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Discussion: Project Reality / PR:BF2 - Commanders - Do not fear! My plane leaves tomorrow, Im downloading the game as soon as I
  1. #16

    sirsolo's Avatar

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    Re: Commanders

    Do not fear! My plane leaves tomorrow, Im downloading the game as soon as I get home, and Ill be your dedicated commander for a good while! (Ganna be playing an MMO on a laptop beside me, so Winnar! I wont mind it at all!)

    ~Sirsolo
    |TG-Irr|Sirsolo since 18OCT08.

    Carpe Diem


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  3. #17

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    Re: Commanders

    I agree with Al here, we are missing the doit-your -self capabilities. Sometimes your the only guy not to busy to ferry a truck to the front lines and it gives you more control of placements.

    TG-E1st TacticalGamer European Division | Team up with us today!




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  5. #18

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    Re: Commanders

    I try to be a commander at least once a day. However I notice theres rarely a commander and its not fun being the commander all day. I tend to commanding insurgency maps as a allied commander.
    Sorry I only play Hardcore!


    Pain and suffering are inevitable, misery is not!

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  7. #19

    w.WAREHOUSE's Avatar

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    Re: Commanders

    Quote Originally Posted by sirsolo View Post
    Do not fear! My plane leaves tomorrow, Im downloading the game as soon as I get home, and Ill be your dedicated commander for a good while! (Ganna be playing an MMO on a laptop beside me, so Winnar! I wont mind it at all!)

    ~Sirsolo
    Warhammer Online?
    I used to command PR while playing CoH on my other computer, lol. It's either great practice for multitasking, or complete computer game addiction!

    I don't command now because I am claustrophobic...
    |TG-X|WAREHOUSE

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  9. #20

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    Re: Commanders

    I commanded last nite for 2 rounds..my mike was broke so i needed to type comms (not ideal i know). i got an amount of abuse for my orders. On the insurgency map I felt the team was way too spread out and getting pwned attackin from the nth so i ordered the chopper squad get squads to east of the map to put a FB.......NO JOY no matter how many times I asked etc and asked ALL the squads i was ignored. In the end I had to destroy our FBs (Extreme i agree) so that the squads got concentrated in one area. Next round in barracuda it was the same alot of abuse. I m going to command 1 more time on the server (got a new mike) and if i get the same then i promise not to help out again
    Gerardnm

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  11. #21


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    Re: Commanders

    Quote Originally Posted by gerardnm View Post
    I commanded last nite for 2 rounds..my mike was broke so i needed to type comms (not ideal i know). i got an amount of abuse for my orders. On the insurgency map I felt the team was way too spread out and getting pwned attackin from the nth so i ordered the chopper squad get squads to east of the map to put a FB.......NO JOY no matter how many times I asked etc and asked ALL the squads i was ignored.
    If this ever happens, please report to the admins the SLs who are ignoring your orders. We don't want players like that playing here.



    -- Suits are what you wear when doing things you shouldn’t want to do anyway.

    FROM THE TACTICAL GAMER PRIMER.
    3) Support game play in a near-simulation environment. Where the focus of play would not be solely on doing what it takes to win, but doing so utilizing real-world combat strategy and tactics rather than leveraging exploits provided to players by the design of the game engine.

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  13. #22

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    Re: Commanders

    There is some great feedback here... so thanks for that. I have to be honest and say that I had to remind myself to be constructive and helpful last night. As mentioned above, Gerardnm (aka colmmlynchplayer) was commanding and had a pretty tough time overall. Not only did his mic not work, but he said he couldn't hear us, so all CO/SL communication had to be done via text. Needless to say, this made things very difficult for both him and the SLs. I know I missed text messages a few times because they scrolled out of view so quickly when trying to fight your way through the jungle. When I had a chance, I tried to type replies or explain my squad's movements, but it was tough. In fact, I died twice because I was typing and couldn't exit out quick enough to engage the target.

    But if I could offer some suggestions to anyone that wants to command, here are a few things:

    - Have a functioning mic and headset/speakers. This will make your job infinitely easier. It also allows your SLs to provide the constructive feedback that we've been talking about. If we have to type it in, we're are much more likely not to.

    - Listen to your SLs' inputs. The CO is in charge (we all know that), but just like in the real military he needs to rely on the expertise of his SLs. When I was a captain on active duty and a Master Sgt provided input on something, it carried a lot of weight. The CO needs to do the same thing. If your SLs are people you recognize as experienced, listen to what they have to say... then try integrate that into your strategy/orders.

    - It's important to test different strategies and think outside the box. For example, if only one cache is showing or only one flag needs defending, you probably don't need to send the entire team to that location. Instead, it might be best to have a squad or two search out rally points, find their FOBs, defend key choke points, etc.


    Bottom-line, I know that it's not always easy to command 30 different individuals, but it will get easier and more rewarding as long as you learn from your experience and be receptive to feedback. On a similar note, I once again ask SLs to be helpful when at all possible. "Constructive feedback" means asking the CO if it wouldn't be better to do xyz than the order he just gave you. Quickly explain your strategy, thought process, etc. or why another squad might be better suited for the task... but in the end, remember official TG rule #11: "Squad Leaders are required to follow reasonable orders from their Commander, and all players must follow Squad Leader orders."

    By the way, we've had a few discussions about establishing a commanders course on TG University (TGU). We haven't figured out how to best do this, since most aspects of learning how to command need to involve a living, breathing game, but if there is interest I'm sure we'll find a way to make it happen.

    Thanks,
    |TG-6th| AFsoccer




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  15. #23


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    Re: Commanders

    Quote Originally Posted by AFsoccer View Post
    There is some great feedback here... so thanks for that. I have to be honest and say that I had to remind myself to be constructive and helpful last night. As mentioned above, Gerardnm (aka colmmlynchplayer) was commanding and had a pretty tough time overall. Not only did his mic not work, but he said he couldn't hear us, so all CO/SL communication had to be done via text. Needless to say, this made things very difficult for both him and the SLs. I know I missed text messages a few times because they scrolled out of view so quickly when trying to fight your way through the jungle. When I had a chance, I tried to type replies or explain my squad's movements, but it was tough. In fact, I died twice because I was typing and couldn't exit out quick enough to engage the target.

    But if I could offer some suggestions to anyone that wants to command, here are a few things:

    - Have a functioning mic and headset/speakers. This will make your job infinitely easier. It also allows your SLs to provide the constructive feedback that we've been talking about. If we have to type it in, we're are much more likely not to.

    - Listen to your SLs' inputs. The CO is in charge (we all know that), but just like in the real military he needs to rely on the expertise of his SLs. When I was a captain on active duty and a Master Sgt provided input on something, it carried a lot of weight. The CO needs to do the same thing. If your SLs are people you recognize as experienced, listen to what they have to say... then try integrate that into your strategy/orders.

    - It's important to test different strategies and think outside the box. For example, if only one cache is showing or only one flag needs defending, you probably don't need to send the entire team to that location. Instead, it might be best to have a squad or two search out rally points, find their FOBs, defend key choke points, etc.


    Bottom-line, I know that it's not always easy to command 30 different individuals, but it will get easier and more rewarding as long as you learn from your experience and be receptive to feedback. On a similar note, I once again ask SLs to be helpful when at all possible. "Constructive feedback" means asking the CO if it wouldn't be better to do xyz than the order he just gave you. Quickly explain your strategy, thought process, etc. or why another squad might be better suited for the task... but in the end, remember official TG rule #11: "Squad Leaders are required to follow reasonable orders from their Commander, and all players must follow Squad Leader orders."

    By the way, we've had a few discussions about establishing a commanders course on TG University (TGU). We haven't figured out how to best do this, since most aspects of learning how to command need to involve a living, breathing game, but if there is interest I'm sure we'll find a way to make it happen.

    Thanks,

    Yes this was pretty nuts last night, we split into fire teams and AF told me to take my fireteam down towards the Doc's and help defend while he took his fireteam across the river to search for RP's and squads advancing on the Doc's.

    well colmmlynchplayer was having a tough time and was questioning WHY i was down there at the doc's and not with my squad,,, well the answer was i was folowing orders from my SL who follows orders from the CO. well there were a few trying to tell the CO what was going on and why but he was so frustrated , im sure trying to type, look at the map, read the text and everything else that goes along with CO'ing when you dont have a WORKING mic is just CRAZY!!!!!!

    all though i have never CO'ed and dont believe im ready to do so i do believe a CO should have a working Mic, it would be so much easier on the CO,SL,Fireteams, chopper pilots, armor bergade and so on down the line..

    its just to hard to try to ingage the bad guys and read and type back all at the same time. IMO

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  17. #24

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    Re: Commanders

    I think its best to avoid micromanaging and give people some leeway or at least enough rope to hang themselves. do it now, right now type of orders should not be issued often imo but I'd destroy a firebase if it wasnt relevant too, on a pub you shape the teams travel that way. I want co to be able to demolish rp also


    With text chat it is actively shown in the console (tilde) and you can scroll through that with page up and down. I think there is some delay to it and it wont stay still for long but can be useful sometimes


    If you find yourself in a fair fight, then you have obviously failed to plan properly.

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  19. #25

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    Re: Commanders

    I find giving a SL the reason an order is given helps with how quickly he reacts. I used to say some thing like this:

    "SQ 4 attack South bunker"
    or
    "APC cover north bunker area"

    Now I say:

    "SQ 4 get to south bunker fast or we are going to lose it."
    or
    "APC cover north bunker area so I can send SQ 3 to South village and help cap flag"

    I will also follow up with "Can you do that?" Sometimes they are trying their best but are under contact and have not told you that they are.





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  21. #26

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    Re: Commanders

    Perhaps a few more commander perks might help bring in more willing CO's, like more diverse artillery and missile strikes, the ability to request reinforcements (i.e. spawn a couple of extra APC's, tanks, or even a jet at the main every half hour, but you have to have commanded for fifteen minutes before you can do it). Instead of having to face straight up in the air stuck in the CP, maybe have the commander drive around in a Command Bradley (or faction-appropriate vehicle) that only he can drive, with a slow respawn so they're not driving around at the front. At least that way they could drive around when they get bored, and there'd be a risk factor to keep things interesting, and if it died they would be stuck in the CP until the Bradley respawned.

    Having a commander could also give a ticket every three minutes to your team, or something along those lines, so that in a long, close game having a commander would put your team ahead. One of the problems with commanding now is that it takes so long before you can actually do anything, so more support options would be great.

    So far I've only commanded one round. It was boring. Sure, I can relay information and help coordinate squads, but that can often be more frustrating than rewarding (especially on other servers) and part of being commander is keeping your messages to the SL's short and to the point so that they can talk to their squads, so it wasn't like I could sit there chatting with my team. So I ate dinner, and read a book. I still gave orders, but by the end of the round I just wanted it to be over with, even though we stomped them. I know you guys are trying to keep this as realistic as possible, but I also know you're willing to sacrifice realism for fun in some situations. I think this is one of those situations where a little fun, at the expense of realism if that's the only option, is necessary. Nobody is going to command otherwise.

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  23. #27

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    Re: Commanders

    Ehh I rather like commanding now on the maps that I dislike playing as infantry... Find that its a nice time to go and grab something to eat while waiting for a more preferable map to pop up,

    All as Comm that you need to do is strategize on how effective/good your squads are and where to put them or have them doing, though last time I was commanding my mic for some reason broke (would work in TS but not BF2, restarted BF2 after round and it worked fine) and yea it is a major hassle trying to be comm without a mic, would almost say that it should be against rules,

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  25. #28

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    Re: Commanders

    Quote Originally Posted by w.WAREHOUSE View Post
    Warhammer Online?
    I used to command PR while playing CoH on my other computer, lol. It's either great practice for multitasking, or complete computer game addiction!

    I don't command now because I am claustrophobic...
    I was thinking EVE Online , but now Im not so sure.. probably just ganna go with it anyways.

    SOO DEN
    Im back in Country and my computer! *hugs comp*

    Downloading 0.8 at 217kb/s ATM! 6% done, 2 hours left.

    BUT
    Since I was in Amsterdam Airport for...11 hours.. have have been on the road and planes for over 27 hours.. Im probably going to sleep.........qwerasdfasdfsssssssssssssssssssssss

    ~Sirsolo

    But yeah.. serious about me commanding a whole lot... Ill start tomorrow after I get the rest of my life sorted out.
    |TG-Irr|Sirsolo since 18OCT08.

    Carpe Diem


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  27. #29


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    Re: Commanders

    Quote Originally Posted by AFsoccer View Post

    By the way, we've had a few discussions about establishing a commanders course on TG University (TGU). We haven't figured out how to best do this, since most aspects of learning how to command need to involve a living, breathing game, but if there is interest I'm sure we'll find a way to make it happen.

    Thanks,
    Thinking of that, I think I'm going to prototype a crude, Infantry-only command simulation. Assuming I don't lose interest, I might post it in a few weeks. I'm a programmer, know some Java, some C++, but I need to learn more C++, so I'll be doing it in that, if you care.

    The rest of this post is only for people who care about the idea:

    Concept: Text-only. Give commands like "Squad1 attack enemies G4", or "Squad3 defend E3", etc. it'll make a lot of assumptions, and be inaccurate as an actual simulation, but provide the basic concepts. It will be turn-based, with 30 second intervals. You can give 2 orders in that time, and spot/unspot 4 areas. It will assume that you have good squadleaders who report all enemy contact, and obey orders unquestioningly (probably non-ideal)

    It should play similarly to Risk.

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  29. #30

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    Re: Commanders

    Anyone who is saying Commander role is boring.... I dont think your playing the role right or your squad leaders are totally crap....

    I find Commander role (esp in v0.8) to be the most demanding role out of every role in PR. It requires extremely fast reactions and fast thinking, you have got to be on the ball the entire time, with so much info flowing in all at once if your not sharp and quick you can quickly get overwhelmed and slip up, which directly affects large amounts of players on your team.

    An effective CO should have comms with ALL squads, and after 1 round with the same SL's, things will really start to come together as the squad leaders trust you more and more and you can have the squads work more closely with each other and you can setup more advanced strategies and squad movements.

    When you got 6 or 7 squads all reporting on comms and you are constantly updating the map and directing squad movements, the last thing i can thnik of is boring.... hectic, fast paced, nerve wracking, in-your-face, is what I would describe it as.... if your saying its "boring", you got to be doing something wrong?

    Remember, if a SL is not listening to your orders or responding to your voip (via voip or text), that SL can be kicked from the server if you contact the admin.

    nice thread AF, like to see the ideas keep coming....

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