAC INF. Feel free to join me or leave a message with your ingame name so that I can invite you. Also if you want to lead a squad and need a fireteam leader than name your squad likewise and I would be more than happy to join as SM. My ingame name is |TG|Fishbone.

**Ivan_the_bad** · 07-15-2008, 03:16 PM

Ah fishbone good too see some one also tryng to impliment tactics. I pretty much always have a squad running, and sometimes i brake it down into 2 fire teams, if i feel the players in my squad are willing to do so. More often than not fireteams work very well even with the newbie players but like wickens said dont let the one round of misunderstanding put you off.
If you do wanna impliment some tactics and are looking for people to be in the squad or FT lead, just send me an invite i'd be more than happy to help out, and explain to new people how it works

**imnotacanadian** · 07-15-2008, 05:52 PM

Guerilla tactics triumph every time.

**Grunt 70** · 07-15-2008, 06:21 PM

Hey Fish,

I was a long time member of the 1st MIP. Great thanks are due to John Canavar for his vision and leadership of the 1st. John we miss you buddy.

It makes me feel good you are looking at 1st MIP tactics. Most of our work was based on real life US Army and US Marine Small Unit infantry manuals. Mostly RL stuff adapted to fit the virtual environment. I think it's important to remember when the 1st was at it's best we had a core group of members meeting at least once a week to practice formations and tactics. Typically this would last an hour or so and be followed by a group session on the TG server. Eventually what looks like an overwhelming amount of instruction and detail in the 1st MIP SOP's became instinctual and seamless. It was truly a thing of beauty. While it's easy to recognize and understand the tactics its another thing altogether to implement them in a combat (virtual or otherwise) situation. Defense was our key. Once rooted on a flag we were very difficult to defeat.

What we came to realize was this style of play was impossible to implement with random squad members. The SOP's were too much to explain and too much to remember from someone who would be gone to another squad or on the other side next round. I think without a dedicated squad working regularly you may come up against those same issues.

Don't give up employing those sound tactics though. Big Gaay Al did some great work simplifying the approach used by the 1st for randomly created squads in PR. I think you'll find many of his concepts easy and quick to implement in the PRM environment.

Good luck. You'll find me fighting mostly on the island of Sahrani these days.

Armed Assault is more of a combat simulator than a game and had much better potential than PR for the types of things we were trying to do. Unfortunately the wheels kind of fell off for the 1st just as Armed Assault was beginning to get popular here at TG. Look me up if you ever get the game. There are many like minded folks playing this title and many if not most of us strive for real life tactics in our game play. Given your post I think you'd find it to your liking.

Cheers.

**Sabre_Tooth_Tigger** · 07-15-2008, 08:08 PM

Originally Posted by imnotacanadian

Guerilla tactics triumph every time.

Too true, just try marching the team down the centre of the map in a column formation and see how it goes. That'd be a laugh actually

**peardog** · 07-15-2008, 08:13 PM

fish .. have you tried ARMA yet... Good squad stuff possible..and at times required to survive...

**Googol** · 07-15-2008, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by Sabre_Tooth_Tigger

Too true, just try marching the team down the centre of the map in a column formation and see how it goes. That'd be a laugh actually

That'd be fun and good target practice

**BigGaayAl** · 07-17-2008, 03:13 AM

Grunt is right on the difficulties of implementing this kind of approach in game. I try every time I play, but I rarely get to effectively using the fireteams because there are always one or two clueless guys in the squad that think they are a fireteam by themselves. Even most TG players cannot have the discipline to not run off and do their thing. Many do, but most don't on average, so that doesn't bode well for the non-tg

.

If I do take enough time to get a formation up (most players are like wedge wtf is that?) or something, we can straight away defend our main because by then the usual rush tactics have brough the enemy there.

Basically, to do this, you need to set a date and time and meet up with 4 ppl minimum, and you can then recruit one or two regulars.

For a long time I was calling my squads "pr wedge" after a post I made. Now I changed it back to "discipline" because that is the number 1 thing that people usually lack when joining up.

ps: I love the guys that join, say "great this is the only squad that uses voip", and then get angry and leave when I tell them to drop the sniper kit

. Fools!

**billyinorganic** · 07-17-2008, 02:33 PM

BWAHHAHAHAHAHHA

MONKEY MONKEY WITH RIFLE TOMATO WITH RIFLE BUGS WITH GRENADES AND 40ml OF OCEAN WATER WITH INGREEEDS FOR FLASHY FLASHY.

BEST WAY TO GET SQUAD TO DO YOUR THING. DO NOT MAKE ERRORS, ALWAYS BE RIGHT AND SQAUD WILLL FOLLOW EVNE IF PUB. ERROR IS LIKE THIS

"WE HAVE TO CAP THIS FLAG GO NOW IT"S EMPTY"
RUN TO FLAG AND DIE. YOU WERE WRONG, IT WAS NOIT EMPTY.

MUST SPEAK IN A WAY WHICH ALLOWS YOU TO NEVER BE WRONG...
FOR EXAMPLE, "WE NEED TO GO TO THIS FLAG AND CLEAR IT OUT"
RUN TO FLAG DIE... YOU WERE NOT WRONG (maybe in the need to go part eh?) NO ASSUMPTIONS WERE MADE..

THIS AND MANY OTHER

**starstriker1** · 07-17-2008, 04:42 PM

I am suddenly and overwhelmingly bewildered.

**BigGaayAl** · 07-19-2008, 02:48 AM

Originally Posted by billyinorganic

BWAHHAHAHAHAHHA

MONKEY MONKEY WITH RIFLE TOMATO WITH RIFLE BUGS WITH GRENADES AND 40ml OF OCEAN WATER WITH INGREEEDS FOR FLASHY FLASHY.

BEST WAY TO GET SQUAD TO DO YOUR THING. DO NOT MAKE ERRORS, ALWAYS BE RIGHT AND SQAUD WILLL FOLLOW EVNE IF PUB. ERROR IS LIKE THIS

"WE HAVE TO CAP THIS FLAG GO NOW IT"S EMPTY"
RUN TO FLAG AND DIE. YOU WERE WRONG, IT WAS NOIT EMPTY.

MUST SPEAK IN A WAY WHICH ALLOWS YOU TO NEVER BE WRONG...
FOR EXAMPLE, "WE NEED TO GO TO THIS FLAG AND CLEAR IT OUT"
RUN TO FLAG DIE... YOU WERE NOT WRONG (maybe in the need to go part eh?) NO ASSUMPTIONS WERE MADE..

THIS AND MANY OTHER

Hmm lol confusing. Perhaps your post is a bit too ehh...organic?

**Fishbone** · 07-19-2008, 03:54 AM

Update: I am getting more confident with leading (even commanding isn't scary anymore) and now I know that I should lead when I am fresh. If a previous game went bad for some reason or when I am tired then I make mistakes and forget things. The squad "feels" this, loses cohesion and orders are not as readily followed.

I have seen players returning to my squads and even thanking me for inviting them even though the honour is all on my side. So hopefully I will start to get a few people that know what my goal is and then I will start practicing tactics more and more.

Last night we assaulted Hilltop on Fools Road. I told the squad to throw smoke from the Southern Entrance and wait for it develop. With the cover we were able to get inside real easy. Although that also have been caused by a previous assault from another squad. The point being is that we are able to execute a coordinated attack. So from now on I have another tactic that I know I can use with "pubbies". Next time I will try getting everyone open the map and assign SMs to attack different positions.

**BigGaayAl** · 07-20-2008, 02:23 PM

I only enjoy playing with a squadleader that give real orders. I don't even care if he yells at me when I make a mistake. After all you're in the midst of a battle.

Another thing is that generally I really appreciate a SL that regularly kicks people. I see it as a sign of respect to the squadmembers that ARE following orders.

My advice to you fishbone is keep it simple. I've found that it is quite hard to even get people to have the right kits. This takes over 5min at the start of the game with a random squad.

GL

**nthamma** · 07-22-2008, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by Fishbone

But before starting on that manual I first need to know wether there is interest in this way of playing and wether anyone is willing to join up with me (as squad leader or fire team leader) in a squad and start teaching it to other players.

Cheers,
|TG|Fishbone

Yes, definitely would love to be a part of this.

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