Re: Aircraft landing in quinling and kashan!

**Namebot** · 11-30-2009, 07:19 PM

I disagree with the inability for ground vehicles to avoid/retaliate. I'm not sure how to convince you of this without being able to communicate a large portion of my personal experiences and knowledge, which kinda seems like a waste of effort. Perhaps I can show you in game one day. I'll just have to leave it at that.

I've thought of that maneuver for landing, but jets lose agility at low speeds. It would be difficult to pull off.

**chrisweb89** · 11-30-2009, 07:40 PM

Ya for any who haven't flown in PR you need to make most of your lining up while still at med speed because once you hit your lowest speed before you just drop from the sky it is very hard to make even small adjustments let alone come in from a high angle and pull out just to land.

**d1sp0sabl3H3r0** · 11-30-2009, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by Namebot

I disagree with the inability for ground vehicles to avoid/retaliate. I'm not sure how to convince you of this without being able to communicate a large portion of my personal experiences and knowledge, which kinda seems like a waste of effort. Perhaps I can show you in game one day. I'll just have to leave it at that.

I think that the misunderstanding is not that the ground vehicles have an easier time to avoid the ambush, which I won't dispute, but the comparison is valid in terms of the tactics being used by the other team to attempt to ambush the vehicles (both ground and air) when they are most vulnerable.

Also, it might be best to keep some tricks up your sleeves.

**Namebot** · 11-30-2009, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by d1sp0sabl3H3r0

Also, it might be best to keep some tricks up your sleeves.

Who am I gonna share it with? I can't one man any really destructive vehicles :P

**daveyjonesjr** · 11-30-2009, 07:55 PM

Can anyone get the battlerecorder of this round i doesnt seem to find it, I just wanted to reinforce my point, im sure if you watch the BR you could understand better then a bad post full of grammars fault made by me, you could also watch the way i approach my targets, as dive bombing wich give the aa on the ground a chance to shoot me down, i got locked plenty of times and even heard those aa fly past me while im breaking, it was just luck really, the fighters are not an all out invincible assets, and they are extremely vunerable at their lowest speed.

**draeh** · 11-30-2009, 08:09 PM

[thread hijack]

Speaking of the AA vehicles on Kashan... I notice that the MEC AAV makes you wait 30 seconds before the turret becomes active while the US Avenger does not. Is this a feature or an oversight?

[/thread hijack]

**mat552** · 11-30-2009, 09:11 PM

Draeh, considering the hilarious implications of dumping 2000 rounds of .50 into something (a cluster of infantry) as soon as you turn the engine on, I'd say feature. Also, the gaskin makes no noise while the gun is active, but the engine is not. The avenger has two engine noises, one for the engine of the vehicle, and one for the aa portion of it. And the zoom takes a few seconds to be ready.

Also, Dispo, if you'd like to fly, you say something to me next time I'm in the pilots seat, and I'll step down, dunno about anyone else. That goes for every one of you squadleaders that do infantry for those countless rounds too. I'm always thankful for the quality leadership you bring to the table gents!

**snooggums** · 11-30-2009, 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by daveyjonesjr

Can anyone get the battlerecorder of this round i doesnt seem to find it, I just wanted to reinforce my point, im sure if you watch the BR you could understand better then a bad post full of grammars fault made by me, you could also watch the way i approach my targets, as dive bombing wich give the aa on the ground a chance to shoot me down, i got locked plenty of times and even heard those aa fly past me while im breaking, it was just luck really, the fighters are not an all out invincible assets, and they are extremely vunerable at their lowest speed.

Give me the date and time and I will download if it is still posted.

**daveyjonesjr** · 11-30-2009, 10:16 PM

Originally Posted by snooggums

Give me the date and time and I will download if it is still posted.

It was on the 29, at around 5pm if i remember correctly, gmt eastern time

**d1sp0sabl3H3r0** · 11-30-2009, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by mat552

Draeh, considering the hilarious implications of dumping 2000 rounds of .50 into something (a cluster of infantry) as soon as you turn the engine on, I'd say feature. Also, the gaskin makes no noise while the gun is active, but the engine is not. The avenger has two engine noises, one for the engine of the vehicle, and one for the aa portion of it. And the zoom takes a few seconds to be ready.

Also, Dispo, if you'd like to fly, you say something to me next time I'm in the pilots seat, and I'll step down, dunno about anyone else. That goes for every one of you squadleaders that do infantry for those countless rounds too. I'm always thankful for the quality leadership you bring to the table gents!

I appreciate the offer. I actually flew a havok the other day with Brummy and didn't do too bad.

I understand that some of my comments my be interpeted as saying our pilots are incompetent. Nothing could be further from the truth - the guys who fly all the time are excellent and do the team a great service. I have other issues with the same guys flying though, and that is that new players to the server don't get to fly and issues usually arise over misunderstandings of the asset rules, etc. I don't mean to hijack the thread with this, because this is not what the thread is about, but after a conversation I had today via pm I thought I should publicly clear up my position on the pilots.

Thanks.

Delta*RandyShugart* · 11-30-2009, 11:28 PM

I could land planes easily on the carrier on the gulf of Oman map.

**daveyjonesjr** · 11-30-2009, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by Delta*RandyShugart*

I could land planes easily on the carrier on the gulf of Oman map.

It is not hard on pr as well, you just need to know the trick wich is pretty easy, to keep a steady speed you just need to keep your throttle at 20-30%, at around 800-900 speed, then reduce as your are adjusting with the runway , then its a piece of cake. Bailing out of the jets when your landing too fast happens sometimes too.

Maybe a TGU on aircraft close air support would attract and teach the players who dont know how to use it but would want to know. because people arent fighting for those assets anymore.

**Celestial1** · 12-01-2009, 12:14 AM

Originally Posted by d1sp0sabl3H3r0

In both examples (the OP and the examples following), the other team is camping an area where:

a) they know the enemy has to pass to return to or exit their main
b) they are exploiting the choke point in the map, whether it is by design of the mapper or the game engine itself (map size forces airbases to be too close to a war zone)
c) the team being "camped" is completely at the mercy of their opponents and do not have the initiative in the engagement
d) there is no other way for the valuable assets, be them jets or tanks or logistic trucks, to get through the ambush position without suffering a loss, after which the team may retaliate
e) in both examples, the team with the most to lose may defend the area being camped if they so choose to

Rule 5.5: Access directly out of the main may not be blocked or impeded by mines, c4, or other means; this kind of example rarely be applied to map... one that has such a chokehold that wouldn't violate this rule isn't likely.

If there is no way to avoid the ambush, and it's directly outside of their main, it's against the rules.

AAV outside of US main on Kashan is pretty much like having a spandrel waiting for you outside of your base that you can't kill even if you see him before he sees you, and he will kill you, guaranteed. When flying a jet on your final pass to land, your speed and altitude are so low that it is literally impossible, unless the gunner has narcolepsy and you flew in with good timing, to escape. You can use afterburners, spam all flares, crank up the speed, whatever, it's going to get you.

And if you try to go for a gun run, you will likely not have enough speed to pull out of the attack run.

So it's really a losing situation. There's nothing that can be done, even if you make 14 circles over the runway he might roll up on your 15th pass, when you're going to land. It sucks, and there's not a whole lot you can do against it besides not landing.

**sirsolo** · 12-01-2009, 02:45 AM

/end thread from Celestial anyone? That makes sense to me, but if we're going to void that rule, then anything outside of main is free game? Time to mine the roads and sneak camp with long range tank fire.

**Startrekern** · 12-01-2009, 03:22 AM

Save me, Lord, that I may be relieved from the ever expanding mainbase, so that one day my children may be within 2km of the enemy base and still be within the rules.. :P

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