Re: Stacking Teams. Revived in .85

**TurkishDelight** · 02-13-2009, 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by Paine

You don't have to quote me word for word, I did it myself in my post, which you obviously did not read given your only comment was on the flame via Jeepo. No one in my squad could read chat, or respond to voice, considering my frustration at the time I figured it was fine. This is all beside the point of this thread. Respond to something substantial so we can have a discussion.

"they kicked out buts, what can we do better" is essentially what we are talking about here. They kicked our butts for 6 rounds in a row because of, gasp, hot botton word, teamstacking. I have been on the winning side and I find it to be just as boring/ a waste of my time (which is why I am often one of the few regulars on the losing side). A slim loss is more fun than a large win in my book. Stop representing my attitudes falsely please.

I don't like that word "teamstacking" actually, because it is not an accurate representation of what occurs. No one goes in thinking "hey lets make tonight really boring and get all the competent players on one side" It's more fluid; Cougar's assessment of the causes of "teamstacking" is fair methinks.

That does not, however, go to fixing the problem. Read my bold in the above post for what i think the solution is.

Regardless of what you "Want" me to think, I was present and aware of what you said. Also the context of how you said it is hard to argue when you very clearly defined it with your words.

Representing your attitude falsely would be you saying "Come one guys lets pull together as a team", and me telling people that you had said "My team is stupid".

Unfortunately, your constant comments about your team or squad members were far from positive.

Oh, and your suggestion blows as well.....

BTW I am not flaming you, far from it infact. We are on "Low heat" right now.....

**Redd_Wiggler** · 02-13-2009, 05:19 PM

gawd...this again?

i must be part of the problem, cuz if i get on a team that is not using teamwork i usually leave before the round is over. i am here to have fun, and if it is not fun, i leave and come back later. simple as that. there are thousands of games with many thousands of servers. just sayin.

**caffeine** · 02-13-2009, 05:39 PM

http://unleashthefurybambi.ytmnd.com/

reading is boring. trolling is fun.

**imnotacanadian** · 02-13-2009, 05:41 PM

"Stacking" really is no problem, as stated before. Approximatly a year ago we had an internal scrimmage. The map was Kashan 64 and I was the commander for the MEC side. On our side, plenty of people talked about how hard it was going to be due to how "stacked" the other team was....

On top of being the underdog, literally one third of my team were no shows, and we had to use reserves who were just thrown into the fight.

In the beginning, we had the USMC team back on their heels..and then the round went back and forth again until the late stages. In the last hour or so... we were up by 50-60 tickets. This was done by teamwork and organization... not by individuals at all. Infact, we had no individuals that performed amazingly individually, but only as a team. We didn't even get a formal practice in before the scrimmage. Once we had the huge ticket lead, we dug in at the bunker complex and played defense. The end result was a 17-0 loss for our team, which many acredit to ratbastard strafing our defenses with the A-10 and the final JDAM on our position.

Infact, here is a quote from Disposable, the USMC commander, stating how confident he was in his team...which I presume is due to the individuals the team was comprised of (though, I may be wrong)

Originally Posted by d1sp0sabl3H3r0

Ok, here's the bottom line. We've all played this map about ten thousand times. We know what it takes to win. The only part of the plan I am adamant about us sticking to is the defense of South Village. I want to mess them up badly in the first 5 minutes of the map, and committing forces to stop them from even getting close and bringing 3 APCs into the area to fight should be overwhelming to them. If we can get them off balance and off their plan right from the get-go then we will mop them up - I'm extremely confident in that. I have confidence in our tank crews to get the job done on their initial wave and get control of the map for us to go to work in those first 20 minutes. After that, we'll play it by ear and see how things develop. I'm extremely confident in everyone's ability to play and play smartly, so I feel if I just stay out of your way and let you do what you do, we'll win.

Moral of the story:
When it seems that you are the underdogs in the match, due to what you call "stacking"...take a look. Step up. Be the glue that holds the team together. Yes, the other team might have a few individuals (if you look at the USMC's roster in my AAR, you will see what I was talking about)... but, this should only increase your will to play harder, more tactical, and more teamlike...and therefore increase your chance of winning significantly.

If you do something one round and it doesn't work against a well oiled team... change your tactics during the next round.

**Jevski** · 02-13-2009, 07:21 PM

Another solution. If you see several squads wasting assets, running around with their heads where the sun dosent shine, step up as commander. Tell the SL what to do, and where to go, and if they don't report them and have them kicked, so that they can be replaced by another player willing to teamplay.

You cant do anything when your a SL, and telling other sqd what to do. They may do so, but if they don't there isn't anything you can do but get more frustrated. So use the system. Go commander. Order them or report them.

**onemanwreckingcrew** · 02-13-2009, 08:09 PM

I'm not much of a forum poster but i feel i gotta put in my 2 cents worth...I don't know how long you've been playing in TG server but back in the day it was even much worst. I've had my fair share of getting my butt whooped so hard it wasn't funny. I didn't whine in-game or jumped in the forums and cry about it. "If you can't take the heat, get your ass out of the kitchen", so to speak. PR is a big boys game so man up. You got personal by calling out peoples names and clans, well check this out. I've had experience with you in-game crying and whining lecturing me about how to play they game. So every time i join the server i always make sure i'm on the opposite side, and you wonder why people "teamstack"...

**Doro9** · 02-13-2009, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by Jevski

Another solution. If you see several squads wasting assets, running around with their heads where the sun dosent shine, step up as commander. Tell the SL what to do, and where to go, and if they don't report them and have them kicked, so that they can be replaced by another player willing to teamplay.

You cant do anything when your a SL, and telling other sqd what to do. They may do so, but if they don't there isn't anything you can do but get more frustrated. So use the system. Go commander. Order them or report them.

What is the correct way to report someone during a game? I searched around a bit and did find this example:
TGPlayer -> REPORTING: =OMG=1337 - Jihad Jeeps - mau - 42:17
Admin Bommando is WARNING!!! you for SUICIDE TACTICS ----- (=OMG=1337Skillz)

However, I'm a little confused.... whats the first part "TGPlayer"(is that jus suppose to be my tag)? and "mau"?

thanks

**Namebot** · 02-13-2009, 08:38 PM

Doro: "!REPORTING asshat intentional tk"

do it like that

Let me know if you need help in global chat , I'll switch. Don't check for me on teamspeak, I probably won't be there. Be warned if another 12th shows up I have to knife fight them.

I like the idea of random teams every round, but if it breaks stuff thats bad.

**Hopkin Green** · 02-13-2009, 08:48 PM

As a preface, I don't consider teamstacking to be a major problem. I enjoy PR when my team is winning and when it's losing, but I thought I'd step in and try to clear up some miscommunication.

The argument "If you're on the losing team, all you need to do is step up and start organizing your team" is blatantly deceptive. Almost universally, if you are on the losing side of a game of PR, the members of your team lack strong organizational and communications skills, the core of a skillset we describe as "teamwork". Saying "step up and apply your organizational skills" is a valueless statement if you don't already possess these skills. It's the equivalent of a cal-invite CSS player telling a first time newbie to "just step up and use your mouse to make headshots." Yes, we're all given the same basic tools, but to imply that everyone can wield them equally well is either woefully naive or myopic.

I agree with Bob, in that this is not a problem that deserves an admin response. It's up to the best players to pay attention to the player list and say "hey, there's a lot of us expert organizers and communicators on this team, perhaps the next round would be more fun if I switched." For my part, I'm doing my best to learn as much as I can about PR and hopefully I'll be able to press down hard on the scales in the future when they get out of balance.

I want to give my thanks to all the SLs and COs who step up every day and give their all even when the teams appear wildly unbalanced. My memory is terrible, but every day I see people pushing to better themselves and their teammates, IHS, TG and untagged players alike. Also thanks for putting up with dumb SMs like me when we're already getting crushed

**SnipingCoward** · 02-13-2009, 08:49 PM

this horse is far from dead its a zombie horse, it keeps on rising

i think you have to be made aware of this issue like you have to be made aware of the rules and the tg-primer have to be adressed in new threads in seemingly regular intervals as well

its the same deal you have to be reminded and made aware

if ur not part of the solution, you are part of the problem
but denying it is probably easier, ey?

if i'd know how to +rep some1 i'd give Exacter some points just for lasting longer than I did in this dispute
edit: ninja'd - excelent post - i'd +rep u too Green

**imnotacanadian** · 02-13-2009, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by Hopkin Green

As a preface, I don't consider teamstacking to be a major problem. I enjoy PR when my team is winning and when it's losing, but I thought I'd step in and try to clear up some miscommunication.

The argument "If you're on the losing team, all you need to do is step up and start organizing your team" is blatantly deceptive. Almost universally, if you are on the losing side of a game of PR, the members of your team lack strong organizational and communications skills, the core of a skillset we describe as "teamwork". Saying "step up and apply your organizational skills" is a valueless statement if you don't already possess these skills. It's the equivalent of a cal-invite CSS player telling a first time newbie to "just step up and use your mouse to make headshots." Yes, we're all given the same basic tools, but to imply that everyone can wield them equally well is either woefully naive or myopic.

I agree with Bob, in that this is not a problem that deserves an admin response. It's up to the best players to pay attention to the player list and say "hey, there's a lot of us expert organizers and communicators on this team, perhaps the next round would be more fun if I switched." For my part, I'm doing my best to learn as much as I can about PR and hopefully I'll be able to press down hard on the scales in the future when they get out of balance.

I want to give my thanks to all the SLs and COs who step up every day and give their all even when the teams appear wildly unbalanced. My memory is terrible, but every day I see people pushing to better themselves and their teammates, IHS, TG and untagged players alike. Also thanks for putting up with dumb SMs like me when we're already getting crushed

If you can't step up and do it right now, step up and learn. Trial by fire. How else.

**BoogyLoH** · 02-13-2009, 11:35 PM

I didn't expect to post in a thread like this, but here I am.

First off, I was apart of the last night with Exacter and Paine, and I don't feel the same way. I go off and play the same way no matter what I'm against and I personally enjoy a challenge, so "teamstacking" is something I don't notice. I'm also use to leading newer people, so if my squad doesn't have a regular in it.. it's nothing new to me and I make do, work with them, and show them how to play with a team.

I do however notice when the other team is a lot more organized than mine, and it's usually, but not always, when I see a good sum of regulars and/or IHS on one side and no tags on the other. I understand why IHS and regulars want to stick together, as I've been in the same shoes before during my days playing vBF2 on this server (and those times were also considered team stacking), so I don't care to ask them to break apart. However, when someone yells stack, I'm shocked to hear people say to organize your team, get them on TS, and overcome it, as if to assume we aren't trying our best at doing just that. Telling the other team to get on teamspeak and do something doesn't help if they are already on teamspeak, already leading a squad, and already trying to get other squads to coordinate with them. Additionally, the cockiness of "finally some competition," that I read last night shouldn't have been said. Personally, I loved it. I just joined back on the server and it urged my aggressiveness to "show them what's up". However, for those that have been trying to organize a team, yet can't without a few people that know what they are doing, it's usually taken as an insult.

I agree with Bob and Hopkin in the fact that people do need to take notice of the other team's players if someone starts complaining about teams and those that know how to do something should maybe switch over next round and help someone out. I totally disagree with regulation of this by admins or people pointing "stackers" out, as we've all been apart of a winning team that's doing really well, and let's face it.. it's nice. However, I think we can all agree that almost every game that's posted in the AAR or talked about is evenly matched and goes down to the wire, instead of the 250-300tickets to 0 ones. So let's try and take notice and solve it our selfs the best way possible.

To sum that up: It's okay to be on the same team with friends. If you notice a domination of the other team in multiple games or others crying stack, try and join the other team and help them organize a good, fun game. Telling people to hop on TS, isn't the end all be all solution; we are that solution; our willingness to help the other team and improve the game play of the server. And finally, Cougar is not a god, even if he insists on it. His high scores are only from APCs.. dont let him fool you. <inserting a "=P"? sarcasm is hard to post on the webs.. we all know Cougar is a god.

>

**Exakter** · 02-14-2009, 12:00 AM

Originally Posted by BoogyLoH

I didn't expect to post in a thread like this, but here I am.

First off, I was apart of the last night with Exacter and Paine, and I don't feel the same way. I go off and play the same way no matter what I'm against and I personally enjoy a challenge, so "teamstacking" is something I don't notice. I'm also use to leading newer people, so if my squad doesn't have a regular in it.. it's nothing new to me and I make do, work with them, and show them how to play with a team.

I do however notice when the other team is a lot more organized than mine, and it's usually, but not always, when I see a good sum of regulars and/or IHS on one side and no tags on the other. I understand why IHS and regulars want to stick together, as I've been in the same shoes before during my days playing vBF2 on this server (and those times were also considered team stacking), so I don't care to ask them to break apart. However, when someone yells stack, I'm shocked to hear people say to organize your team, get them on TS, and overcome it, as if to assume we aren't trying our best at doing just that. Telling the other team to get on teamspeak and do something doesn't help if they are already on teamspeak, already leading a squad, and already trying to get other squads to coordinate with them. Additionally, the cockiness of "finally some competition," that I read last night shouldn't have been said. Personally, I loved it. I just joined back on the server and it urged my aggressiveness to "show them what's up". However, for those that have been trying to organize a team, yet can't without a few people that know what they are doing, it's usually taken as an insult.

I agree with Bob and Hopkin in the fact that people do need to take notice of the other team's players if someone starts complaining about teams and those that know how to do something should maybe switch over next round and help someone out. I totally disagree with regulation of this by admins or people pointing "stackers" out, as we've all been apart of a winning team that's doing really well, and let's face it.. it's nice. However, I think we can all agree that almost every game that's posted in the AAR or talked about is evenly matched and goes down to the wire, instead of the 250-300tickets to 0 ones. So let's try and take notice and solve it our selfs the best way possible.

To sum that up: It's okay to be on the same team with friends. If you notice a domination of the other team in multiple games or others crying stack, try and join the other team and help them organize a good, fun game. Telling people to hop on TS, isn't the end all be all solution; we are that solution; our willingness to help the other team and improve the game play of the server. And finally, Cougar is not a god, even if he insists on it. His high scores are only from APCs.. dont let him fool you.

BL I think your a great player and SL. I do respect your opinion, but you were there for 1 of the 'stacked' rounds.

I was there for hours.

Wreckingcrew you and I do see Eye to Eye, because when you are in a vehicle and named asset squad its YOURS, but when I'm in on or using one with my squad, you are somehow allowed to take it and I call you out on it.

Thats all in that regard.

**imnotacanadian** · 02-14-2009, 12:19 AM

Please try to avoid making personal attacks in a public forum. Everybody.

**FFLaguna** · 02-14-2009, 01:50 AM

I hope Exakter and other people in this thread don't get scared away from TG because of the negative replies. This is a thread that pops up time and time again, and I know everybody groaned seeing it again before clicking it.

You just have to live with real or imagined team-stacking, and although a little blunt or heavy-handed, the negative replies in this thread are warranted. Multiple solutions have been floated, but there's essentially nothing that can be done to fix it.

Just don't stop playing at TG. You have it better here than anywhere else. I hope you are enjoying squid leadering, Exakter.

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