Re: Cheap or tactical?

**snooggums** · 10-09-2007, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by BigGaayAl

I guess we need some quotes from the rules.

"UCB Assaults
Players acting within their commander's authorization MAY attack structures (UAV Trailer, Radar Dish & Artillery) within the enemy UCB, vehicles within the UCB are OFF LIMITS. These attackers may also STAY in the opposition's UCB to make sure the destroyed structures STAY destroyed. It is the responsibility of the commander to determine if maintaining an assault on the enemy UCB is tactically viable and strategically advisable."

Now PR is still a bit outside these rules, and Seven Gates is special as it has NO/TWO ucb's.

The rule here does say you need the intention to destroy assets, but intention is always debatable. If you are staying on a main flag without attacking anyone, you will probably also destroy assets you see. In the end the rules say nothing about advancing to cap a flag in AAS, but you can reasonably infer that if you have a good reason to go to the flag, and you don't attack anyone, its not a problem.

"It is the responsibility of the attacker to not spawn camp while in the opposition UCB, for any reason or amount of time. The attacker may and should defend himself and his fellow soldiers from attack during his objective in the UCB, but at no point may he spawn camp, even if the only alternative is death and/or failing his UCB objective."

This says nothing about knife attacks. If you are in a ucb, and the enemy raises his gun to shoot you, you "may and should defend" yourself.

So if you see an enemy squad, and you don't want them to kill you, just leave them and hike out of that ucb. The second you engage them or repair stuff, it's open season.

Ps you ALWAYS require commander permission, but if he doesn't give orders to your squad, you have permission.

Although you are correct about the knifing (darn!) it is so vaguely worded: "The attacker may and should defend himself and his fellow soldiers from attack during his objective in the UCB" that this could mean firing before the other guy if he turns your direction. Honestly I would like to see a rule on PR myself that states that you may not fight back if in the enemy UCB, you can only run away, but I realize this is probably wishful thinking.

Your last sentence assumes that silence is the same as giving permission. If there is no commander for example there is no one to give permission, implied or otherwise.

**gerardnm** · 10-09-2007, 04:34 PM

Guys this is a very old discussion way back from the .4 .5 days. It was decided you CANNOT enter the UCB unless the flag is in play.

Same sort of thing used happen on the hills of hungyungtoy where guys "infiltrated" UCB to destroy spawn pt.

I think 7 gates should be removed from the rotation altogether.

**snooggums** · 10-10-2007, 08:37 AM

If you cannot enter the UCB at all then all the commander needs to do is build all of his bunkers and assets there, where they are safe from harm (you can already do this on maps with domes of death to an extent). I don't think that is good for team play either.

Since on Qwai the Chinese cannot recap the River Fort we should just play that map that you cannot enter the castle until River is taken. I know it is map specific, but it is a unique map.

**BostonBob** · 10-11-2007, 08:31 PM

The question is cheap or tactical,,,it s cheap move....We all know whats fair in this game....Game being key word here .. An i know a cheap move when i see it ..

BostonBob

**Nero** · 10-27-2007, 05:18 AM

Originally Posted by Betterdeadthanred

Yesterday I led an excellent group of guys in my "PR VETS" squad on 7 Gates upon game commencement we went around the far north border and into the basement at the temple. I ordered my squadmembers to hold fire and we barricaded ourselves into the basement to wait for the river fort to be captured.

Apparently the rest of the team didn't like it so much. I had seen several squads do this before on the server with no repercussions. So if this isn't good TG practice, I have led several squads before on the Ghost Train map to immediately take a boat to the tunnel flag, set up mines on the railroad tracks, and then hide inside the bunker while waiting for enemy APCs.

So, is this cheap or tactical?

Having just taken part in a rush to the Citadel on '7 gates', I feel really cheap especially when I tried to argue that it was a 'grey area' of the rules and we were keeping to the ROE. So, keeping to the TG pathos I've vowed to myself that I'll never participate in a rush (on any map) from now on even if it would increase my team's chances of winning... it just ruins the enjoyment for the other team too much.

**mingmong** · 10-28-2007, 05:51 PM

It's not a grey area at all. If you're not there to destroy enemy assets, you shouldn't be there.

**Sabre_Tooth_Tigger** · 10-28-2007, 05:58 PM

Camping the ucb to destroy assets is no good either imo. Do your bit and leave, imo

I actually like how they setup crysis for multiplayer. You cant invade the ucb because its surrounded by sentry guns, you have to invade the factory base, build enough heavy arms to destroy the sentry guns then you can invade their main base.

We dont have a map like that, where the tanks spawn at a base in the middle. Might play ok maybe

**ZaBoo** · 10-28-2007, 10:01 PM

Sorry to twist the topic here off of UCB attacking, but further along "Cheap or Tactical"...

What are all your opinions on "rushing" the opposing teams first flag? It seems more often than not on larger 6-7 flag maps one squad will always B-line it right to the enemies first flag in the quickest vehicle, with a bunch of requested kits, and will toss down a rally in effort to throw off the enemy. I have mixed thoughts on this as it is very effective, but does seem to go against the general concept of the other rules.

A prime example would be rushing an USMC HAT crew to the western hills on EJOD Desert. When done properly, they are easily able to kill both APC's and any other vehicles effectively whipping out most off the MEC support for 10 minutes. If this was done mid map while fighting for east/west city it would be frowned on.

I know it is nice to see variety in the combat instead of always meeting up in the same area, but honestly, this tactic seems to have gotten out control.

**snooggums** · 10-28-2007, 11:57 PM

I think it is great and should be used more often. The first flag or two should not just be an easy cap to end up with even numbers of flags on each side before fighting starts or we would just start off that way to begin with.

It is only very effective when the server is almost empty, but then rounds usually aren't that great until the server mostly fills up in my experience.

**Ghost Dog** · 10-29-2007, 04:17 AM

Originally Posted by ZaBoo

What are all your opinions on "rushing" the opposing teams first flag? It seems more often than not on larger 6-7 flag maps one squad will always B-line it right to the enemies first flag in the quickest vehicle, with a bunch of requested kits, and will toss down a rally in effort to throw off the enemy. I have mixed thoughts on this as it is very effective, but does seem to go against the general concept of the other rules.

I know it is nice to see variety in the combat instead of always meeting up in the same area, but honestly, this tactic seems to have gotten out control.

Although effective I 'm not in favour of it as it can ruin the gameplay of an entire map, especially on pub nights. Most maps weren't designed for this strategy and therefor I consider it unfair for one of either teams.

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